My kids are mean to their siblings!

[OhWhatNoooow]

I am at my wits end already! I have 5dc, and the oldest 2, ages 8 and 10 are so horrible to the younger ones, calling them names, sometimes hitting them and generally treating them like garbage. I cannot stand this, and I get really angry when I hear it going on. I've tried everything, consequences, time outs, reward charts, praising the good behaviour etc...

Is there anything else I can do to change this?

And does anyone else have experience of this?

Not with my own kids, but I did growing up.

I swore from the outser that it would never go in in my own home, and it doesn't.

It is not ok to be called names, hit and treated like garbage because it is a sibling that is responsible. In fact, it is worse, because you cannt get away from it. You are forced to live with it.

Come down on them like a ton of SHIT OP.

Said the bullied sibling.

We have four (5,7,9 and 11) and the eldest two do try and get away with this, but we keep an eye and ear on them and pull them up on it every time it occurs.
Our house rule is 'Be Kind' and I feel like a stuck record sometimes, but I think supervision is key here.

I'm with pictish. I've got 5 DCs too - and I don't do rewards/star charts or any of that stuff. You do not treat your siblings like shit and make their life a misery.

And you do not hit or bully people smaller and younger than you. Ever.

Any incident gets you sent to your room and you immediately miss something you love. Like football training. No ifs, no buts. If you behave like a cow in our house, then your life will be hell. And you have no one to blame but yourself.

I honestly believe that the trick is to make the sanction so unpleasant that the behaviour is not worth it. Everybody in a large family is required to be pleasant to each other (or at least civil).

But what if they perceive the younger child as doing something annoying? thats what always happens. the younger one touches older ones stuff or goes in her room etc... this sets off the older ones mean behaviour. But I think its no excuse to behave like that.

I am so mad that I told them I'm not taking them out on our outing tomorrow, only the younger ones. God, I do so much for those kids, way too much my husband says!

Totally agree sowornout.

No - they don't bring it on theirselves by being annoying - the older ones need to learn to deal with their frustrations better...by tell you, or whatever, rather than lashing out.

My eldest is 11, and his siblings are 5 and 4. We mosy likely have similar issues to you in our house...the touching of forbidden stuff, disagreements over the tv etc etc... but there is no hitting, namecalling or shoving, grabbing, insulting, kicking, pushing whatever....

If the wee ones are really gripping ds1's shit, he comes and tells me.

theirselves? is that even a word?

themselves

I say if the younger ones are annoying you, come and get me ( or DH). We will deal with it, but if the 'victim' hits or retaliates against the wrongdoer, they lose their right to have the problem sorted and become a wrongdoer themselves.
There is no quick fix for this, it's def a long game!

mine are awful to each other as well. it's hard to punish because we don't have much that I can take away. we don't have a million channels, or DSs or Wiis.

I can hear them shrieking and I think one is pulling the other's hair right now. One is hyper sensitive to any hmmming or singing etc... but he is also really rigid and inflexible. The other one taunts him and mocks him to GET a reaction , then when he pulls her hair and she shrieks 'muuuum' I feel like saying you deserved that.

[argh]

Jenny, if mine acted like that I'd decide they were bored and find them some jobs to do...

If the younger ones are annoying the older ones we urge our eldest to use his words to explain to the younger one what they are doing is annoying etc. this encourages them to sort out problems by talking rather than fighting.

We also live by the mantra of no name calling.

What worked for my kids is that I declared bedtime to be 7pm for everyone.

Every incident of name calling or nastiness meant they had to go to bed 15 minutes early.

Every incident of kindness and tolerance meant they could stay up 15 minutes later.

After a couple of weeks, the horrible behaviour stopped and hasn't returned, over a year later.

I think it's just a question of finding the trigger for your children - what works for them - and never, ever, allowing poor behaviour to go unchallenged.

If you like reading, I found

'Siblings without rivalry'

useful.

Also the

'How to talk'

Sorry haven't worked out links on the app.

If you like reading, I found

'Siblings without rivalry'

useful.

Also the

'How to talk'

Sorry haven't worked out links on the app.

Oh and my kids were 10 and 13 at the time and it was the younger one being vile to the older one!

They won't do jobs. They just wont. I know everybody probably thinks they'd whip my kids into shape in a week. but the younger one has autism, although it's mild. He's at mainstream. But i never know if disciplining him is going to make his autism worse, so there's a hesitancy on my part sometimes to really 'get tough'. Yesterday i really felt that i was going to stand up to him and it was a long, long, long hard day. a long hard day. Every little thing is a battle and then meanwhile my older child starts whinging to get my attention, or,she is the spark that ignites a volatile situation with the younger one. I am feeling quite tired of it all right now though. sorry op. hijacking. I tell them that by NINE they must be in their beds with the lights out and they are still looking for hugs and glasses of water at then, and when i say no they say 'you don't love me' blah blah blah. I don't give in. But we seem to end every day with a row because they just won't accept that I won't back down. I don't back down. I know that when you threaten something you have to follow through, and I do. I understand the rules. I never agree to anything until I'm certain I want to allow it. They sometimes try to chip away at me begging and they just don't seem to have learnt in YEARS that I don't change my mind. They aren't 'biddable' like other children. Everybody in this house wants to be the boss. But I'm the only one who's not asking anything unreasonable. eg, brush your teeth, go to bed, stop hitting, punching, fighting, insulting, sneaking off to the shop.................

i have 'how to talk' somewhere. I must read it. problem is they won't have read it......................

have done reward charts in the past but it was a nightmare as they both tried to take control of the reward charts, telling me I should let them off or telling me that x,y or z deserved a bigger reward, or giving out that sibling was rewarded or not punished severely enough...... and obviously i couldn't allow themto take control of the reward charts, so, the reward charts in themselves caused twice as many arguments. The specific behaviours improved for a short while, but the charts created bad feeling and arguments and tension.

Jenny, I think I have a similar situation to yours. My oldest ds, not diagnosed but told he has autistic traits, like inflexibility, OCDish behaviour and more, its not easy to discipline him like you would a normal child. Hes very clever too and manipulates me all the time to try and get his way. He definitely wants to be the boss of all. I feel like I'm always having to hold up those boundaries because they push them relentlessly!

We ended up not taking the older 2 out to dinner with us as a punishment for yesterdays behaviour. Felt crappy about it, but am so fed up with the nastiness so have to be extreme now.

Yes, they really do continue to push the boundaries, long after other children would have accepted the boundary, they are still pushing!

I hope I'm not dumping MY crazy onto the kids but I've said to them "i'm a simple soul, if you're nice and respect me then I'll be very nice to you". is that too confusing for them??

I tell the kids that they have to respect me, thats the way it is, but I also tell them that in order to gain respect you have to give it, and I do try to. I want them to apply this to their sibling relationships though, hasnt worked so far...

My 3 boys 11,14 and very nearly 16 wind each other up and fight constantly!
If I got involved in every single argument I'd be insane by now....

jenny me and my sister were dreadful, mum even resorted to getting the police out on us once. We we were a 'naice' family, decent house, John Lewis stuf and all that . But it's looking like I'm undiagnosed aspergers so I think that part explains why mum couldn't control us.

My dc's fight too. I think it's 4yo DD who causes the chaos so it may improve when she starts school. Making them go to their room never worked as I'd be there holding the door for 20mins + while they kicked the other side then the other sibling has do do something naughty / dangerous to get attention and I'd be screwed. They ripped up sticker charts too. I bought 'how to talk....' And it turned out that was what I'd been trying to do anyway so I wasn't as shit as I thought. I console myself with the fact they are very well behaved at school + nursery, they have lots of friends, are bright and eat their greens. Home is just a bit crap, we're quite cramped and it might improve when we move.

I feel your pain, our three DDs fight a lot too, it tends to improve when one if them is removed from the equation. Also in our case it is mostly the youngest (nearly 5y) who causes the most aggro so I'm hoping things will improve as she matures.

Jenny - we have the same situation - our dc are just not 'biddable' either, and star charts etc just turn into a fiasco. I have noticed that the author of 123 Magic does a corresponding book aimed at children to explain what 123 Magic is about and what it involves for them.