How much outside help do you get? Are my parents mean?

[Minkus]

DH and I both work, he full time outside the home me 4 days per week outside the home. I am main breadwinner and went back to work full time when DS was 9 months, dropped this to 34 hrs over 4 days though and he is now 2.10.

Our respective mums each occasionally babysit, say once each per month but nothing regular.

Whereas they help our sisters out a lot. My mum via baby sitting more frequently/ childcare in school holidays for lovely sis's/BIL's two, (mum and sis both work full time, mum only in term time though) and DH's mum by providing a lot of support to DH's sister and her husband and their two- childcare if SIL wants to go for haircut, picking eldest up from school occasionally, doing housework if SIL is feeling a bit low etc etc etc (SIL is SAHM).

I am ashamed to say it but I feel jealous. Nobody helps us. I don't even think its the fact that we don't get help, just that nobody seems to think we might find it hard work too sometimes, being a family, or ever says "gosh aren't you doing well managing it all on your own without breaking". (I don't really expect an award for coping with the lifestyle we have chosen, just a bit of recognition that there isn't a comparison to make, we don't "have it easy" and the others don't "have a hard time" as they're hardwork in their own ways.)

I'm starting to find it really difficult to be around my mum or MIL because MIL especially is always on about how hard SIL is finding it, being a mum and all. And my mum rarely offers words of encouragement even when she knows I'm struggling a bit. In fact mum lives 6 miles away and when ds was born, visited us in hospital and next contact was after a week. I always thought we were close.

Am I being petty? Something tells me I am but it's hard to ignore how I feel.

I don't think he 'misses' them although I know he doesn't like the situation but it became so bad that he chose to cut his ties with his parents to save his marriage - I didn't threaten him with a split - this has been bubbling away for many years - we've been together for 18 years and it was only 2yrs ago that we made this decision to have no more to do with them.

I made the decision to cut ties initially - I'd had enough of their stupid behaviour - they would do the oddest things and would call me names - cow, bitch, child etc etc and refer to me as dh's 'so called wife' so I said I would have no more to do with them but he could continue seeing them/ring them up if he chose to. He tried to but each time he spoke to them they would complain and moan and nag etc etc and he'd had enough too and for the sake of having a happy family (ie him, me and two dds) he cut his ties too.

My parents have always treated dh as their own son - in fact when Dad died my dh was so upset - he was as upset as anyone else in my family - but dh is very close to my Mum, which helps.

DH left home at 16yrs old - says it all really. The problems go back that far with him and his parents. DH was married before he met me and his ex couldn't cope with his parents either.

ssd and malo - I agree with you I feel very when I am at nursery and see GPs picking their GC up or when I'm down the park and see GPs enjoying spending time with their GC

I live an hour away from my Mum and Dad (divorced) and DP's Mum, DP's Mum has not seen the DDs since DD1's birthday in June, my Mum has not seen the DDs since beginning of August. MIL will only come up if SIL drives her as she doesn't do public transport, my Mum will also only come up if stepdad drives her.

They would ever offer to babysit as it would mean effort on their part, their idea of a visit is to sit on my sofa watch the DDs playing, get lunch and copius amounts of tea made for them, not lift a finger to help and leave (even when I was pregnant and SPD).

I have learned to accept it now and in return I am not visiting them anymore either I am not even phoning my Mum, if they want to see the DDs they can make all the effort. I know it's harsh but thats what it has come to.

I had all that spooky to a certain degree with my parents - when I had dd1 (9yrs ago) they didn't visit me in hospital until the day I was discharged (I was in for a week) and when I had my second dd (4yrs ago) they didn't visit at all. It was hard because everyone else in the ward had parents visiting. I had no-one other than dh.

I had a m/c in between my dds - I was only 10 weeks gone but it was a m/c all the same. I told my parents - I didn't hear from them at all. When dd1 had a really nasty dose of chicken pox I didn't hear from my parents - their attitude was 'no news is good news' and they wouldn't even come anywhere near my front door for fear of catching it themselves.

My Dad (now deceased) would pick the phone up if he knew one of us was ill or he'd just ring for a chat. My Mum has never done that - even now that she is on her own.

I've learnt to 'cope' on my own - I've never had the help so really don't know what I'm missing - probably a good thing actually!

malo - I so know what you mean I had a mc in August, I phoned my Mum to tell her in tears and she said "maybe it's for the best 3 children would be expensive" she also phoned after I had been to the hospital not knowing whether I had to have the op or not proceeded to tell me all about my brothers new house then when I told her what had happened (me mcing at home on hands and knees 2DDs to look after) said nothing, has never mentioned it or asked me about it since.

Also know what you mean re the hospital thing it does get to you when all around theres scores of relatives cooing over the baby and theres just you and DP/H. People would say we are lucky. I nearly had to be induced with DD2 we had planned a homebirth there was no one to look after DD1 so DP would have missed it, I cried for a week at the thought. My Mum came up 2 days after DD2 was born, sat and had tea and lunch made for her then moaned I hadn't made her bacon sandwiches to someone whom had had a baby less than 48 hours ago. She saw DD2 twice in 6 months.

I try to turn it into a positive on how not to parent.

Weird that...I may be telling Mum about something and the conversation always changes to something about my brother, what he's said, what he's doing etc etc....unfortunately Mum thinks the sun shines out of his backside.

When I had my m/c I don't think my parents really knew how to react. Mum just said 'it was natures way' and 'blessing in disguise' and all I wanted to do was cry, which I did plenty of, but not in front of her because I knew she'd not help - in fact whenever I've got upset in front of her, including when Dad died, it was always met with 'oh lets put the kettle on' not a hug or cuddle or anything.

You are so right about ensuring this all turns into how not to parent - I have said all along my kids will get all the help and support they need - unless they don't want it but it will be offered and I will always make sure I'm there for them no matter the circumstances.

she's lucky she didn't have me as a daughter, sweetkitty.

cuz i wouldnt have lifted a finger and if she moaned i'd have gestered towards the phone and told her to pick it up and phone herself a delivery.

or that she was perfectly free to walk out the door, go down to a caf, and pay someone to wait on her - just don't let it hit you on the way out.

i can't believe some of these 'parents'.

my parents live thousands of miles away because it was my choice to emigrate.

they clothe the girls entirely - we don't ask, they send - pay for private dental care, activities, bedding, etc.

and when they're here, we live it up! we hang out, cook together, play board and card games, go siteseeing, to the cinema, etc.

DH and i usually only end up going out once or twice because we enjoy spending time with them.

MALO, my dh is very close to my parents also. He has a great relationship with them. Sounds like you did everything you could to accomodate your dhs parents, and at least you tried.

I think that some parents have the attitude that once you are 16 then you are an adult and you can look after yourself. This is how dhs dad feels. In fact when mil died dh inherited a bit of money from an account she had that fil knew nothing about. I can guarantee we wouldnt have seen a penny of it if it had been down to him.

DH does defend his parents - everytime they come up in conversation - which isn't very often now considering we've not seen/spoken to them for so long (fortunately) but turn the clock back when we did have contact he would defend them all the way - and yet he didn't really know he was doing it. Then I would sit him down and talk to him about the way they've been with us - reminding him of what they've done and said over the years and then he'll back down and admit they are a complete nuisance and he'll often end up saying 'yes, you're right and I'm really truly sorry for their behaviour'.

It niggles me that I've had to go through the past years with him to make him see sense, iykwim - I get bored talking about them and tbh they don't get spoken about anymore which suits me just fine!

The last time he spoke to them was on the phone about a year ago - his Mum was drunk and he couldn't get her off the phone. He was embarrassed and ashamed and I could see he was very upset.

They've not bothered with our kids for the last 2yrs - they don't know our youngest dd and wouldn't recognise either of them now. It is a shame but it is THEIR loss.

They ought to be happy that their ds is happily married with a family of his own but they're not - its as if its a form of envy I think, on their part?

expat - it was more a kind of "I'm making DD1 some lunch do you want a sandwich" kind of thing expecting them to say no it's ok but they said yes which was ok but when I brought them through my mum said "oh I thought you meant bacon, it was only when I thought about it that I thought cheeky cow. Don't worry IF I have another baby I will make it very clear I only want people to visit the first week if they don't cause extra work.

As you say Malo it's their loss not knowing their lovely GC

spookykitty and malo, I think we're all the same person here!

my old mum is lovely but she's 80 now and not able to help, however she's still there (most of the time...)dad died when ds1 was a baby

dh's mum is an old bag, never has time for dh or the kids(only grandkids too), recently his brother got married, he got a cheque for £1000, when we got married we got a gift voucher for M&S for £20. You think I'm joking, I'm not. You couldn't make it up.

I don't mean to sound horrible, but knowing we are all the same makes it a bit easier, most of my friends have help from accomodating families, we always feel like the odd ones out. Knowing there are actually other out there like us makes me feel somehow less isolated.

Thanks for sharing your stories, I wish you were all nearby, I'd bloody babysit for you, we could start a circle!

ssd x x x

ssd: You're not on your own on this one. My life has always been like this. Yes I feel very hard done by....its not as if I'm horrible to everyone so to scare them away! Whenever anyone has helped me out with the kids I've always been grateful and even buy the odd bunch of flowers to say thank you!...and I always offer to help those that have helped me.

Families can be a pain in the arse though. Like I've said before we have nothing to do with dh's family - not just his parents but the whole family. It's just easier that way - no arguments between me and dh and a much happier life for our children. They don't know what they're missing not seeing their Grandparents - my youngest dd has only met them the once and she was a babe in arms. My elder dd has forgotten.

In answer to your message to me last night - ie am I insanely jealous of those who have the help from family and friends? Yes, I am jealous but not insanely - life is too short to get so wound up over it - I've never had the help and I've learnt to cope with dh's help and that suits me fine especially when I look at what I've got and can be proud to say dh and I aren't doing a bad job bringing them up!!!! xx

I just hate being constantly skint and feel guilty about my parents helping us out so much. I feel that they should be paying off their mortgage and saving for their retirement, but they have used all their savings to help us out. I know that they do it because they want to make sure the grandchildren are ok, but it does make you feel a bit crap when you can't pay the rent some months. We rent a house off my parents, and they have just bought another house around the corner. They will still be paying off their mortgage when they are 75!!!! It really has been a case of if they didn't help us we would be screwed. I am doing something about it though, so when the kids are older I can go back to work and bring some more money in. It's just while the kids are so little that things are a bit of a struggle. I don't think anyone deserves to have to do everything on their own.

We're in a permanently skint situation too - I work part-time cash in hand - I have a pot that sits on my kitchen window sill and in there goes my earnings and that is all I have to use for grocery shopping.....my dh earns a good wage but it covers all our other outgoings - mortgage/utility/running of car etc etc.

My parents have helped us in the past but we have always had to pay them back. The day before my Dad died he gave me a cheque for £2000 because we were so heavily overdrawn. I told him we would pay it back - he told me not to worry about it and pay it as and when you can afford to - I think he knew he was dying - the following day he died of a heart attack. We had no idea he was due to meet his demise, had I known I would not have borrowed that money. We took out a loan to pay that money back in order to help pay for his funeral.

We are always short of money and until such time as I can get my youngest into school (Sept 08) we are always going to struggle and then I will go and get a 'normal' job and get back into earning a good wage.

We don't get much help from grandparents but my SIL is a godsend. She lives just down the road and we share our children most of the time. We get on really well and we have dn overnight at least once a week and my dcs stay with her whenever they like. I would be lost without her tbh.

I sent her some flowers the other week to show my apprieciation .

malo, good post. your right, life is too short. its just I have a small group of friends who all have family help and I'm sick of seeing their mum/MIL at the school gates or taking the kids away for the day or having them overnight. one of my friends said "its always been just me and dh, we've never had outside help to rely on" and at the same time her mums their at the gates 5 days a week. sorry to sound bitter, I think its because again most of my friends who gave up work to look after the kids are now re-training, working part time or full time now the kids are all in school, and I'm waitressing which I hate cos its the only thing I can find which lets me be at the school gates and have school hols off, whilst my friends have their mum/mil there at the gates or during the school hols and so can do what they choose instead of having to settle for something they hate but suits the school hours and holidays.

rant rant!

just ignore me and I'll go away!

Hi, Minkus. Only read OP, But I get jealous of others that get plenty of help too!. My mother was very nervous of babies, but when DS and DD1 reached 4&2 she got more confident and minded them for a couple of mornings each week so I could do shopping or get my hair done. Then she was diagnosed with cancer and died (she was only 58, cruelly my father was diagnosed at the same time and died 4 weeks before her).
My MIL is great. But I would never abuse her generosity.
However, I hear of couples that go on holidays without their children for a weekend or a full week, leaving them with parents. I would never have put my parents or MIL through that, but I still get jealous .
This might shock you, but when DS was 3 and DD1 aged 1, I got a horrible dose of flu that lasted 3 weeks. My joints were aching, I was weak and couldn't eat yet I had to get up at 7 every morning and look after kids as normal including watching every move DD1 was making as she was at the reckless, climbing stage. I got no help. At that time, I read of a mother whose toddler was taken into care for 2 weeks after she held a party at her apartment and her son was found wandering the streets with a beer bottle in his hand the following morning(all partygoers fast asleep and door left unlocked!). But I was so jealous of her because she was free of her son for 2 weeks!!!! I still amaze myself thinking about it!

Nailpolish, I agree with you, working parents are well able to pay an outside babysitter.
Foxinsocks, are you sure your friends get all their childcare for free? My MIL minds DS and DD1 after school and we pay her the going rate. We would never dream of expecting her to do it for free. And she will do the odd stint of babysitting (which we pay her for too despite her objections) but DD2 is 11 months old and too attached to me at the moment, so screams if she wakes up and I'm not there, so I won't put MIL through that.

No day to day help at all (but both sets of parents live over 100 miles away so not expected).

My parents are great in school hols and will come and stay with us for a week or so to look after ds.

It's a bit long to read so will just say our situation. We have no help at all from either of our sets of parents, apart from a few days help from mine when DS was born. I have found that if you accept that they have done their bit of child raising and now it's your turn, you aren't left disappointed.

But my brother hasn't any children so there is no one to compare against and by all accounts my MIL was rubbish with all 4 sets of grandchildren so no disparity there either.

there seems to be so many of us and I thought there would be hardly any!

at least we all know that we'll support our kids when they have kids better than the support we have got ourselves

i have NO help from any outside sources, apart from when they go to nursery/pre-school. my parents live 3 mins away, but they say they are too young to be doing kids again (i was a teen mum). So, we do it ourselves! And im proud i do-at least when i get to the pearly gates i can say i did it myself!

Whilst I sympathise and agree with you that you should be treat the same as your sibling(s) I think you are lucky to get a babysitter twice a month(is that right,think you said they each sit once a month?) some don't even get that.
My parents are no longer alive and my Il's are frankly a useless waste of space(sorry,really on my high horse about this now as DD has been very poorly in hospital all week and none of the family has bothered their backsides to visit her in hospital)
Agree with others,maybe you need to ask more,maybe you come across as 'coping' better than your siblings although I hate to hear of grandkids not being treat equally.