I feel like having a second child has ruined our family

[cowardly]

I'm really sorry, I've name changed because I'm a coward and I didn't want this to be linked to my usual NN.

My second DD is 8mo and today everything has finally gotten too much to the point where now I think I'm finally admitting I need help.

This post will probably be so rambling and hard to follow, I'm sorry, I just need to get it all out even if no one replies.

From the day she was born I've not been away from her for longer than 4 hours because she's BF and absolutely refuses to take a bottle (we have tried countless times, with countless bottles, breast milk, formula etc etc) She is very clingy towards me, for example the other day I met up with a relative who offered to hold DD while I ordered a coffee, only she screamed so much because I wasn't holding her that I had to go back and get her, and she instantly shut up. The only other person she is happy with is DP, but sometimes even then she will scream if I'm not the one holding her.

We're having an awful time with teething, colds, she doesn't like to nap unless she is at home in our bed so going out is a nightmare because she resists falling asleep in the pram. She only goes 1.5 hours between naps, any longer than that and she is miserable. So most of the time between school runs I am at home because it's just easier.

For the past month there's been multiple occasions where I just lose it and cry, me and DP have heart to hearts and I tell him I'm not happy and not coping. The next day we go back to normal and the cycle starts all over again. He doesn't get to go out much (except for work) but when he does go out with his friends it's like a kick in the teeth. I spend most of my days alone looking after the children, I only have 1 close friend who has her own young baby and another on the way, I couldn't burden her with this. I don't have anyone else I can confide in. I'm too ashamed to admit that I need help. DP is the golden boy in his family, I feel like I can't admit that I'm failing because I need to be just as good as he is. Everyone is always saying what a good dad he is, I never hear that I'm a good mum.

I'm trying to keep on top of the housework, declutter, do household admin, organise Christmas and it feels like no one is helping. DP does a lot of the cooking but is by nature quite messy, like me, I'm trying not to be. He just doesn't see what needs doing and isn't bothered by the mess, whereas I am. I never used to be particularly house proud, it's only started since second DD came along, so I'm trying to juggle everything and setting myself impossible standards that i can never reach.

I can't cope anymore. My 5yo is so used to hearing my cry and yell at her sister to be quiet and sleep, she is going to grow up remembering me shout, just like I remembered my mum doing to us.

My mum walked out on us, she had a breakdown and had undiagnosed mental health issues. To a 13 year old girl it felt like she just got tired of being my mum and a wife and left it all to start a new life. I promised myself I would never be like her, but here I am wanting to just leave everything behind and start a new life. I love my DP so much but I've considered splitting up with him just so I can have a break from my children and the endless cycle of parenting and housework. At least then I'd have time to be truly alone.

Today I lost it (again!) and called DP up at work crying and struggling to breath properly, because I'd had an hour and a half of constant screaming from DD when I tried to put her down for a nap. She is still breastfed to sleep (we have tried stopping this but DD will get hysterical if she isn't fed to sleep) and I had spent so long ignoring my other child trying to get her to sleep and just lost it when she cried because I took my boob away from her. I swore at her and left her and locked myself in the bathroom to cry.

In that moment I felt like I hated her, I couldn't even look at her when I put her down for the night. I just feel resentment towards her. Me and DP both admitted tonight that we feel like we made a mistake, we fight so much more and we're not happy like we used to be. I just want it to go back to how it was when it was just the 3 of us.

I love my baby so much, but I don't feel like I like her. I don't enjoy being with her anymore, she deserves so much more than me.

I'm sorry this is so jumbled up, I just needed to say it to someone, for maybe someone to tell me that it will be ok? I'm scared I might have PND, I suffered with anxiety when I was pregnant with her, I feel like I'd be admitting defeat if I went to a doctor. I just don't know what else to do. I want to be happy again, but right now I feel like I'm drowning 

Id see the Gp or HV but I definitely agree you might just be at breaking point from all stress and tiredness, a lot of people would feel the same in the situation- having a clingy, screamy baby can be hell.

Could you afford a cleaner? It might help you feel so much better with keeping on top of the housework.
Also have you tried the organised mum method? Sounds silly but it’s been a game changer for me when in a similar situation to you and I feel a lot less stressed and on top of housework and organisation

Have you tried a variety of bottles for DD or looked up advice on how to get her to take to a bottle? I felt 100x once my dc had the option of a bottle. 8 months is a long time for you to never be able to have any kind of time to yourself

You need well-structured help. Time away from each child, and time away from both children. Talk to the GP, the HV, your husband, anyone who could possibly help. Say the situation is desperate and that the relationship between you and DC2 is being badly affected.

My mother was in your position. I was the second child who spoilt everything, I was the one regularly told that it would have been better for everyone if I'd died at birth (I was very premature). 42 years later the relationship is still awful and I have spent nearly all my life dipping in and out of depression and being suicidal because growing up as that child that spoiled everything by being born is frankly not a lot of fun.

I send you my sympathy. Mine were closer in age but I have vivid memories of trudging round a park in the rain with both of them in a double buggy screaming their heads off feeling like the worse mother in the world. The house was a tip and it felt like everything was spiralling out of control.

I totally get the feeling of just longing for an hour or so on your own to get a grip on something other than just holding a crying baby.

I agree re seeing GP/ HV. You might also try Homestart or maybe your HV could refer you to them.

Something that helped me was getting DP to look after them both for a couple of hours every Saturday morning. It meant that there was a definite time when I could do some jobs around the house that just weren't possible with DD stuck on my boobs. It did involve some crying but a couple of hours without you is not going to ruin her life and could certainly help to save your sanity.

Yep. That's Post natal depression. I've been there. Went on tablets. Saved my relationship with my child. It wasn't overnight but it did work.

You have to go to your GP and say "I need to be assessed for post natal depression please"

Also, if DD1 is 5, presumably she is in school? Could DD2 go to nursery some days a week to give you some time to regain sanity? She will cope fine - children do. You will be far better placed to be her mum with a bit of headspace.

Sorry if my previous post made things worse. I really feel for you. I stuck at one child because I just couldn't face the thought of two (my one is a non-sleeper, screamer and boobmonster, and after two years of that I'm nearly mentally obliterated).

If she's hungry she'll take a bottle. But you need to be well away from there, and your dp (or other heroic helper) needs to persevere without calling you back because it's too hard and only you will do. It's hell but only took us a week. Compared to the endless sheer bloody hell of what you're going through. I should have done it sooner because I ended up with pnd. Caused by the exhaustion and sleep deprivation and the feeling that it was never going to end, and not having even ten minutes just to be by myself, at any time, ever. Get help, do it first thing tomorrow, it's not a failure, it's not your fault. Many years later, I suspect my DH still doesn't really comprehend what I went through.
Oh, and sod the housework. Let someone else sort that out.

Sorry you're feeling off kilter, lots of mums feel this way. I'd get myself off to the gp and offload all of this.

You have a 5 yo, your baby won't be like this forever. It will get easier. 💐💐💐

I'm sorry you're having a hard time. I remember that stage very well. My house was a constant mess and DC2 would not be put down.

Could you try a sling? That way she would be happy to be close to you and you have your hands free to get on with things.

Agree with a previous post where you need to send DH and older DD out for a few hours. Don't do anything just look after yourself. DD2 will be fine. A few small breaks of a few hours will make a huge difference.

Also let the house be a mess. Your sanity is more important and it won't always be like this. Delegate Christmas plans as much as possible. Be kind to yourself.

Hang in there OP, it will get better, you're a great mum x

What does your partner actually do to help you when you tell him how you’re feeling?

I had very clingy baby, OP. But she was at a nursery from eight to two, Monday to Friday, so that helped. She also wanted wanted to be breastfed to sleep and it was getting very difficult. So then my mother came to stay and between the two of us we took turns rocking her in our arms and singing her to sleep for three days until she got used to sleeping with the breast.

I think you are setting yourself too high a standard for being a mother. This will pass very quickly. My dd's clinginess disappeared by the time she was a year old and she loved her nursery.

The velcrow baby is real! Ànd hard but it will pass. I agree with pp you need to tell your gp or hv who can support you more than an online forum. It does get easier and your thoughts are normal when life feels this hard.

I wondered if you've tried a sling, it's a life saver for when they want to be near you/on you constantly. You can get out and about will they are calm and relaxed.

I haven't ever had PND, but your post resonated with me as I too have had a clingy, difficult baby and understand just how much this can wear you down and it can feel absolutely suffocating. I became a slave to her routine, had so little time to do anything else and had literally no alone time whatsoever. It is absolutely normal to struggle under these circumstances and you are doing so well to just get through each day.

Obviously speak to the GP/HV to see if they can help, but also reach out to your family for more support. You don't have to explain just how desperate you feel if you don't want to, simply say that you're struggling a bit and would really appreciate a bit of a hand with the baby. Your partner should also be doing the lion's share of the childcare at the weekend to provide you with that rest bite that you need. Maybe he could take the baby out to the park and you could stay at home and crack on with the household jobs you struggle to get done during the week? I know that's not a relaxing break but I found that any time away from the baby helped and getting those chores done allowed me to feel on top of things. I also agree with those who have mentioned trying a sling, as that could enable you to get out of the house a bit more and feel less isolated.

Finally a bit of reassurance that this stage does eventually pass. I found my clingy baby became less demanding after a year because she naturally needed less naps and just seemed to gain a bit more resilience. There were obviously a few setbacks where seperation anxiety would peak or illness would strike, but honestly by 18 months she was much easier and was similar to all the other toddlers her age. Hang in there, I'm sure you can make it to the other side!

Oh my lovely I wish I could give you a cuddle.

My 2nd was also very tough and bf. Sleep deprivation is used as a torture method for a reason!

Please print this out, speak to your gp and your dp.

I'm sorry you are feeling like this. It really will get better (promise!).

I think you need to forget about bottles and go straight to a cup. Go out and do something for yourself and leave her with a cup, formula and food and tell your partner or whoever is taking care of the baby to just deal with it, seriously. She won't starve. Switch your phone OFF and be uncontactable for a while. At 8mo you are at the point where it's usual to start the process of winding down breastfeeding and get the baby onto increasing amounts of solid food. She's not a newborn, so be harsh, for your sake and for hers!

I would also suggest getting a sleep consultant in to take you through the process of sleep training and particularly getting her off the night feeds (I am assuming she is keeping you up at night as well?) and feeding to sleep. It's clear this is not working for you and is making you feel trapped. Sleep training does not work for absolutely everyone but it does work for the majority of babies.

You have needed help for a while, admitting it is the first step to things getting better.

Lots of good advice on here.

It will get better.

Oh lovely. You are in NO WAY a bad mother. Not even slightly. A bad mother would have smacked her screaming baby, not sensibly walked away from her.

What @PyongyangKipperbang said:
Tbh I am not sure that PND causes this so much as having a hard work baby causes PND, I am certain it did for me.
has so much truth. I have only one, but until she was 14mo I was sure I had made a terrible mistake and was an awful mum. She wouldn't even bf, but she was fucking impossible.

Now she's older (and much easier), others have said that they watched me struggle and wanted to help, and felt I had a rough deal, but didn't know how to offer. DD NEVER let me have food or a coffee in peace. She never once fell asleep by herself. I had atrocious PND. I dreaded naps and dreaded wake ups even more. I was on edge and felt she was controlling me.

I promise you will get through this. Please see your GP. Please give yourself a massive hug and a huge high five for coping this well so far. Please know we are all here cheering you on.

I'm going to go against the grain here and say it doesn't sound as much like pnd as just having a useless partner. By all means see your gp and make sure you're getting help for any pnd. It may help you cope better, but it's not going to give you a few hours break or clean the house - things he should be doing.

Thank you all so much for your kind words of advice. I was hoping today would be a better day but DD is already miserable. She wasn't happy on her playmat, or her jumparoo, so I picked her up to play with her. She didn't want her toy, didn't want me to sing the song that usually makes her happy, she kept straightening her body and wriggling so DP had to take her even though he was ironing his shirt so I could finish my coffee. She's crying in her cot now  My HV drop in sessions are today so I'm going to go and tell her how I'm feeling.

In regards to DD's sleep, she seems to have turned a corner recently and sleeps from 7pm (dreamfeed at 10pm or 11pm) and then usually sleeps through until 5:30 and DP will always get up with her and give her breakfast. Occasionally she'll wake up once during the night, but I can't really complain about nights anymore (she used to wake up 3+ times a night)

DP tries really hard to give me time away from both DDs, it's my own stubbornness that says no (I know that makes no sense)
He's suggested a lot about me staying overnight at my mums so I can sleep and he will deal with DD and try and get her to take a bottle. I'm always the one refusing because I know she'll scream and scream and I feel so incredibly guilty knowing that she'll be crying and wanting me.
He also constantly tries to encourage me to go out, but I'm not like him with a huge group of friends who all want to meet up, I don't have a close circle of friends I can call upon, just the one best friend who doesn't live close by and has her own life happening.

The baby is already taking 3 meals a day (she loves food!) so her feeding has reduced, but we still need to break the feeding to sleep association as I spend a lot of time lying down in a dark room with her feeding her to sleep, bored out my mind, when I could be spending time with my older DD.

We also do have a sling which DD loves, but I can't carry her in it for more than 5 minutes because I get really bad back pain (something that started in pregnancy, I couldn't walk very well and had to get physio. If DD napped in the pram life would be so much easier, seems she takes after her sister and she would NEVER nap in the pram unless she was exhausted.

God sorry this is turning into a pity party for one! I will go to see my HV today, I'll take the first step. I just want to be a happy mum again.

To carry on with the sling discussion - what kind of sling do you have? Some styles can cause extreme pain, and perhaps if you were to back carry it would be less painfull but she would still sleep? I know if I don't exercise regularly than I feel awful (suicidal) so I can imagine how bad you feel stuck inside all the time.

Your dp sounds supportive which is good. I agree with him, you and your oldest should go to your mums for a night and let him deal with the baby, she will scream but she will be with someone who loves her and cares for her. If that’s too long for you to deal with right now, why don’t you and dd1 go out for lunch at a local cafe and leave dd2 with your dp. It will give you some nice time with your oldest and your dp and dd2 time to get to know one another.

You’ve done the hardest thing already, admitting to yourself you’re not coping, well done. Now you need to let people help you. I remember feeling like that with dd1, I was devastated, I should have been super mum and been able to do it all but you know what, I wasn’t and I’m still not. Doesn’t mean I’m not a good mum.

Be kind to yourself and let your dp do something. It will get better and easier

Beebaby I have the I-angel hipseat carrier (although I haven't used the hip seat part yet)

www.argos.co.uk/product/4136451

I did use a wrap sling but didn't get on with it, DD loves the sling we have but it's me that struggles with it. It's very hard to put on if you're by yourself and when it's on the straps are so tight I can't adjust it to see if that helps with the back pain. DD isn't a particularly heavy baby either.

I have actually considered joining a gym, it would be something to do by myself (I am hugely overweight and haven't been in a gym since before my first DD was born!) but we're trying to save as much money as we can for a deposit, neither of us are in fantastically paid jobs.

Thanos he really is, he's not perfect but he tries so hard to make me happy, I know he's getting upset that I keep refusing to leave DD with him, he says he'll deal with the crying but I still feel guilty.

I would love a few hours to do something just me and DD(5) or a few hours to myself, but our weekends go so quickly I feel selfish if we don't spend all that time together as a family

Well you need to stop feeling guilty and selfish. You have hundreds of weekends to enjoy as a family. You need to let your dp do this. For you, him and the children.

I remember suggesting the cafe idea to a friend years ago and it really helped her and her dh. Whenever she was around, baby always wanted her, dh started to feel pushed out or he was always doing everything wrong. He needed to find his own way.

You only need to go out for a couple of hours to begin with, not the full weekend. Just go out for a coffee if that’s all you’re comfortable to being with but let your dp take some of the pressure of you

Thank you Thanos, I will make sure this weekend that I go out by myself. I have a book on the side that I started a month ago that I'm only one chapter in to. I'll take it with me and try and switch off.

Well done

And the absolute most important thing you need to do is communicate with your dp about how you’re feeling and listen to him.

Enjoy your coffee!