Lets talk controlled crying. Love to hear your thoughts!

[Chelseamum]

I am product of controlled crying. I think I am a pretty balanced individual that loves sleeping. I just sleep like a log since I can remember... never had any probs sleeping.... well when I was pregnant I given the extra weight it was a bit umcomfortable but never had any major issues.

In order to help my baby to rest properly I started a routine with her at 4 months that involved controlled crying in the evenings. Since then she has slept like an angel. She is an amazing happy child. She is 11 months and sleeps 11 hours every night from 8pm till 7am plus two hours am and pm.

I get very frustated everytime I read in mumsnet arguments againsts it as I have a very good example of controlled crying and a happy baby.

Please share your experiences with me I am very interested!

Do they?

Mine didn't sit there wimpering and feeling bereft. He went to sleep. And so did I.

And, I can assure you, his spirit remains defiantly unbroken.

And I still comforted him when he cried. I didn't stop with the cuddles round the clock!

Sorry Foxybrown that was supposed to

There's lots of misconceptions surrounding its use I think. Its not about getting a 6 week old to sleep through the night.Its not a tool to be used night after night, week in, week out. The way its discussed is that it is perceived as an ongoing thing. IME the first night was pretty hard going for me, yes, but the second is easier and by the third it was pretty much cracked and I never looked back. Of course the child is nourished, loved and clean when it goes into its bed, and the process is constantly monitored. It knows it is loved because it has all day being loved. Its not neglecting the child, but helping it to go to sleep on its own, which IMO is pretty important.

I too hated it when on occasion they fall asleep crying from exhaustion. But I hated it when I did it too.

The thing I hate the most it that people claim they are doing CC for the childs sake.

I was never left to cry but learnt to fall asleep on my own and I don't understand why some people think their kids won't learn this without leaving them all on their own to cry and cry..

I read some book where they claimed the stress levels of being left to cry were similar to being lost in the woods.

I DO inderstand that we all get tired and we need some time alone with our DPs, but I just think there are so many other ways to achieve this

Oh, well if you did it.

And if you read it in a book somewhere...

Archiesmums I don't know what you are trying to prove, but it doesn't look like you have read anyones posts and even bothered to actually find out what CC is about.
CC is not about leaving babies crying on their own. It has been explained over and over in this thread but you keep repeating this silly fallacy.
I have never yet seen a person claim they are doing if for the babies benefit, most people are in a desperate state from a lack of sleep and surely a baby is far more happier if its parent isn't stressed out from lack of sleep.
I was very forturnate that my 2 babies slept through from 3 months and only cried at night if they were ill, that wasn't because they learnt no one came, they were just good sleepers and in the case of my daughter one of the most contended babies you could find.

christy I have read the post and I do understand CC, but you can't deny that it is still "leaving them to cry" weather or not you go in and comfort them after so or so many minutes.
They don't understand that there is method to the madness.

And if you had read my first post I did say that I know it works.

What annoys me is comments like "Its not neglecting the child, but helping it to go to sleep on its own, which IMO is pretty important".
I Wish people would just say "I can't cope so I'm just gonna ignore my child until he goes to sleep on his own"

Archiesmum you are doing it again. Nobody has said they are going to ignore their babies!!!!!!!!!!!

archiesmummy. I think you are being extremely narrow minded and I find your posts quite offensive.

First you claim CC is akin to 'child abuse' (my dsis works for the Child Protection Unit in the police so I can tell you a few home truths about what constitutes 'child abuse' if you like but it wouldn't be pleasant reading).

Then in your most recent post:
Wish people would just say "I can't cope so I'm just gonna ignore my child until he goes to sleep on his own"

CC is not about people 'not coping'. I can cope but my DS is SO much happier when he has slept through the night. Equally, so am I. He doesn't have abandonment issues but actually appears a hell of a lot happier after a good nights sleep and I am a better mother because I am not exhausted and snappy. CC is not about 'ignoring' your child to cry (I think you will find that method is call Cry It Out). Most parents end up sat outside the room countint the minutes until you go in again. Show me a mother that can just 'ignore' her child whilst doing CC. You are going in and offering reassurance that you are there, they are loved but they need to learn to sleep on their own.

You ignore totally what people have said previously and still spout your own opinion. I'm not saying we should all agree whether or not CC is right/wrong but you should think about what you write before you post as you are just plain ignorant.

Actually when I tried to do it, it was for sake of dd. She had always been an excellent sleeper until her blip.

During her blip she was exhausted, pale face, crying all time, falling asleep over her dinner, and just crying and crying all the time. She didnt know what was wrong with her, but was really unhappy. Her naps were also shot to hell.

So I DID do it for dd as she was totally miserable. She was completely contented after that.

Archiesmum - I'm not an advocate of CC as such, but what would you do instead? Sometimes a baby is crying because all they need is sleep, and they need to be left alone for a while to get to sleep. I know with my DS, there are times when going in to him and cuddling him is the absolute worst thing to do because it makes the crying escalate to the verge of hysteria. It's a judgment call every time. Similarly, there are times when we bring him downstairs and cuddle him to sleep in the hope that we can put him down without him waking up and starting the cycle again. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. It's all a massive learning curve and everyone learns what is right for their baby.

I do realise you will never be converted, but I DO still think it is very cruel and that it goes against everything that is natural for a mother (to protect her baby)..

And I do realise there is a difference between Cry it out and CC but to me is marginal because the basis is the same, to mould your LOs to fit into your lifestyle.

No doubt a happier mummy makes a better parent, but I just think there are better ways going about getting LOs to sleep..

Anyway off to get some shut eye myself now

I am genuinely interested though in what you do instead? Do you really never leave your LO to cry for a while? Ever?

Have never done CC with either child. With DS stayed with him till he was about 18 months old at which point decided it was getting ridiculous, told him I was just going to be next door to my bedroom to work for a bit and would come back in if he needed me and he went to sleep.

However, there was quite alot of crying in all the months of comforting to sleep, and I am not really convinced that over all there was less crying than there would have been if we had done some form of sleep training earlier.

With DD we are doing GW. I think the key thing is timing - putting to bed at a time when they are ready to go to sleep.

I also think that if the choice is between sleep training at night and mummy being bad tempered and unfair during the day, sleep training at night is better, if you can get the timing right and crying is only about 10 minutes. There is a difference between a baby crying/fussing because they are tired (which should not last for very long) and a baby crying for other reasons.

I think that the alternative to something like CC is getting to know your child well enough to realise there patterns over weeks/months not days in the way they sleep. If a child really doesn't want to go to bed surely there is usually a good reason. Wanting attention is not a bad thing in my opinion, just human nature. I clearly remember being sent to bed by my parents and wishing I could be involved in all the things that were going on downstairs.

I have realised my daughter goes in cycles of needing more sleep has a growth spurt and eats nothing and is generally grumpy, then after a week or so she changes and doesn't sleep much and eats loads and is really happy. Then some of the time is half way between these two extremes.

That is just the way she is. She is also much happier being involved in family life in the evening and going to bed when she is ready. I value her as part of the family in the evenings and she gets involved in all sorts of things then that she wouldn't do if she was taken to bed precisely at 7pm every night and not allowed back out of her room. It has also meant I have the freedom to take her out in the evening particularly if we go to festivals or camping or anything like that.

I have found it less stressful and consequently much less tiring to not worry about these things. I know some people find it liberating to have their children in bed early and have time on their own in the evenings but I don't particularly. This time we have with our babies is so fleeting that we have to make the most of it for their sake more than anything. Maybe thinking of other ways to make a child sleepy are more effective-things you can both enjoy: Reading, massage, warm bath, warm drink, calm and quiet, and then if they really aren't tired how about some physical or mental activity to keep them occupied until they are tired - a run around the garden seems to work for us, or loading the washing machine, helping with the washing up if they are old enough- Just getting involved.

Maybe we should have a new thread with positive ideas rather than negatives - practical alternatives to CC rather than negative attacks as it doesn't seem to change views, just make people feel bad. Those of us who don't practice CC obviously survive and live normal lives, those who do CC obviously made a decision to do so at some point but if there was more advice on alternatives then would they have?

That's great. I'm glad that worked for you. But you are still labouring under the delusion that people use this technique because they don't want to be around their children, or they somehow don't understand them

Knowing my child pretty well, staying up late at night did not work for him. He was exhausted. He was miserable. He needed to go to sleep. After three or four days, there was no crying. He went to bed, went to sleep and woke up in the morning.

And I could take him out too, bacuse once he worked out that he could, he would fall asleep anywhere. Still can.

I have a theory. Its not based on science - just experience and observation: Children are either generally good sleepers or they aren't. It doesn't much matter what methods or techniques you employ.

Dd was a good sleeper. Did nothing with her, apart form put her to bed.

Ds was a good sleeper, but had problems going to sleep. Once he was asleep it was fine (well, by 18 months, which is when we did this, not up 'til then).

For us, it was about allowing himself to go to sleep.

We never did CC in the middle of the night.

Well, quite frankly my son has to fit into my lifestyle to some extent otherwise I wouldn't be able to work and earn the money I need to pay for his house and food. Sorry, this is real life here. In real life any child will need to learn how to fit into a routine that wasn't necessarily designed around his express needs. Such as school, for example.

I make absolutely no apologies for encouraging my child to sleep through the night. It's good for him and it's good for me and it's good for our family. My DS has had a bedtime since he was two months old. He slept through the night at six months. We have never had to leave him longer than five minutes and hopefully now we will never have to.

I know my child inside out simply because I have worked so hard at helping him to sleep. I know the kind of noise he makes when he's woken up and is just snuffling around a bit settling himself. I know the kind of noise he makes when he's mildly cross because he wants to play for longer rather than sleep. I know the kind of noise he makes when something is genuinly wrong and in that case I'm in there within ten seconds. I know him better than anyone else alive and I defy anyone to justify calling CC 'child abuse' after meeting my glorious, happy, intelligent, loving boy.

Shame on you archiesmummy. You insult all us mums who are just doing what we think is best for our children and - yes - for ourselves - did you ever stop and think why, in aeroplanes, they tell you to put the oxygen mask on yourself before you put it on your child? It's not easy to look after a child properly when you're suffering from PND exacerbated by sleep deprivation, I can testify to that.

And you insult all victims of real child abuse, everywhere, by your throwaway use of the term.

I think the idea of a positive alternative to CC thread is great, by the way, lailasmum. As you point out, other methods having suited you very well. All our kids are different, all our families are different and we all want to do what we think is right.

Ok A new thread it is. I will start one and would love for people to contribute their ideas and methods. Obviously CC is an emotive subject as are so many thing that relate to parenting but I guess when it comes down to it we all want the same things, a happy healthy child, and having more ideas to use and fall back on strengthens all of us rather than criticism which just weakens the individual. You can choose whether or not you want to put them into action depending upon your own viewpoint and lifestyle but its all food for thought.

I have started a new thread here

Very very well said Krang

Ditto the well said Krang.