Nearly 3yo snoring

[beela]

DS (2.11) has never been the best of sleepers, and has always been quite a heavy breather. He's had tonsilitis in the past and the dr said that he has particularly large tonsils.

His snoring has got worse over the past month to the extent that he now sounds as though he is struggling to get air in through his nose (not too bad when he breathes through his mouth).

Last night we could hear him from downstairs, I went up to turn him onto his side and he already was! He woke up 6 times in the night as well, despite being shattered when he went to bed. It's usually once or twice, 6 is exceptional, so I am worried that his breathing is waking him.

I've recorded him on my phone and will ring for a drs appt when they open this morning, but wondered if anyone else had experience of this?

This sounds like obstructive sleep apnoea. Fairly common in children, tends to be caused by big tonsils, and adenoids blocking the nose. Child falls asleep, muscles relax, airway closes as is too tight from tonsils etc, snoring, then breathing may stop for brief moment, child struggles to breathe and wakes up. Back to sleep and all begins again.

The interruption to sleep affects behaviour, mood, eating and of course usually they get v tired. Long term it can cause other problems if untreated.

Ask your gp for advice and maybe for an urgent (weeks not months) ENT referral. He almost certainly needs his tonsils and adenoids out. Many people notice a huge, almost immediate improvement.

Thanks for your reply.

I have wondered about sleep apnoea in the past, but didn't think it was bad enough to count as that, but over the past few weeks his breathing/snoring really has changed. There has definitely been a marked deterioration in behaviour as well, and I guessed that it was because he isn't getting the quality of sleep that he needs.

Can a child this young have his tonsils out do you know? When I spoke to the gp before he said they would usually wait until they were 6 or 7 yo (altho that was re. tonsilitis, not sleep apnoea).

I'd visit docs

Yes children can get the tonsils and adenoids out that young. MY DS got his adenoids out a few months ago, he was just turned five. But I found out that they carry out the procedures on younger children if they have a high need for it.

Yes. I'm an anaesthetist and we regularly do adenotonsillectomies for children over 2. And before that if it's for osa. I'd strongly request referral personally.
ENT may want to do overnight monitoring first, but that's non-invasive and easy. But i suspect with that history he'd just be listed.

Thank you all

I feel prepared for our visit to the gp now

My 3.5yo dnephew has just had this operation. My DS took him to the specialist and he had the op about 3 weeks later.

He was a vvvv bad snorer and tonsils were causing v bad problems. Since the op he's been a different child. Although he really didn't like the operation, but he's over it now (2 months on).

you could have written this about my DD (2.10) - she snores something rotten, its so loud its unbelievable, i also recorded it. she's had tonsillitis 5 times in 6 months, dribbles so bad i have to change her top about 6 times a day. she's been hospitalised twice as she was so bad - i went to the GP's and was basically told that its up to me and whether i think i can "ride through it". i said i'm quite happy to ride through whatever my daughter goes through, but i am not happy nor can i sit back and watch her suffer, and her sleep interrupted night after night as she is waking herself up. she is unable to breath through her nose, and as a consequence of breathing through her mouth all the time (especially at night) she drinks loads!!!

i explained about the interrupted sleep every night and the GP asked if it was affecting her...i was like of course it is, do you feel ok when you don't sleep properly night after night!!

anyway, after a painful visit i was very begrudginly given a referral to an ENT to which i am still waiting for an appt some 3 months later.

i was told however not to hold my breath as it is very highly unlikely that they will remove her tonsils/adenoids as she is so young - her tonsils are so large they are "kissing" as the doctor put it, but its still not enough to have them removed.

i really truly hope you have a better GP than mine and you are able to get your little one sorted - it really is horrible seeing them suffer like this
xx

*awwwwmannnn" please contact the GP surgery for confirmation the referral was sent. 3 months with no appt is ridiculous. If it was then phone the hospital and ask when the appointment will be, or speak to the secretary of the consultant she's been referred to and explain how worried you are. Kids definitely don't wait that long up here. Don't forget with chose and book you can go anywhere in the country.

3 months without even an appointment, I would guess the referral was lost.

Push, push, push.

tbh i was thinking of ringing them next week to find out what was happening - i was so upset and felt awful after seeing the doctor that i was slightly too scared to ring again and make a fuss!! she did say the referral would take about 4 months??

do i ring and speak to the receptionist (stupid question i know) or do i need to speak to the doctor again?? x

Yep go to the docs and get them to refer. My DS was referred anyway due to speech issues hat the SALT thought were consistent with enlarged tonsils and adenoids. Between the referral and the appointments noticed the sleep apnoea and when the consultant looked at the he said they needed to come out.

Apparently tonsils get larger and it's only at about age 7 that the skull grows enough so that the tonsils aren't so big anymore so he said it would only get worse.

He had them out in July aged 3.9. He is less tired during the day as his sleep quality is better so hence less grumpy.

Our referral was sent in November. We got the appointment through at the end of Jan for an appointment at the beginning of March.

My nearly three year old DS is having his tonsils and adenoids out tomorrow for this exact reason. I'm dreading it but after a sleep study in him they found he was never getting deep seep. Is affected his grow as he struggles to eat.

awwwwmannnn just phone the receptionist and ask for the date the referral was sent so you can chase it with the hospital. She'll be able to tell from the computer if and when the referral was sent. Ask which consultant the referral was made to as well. Then phone said consultants secretary and ask if a date is available/ say you're willing to take a last minute slot if there's a cancellation and explain why you're worried.

Medical secretaries are usually v knowledgable and have a big say in the consultants timetable, so get them onside and you have a fighting chance of an early ish appt.

Good luck for tomorrow chuckle.

Its all done and we are home. Last night was the first time he didn't wake because he couldn't breathe. It was nowhere near as gruesome as we had been told and he is now playing with his train on the floor. Only thing different is he has a strange high pitch voice.
I second chasing your referral as we had an appointment within the three months you have been waiting. Good luck x

Really glad it all went smoothly for you. Hope your ds continues to improve. IME voice changes are not uncommon for a short temporary period, several days, due to slight swelling of the vocal cords of the voice big following the breathing tube being passed, as is standard for tonsillectomy. But give the ward a ring if you're worried.

I think you'll see a major benefit in the coming weeks.

Voice box not big! Stupid phone.

chucklecheeks thanks for posting about your experience, I'm glad it went well and I hope your DS is fully recovered soon.

We've got an appt with the GP on Tuesday - would have been a bit sooner but I wanted to wait and get in with the nicest one!

DS dribbles a bit too, I had never connected it before but I can mention that to the doctor as well.

Good luck.