feel like i am being called stupid and a liar and being ignored!

[PooPooInMyToes]

Crap morning today

My six year old needed to take xyz into school today. I told her and she instantly got The Face! The "i Don't believe anything you say" face.

She looks upset when she is like this but just won't believe me. She'll ask me if i am sure? But what if you are wrong?

I tell her Im not wrong.

But how do you know.

Because i read the letter.

But where is the letter?

I don't know but xyz had to be taken in on the first day back which is today.

How do you know? What if you are wrong?

Im not wrong, i read the letter. Will you just believe me for once!

Etc etc etc

I ended up shouting reading the letter out.

I am sick of this. She doesn't believe anything anyone says and has to see proof. Even things such as if we have run out of cereal, she always wants me to show her in the cupboard as she needs to see it herself. I have actually been refusing to do that one for a long time so that's not an issue anymore.

If we are out in the car she tells me i am driving wrong, going the wrong way, too far behind the car in front. I told her a few days ago that i don't want to hear about how to drive from a 6 year old who has never driven a car!

So anyway this morning i got really angry and was shouting at her that she needs to believe me and that i am not a liar. Why is she calling me a liar etc! That its bloody rude! That i feel that she must think i am stupid. Why is she calling me stupid!

On top of that i had my nearly 4 year old doing the opposite of everything i ask. Put your coat on properly, he takes it off. Don't swing the umbrella, you'll poke yourself in the eye, he swings the umbrella. He either is incapable of listening or is choosing not to, i don't know which. He's worrying me. Some of the things he does are dangerous so i need him to listen. I turn his face to me to make sure he is listening but he will just turn his eyes away!

DD is prone to this. I have different approaches depending on how important I think it is to her.

Sometimes I simply ignore her (like with the driving lessons!) although it takes all of my concentration to do this.

Sometimes I just repeat exactly the same words "I know you would like some cereal but we do not have any" and refuse to get into further conversations. Eventually I may even say "I am not talking about this any more" and go off to do some other thing completely.

Sometimes we talk about it more. "What if you're wrong about taking xyz into school today?" "Well if I am, then you can just bring it back again. At least you'll have had it in case you needed it." For my children at least, this last case is a little different. They worry about doing things wrong "is this the right way to go?", " are we allowed to do this?" so I tend to work out with them what is the worst that can happen.

'Tis very annoying though. Especially in the morning where there really isn't time for the big discussion.

Thanks for your reply. Its good to know that i am not the only one.

I did explain that it didn't matter if she took it in bit early anyway as she could just put it in her drawer.

She is starting to get a bit self conscious at the moment, probably her age. Although her personality has always been like this.

Would it help to think that in the long run this aspect of her personality may be a good thing? It's great that she has a mind of her own and wants to work things out for herself. Far better that just accepting everything anyone says without thinking it through for herself.

You'll still have the crap mornings most likely but at least you can console yourself that it'll all work out for the best in the end.

Yeah i do console myself with that

Only thing is my fil is the sort to jump on everything everyone else says and criticise and be all spikey and try to out knowledge everyone etc and i worry she is going to be like that. Actually no she won't be like that as she is lovelier now then he could ever be!

My DD1 is 7 and never believes a word I say or listens to any advice that I give her. I do my utmost not to get angry and I also try REALLY REALLY hard to refrain from the 'I told you so' rant when... yes, it breaks / she falls off the wall / gets wet or whatever. Sometimes a bit later (maybe another day) when things are calm I try and remind her of a salutary lesson she has learn by not doing what I suggested and I do think that she is beginning to improve and take a tiny bit of notice, but some children just have to learn things for themselves by suffering the consequences. Sometimes you have to just let them get it wrong. So in your case it might have been best to tell her very clearly that she needs it because the letter said so and if she didn't believe you let her choose not to take whatever it was and suffer the consequences (but not get angry or say 'I told you so' - she can work that out herself and will just feel resentful if you point it out).

None of my three children (even the 3 yr old) ever believe me when I say a packet is finished, I am now totally inured to the fact that it is simply easier all round to hold it up and show them

I would just have shrugged and said 'ok then. Don't take it, and when mrs x asks you where it is, tell her you told mummy you didn't need it.' and walk off.

Don't get into an argument with a 6yo. I have no idea why you would bother.

Same with the car. I would have pulled over at a safe place, and said very calmly that I did not require her advice, and I would not drive and we would just sit in the car and be late if she carried on. Driving needs concentration to prevent an accident. Nd I would ask her if she was ready to be quiet, or of she would rather sit and look at the traffic for a bit longer.

Discussion? That way lies madness. Just keep your cool, refuse to engage with nonsense. You are the adult. Having a tantrum about being believed is the prerogative of 6yos, not adults. You know you are right, whether she believes you or not is not particularly relevant.

That said, a healthy interest is fine. Only you know whether you have the patience for it at any given time.

Sounds like a normal kid to me!

Its probably from when we grill them when they come home from school with some tall tale. 'So there was a dog in the class? Whose dog was it? Was it a real dog? Are you sure? What did the teacher say? Is this real life or a story?...'. Then you find out that the Guide Dogs were in that day and no-one told you!

I think her behaviour is triggering some low self esteem beliefs about yourself
I.e. it reminds you of how fil treats you...
This could be your problem, not hers.

Thank you for your replies. Just good to hear that you think she sounds normal How exhausting for all of us though!

Bumdrop. How perceptive of you. I often think the way i react to my children is due to my own issues. I felt unlistened to as a child, unprotected, not important. was forced to put up with bad things to keep the peace. Was abused and ended up in abusive relationships. Im sure i have tons of issues still despite counselling.

Sorry to hear that poopoo.
Maybe when she is being a little madam :)
Just stop for a second and get in touch with how you are reacting.
If the situation is triggering thoughts about yourself as a person e.g.
I'm being taken advantage of, i'm seen as weak, whatever .....
Try to work out, is that true of THIS situation, or is that what is left from previous bad experiences ???
Just to ground you in the here and now, as opposed to the past
Best wishes x

2 of my dc'a are just like yours but they are only 4 and 2!!

Ds1 helped me get things out for nursery last night then told me he didn't need them this morning. I have to watch every word I say to ds2 because it either goes in one ear and out the other or he does exactly what I'm telling him not to do: get down before you....too late.

I think that madwomanintheattic's tactic for dealing with the driving advice is excellent - I would warn her that that's what you are going to do, and why (because you need to concentrate on your driving and the traffic, and her 'advice' is distracting, as well as being very unwelcome, from someone who has never driven), and then implement it. Don't get into discussions with her if you don't want to - use the 'cracked record' approach.

Bumdrop. I do try to do that but in practice and in use heat of things its so hard to do.

Im thinking of asking my gp for cbt to help with my anger. I think they do that? I feel that if i could be calmer i would be able to think. When i am having a calmer day i am actually a good mum, the rest of the time Im awful

PooPoo - I think that the chaos of the early years makes thinking and reacting calmly to your children much, much harder. It is bloddy hard work, and so constant and relentless - your children require so much from you, so much of the time, and I remember never feeling like I ever caught up with things. I was always running to catch up, and that made me stressed, which made me more shouty as a parent.

Sdt. Yes absolutely! I never catch up with stuff, rarely get a break, can't get time to exercise, to work on a project i want to do, to work, to just chill out or a change of scene. It feels like i am always demanded off, always being asked for things, moaned at about something or other. Every time i sit down someone asks me to fetch something they can't reach etc its either do it or deal with whining and repeated asking (although they get in trouble for that). My needs always come way last after everything and everyone. Im exhausted today.

My husband is home now so am going for a long walk in the pain with my ipod! Bliss!

Enjoy your walk, and the time to yourself with your music!

"Don't get into an argument with a 6yo. I have no idea why you would bother. "

Exactly. You don't have to let her wind you up.

"This could be your problem, not hers."

Am inclined to agree.

Our dd tries this sometimes, I just say, "OK then" or "Oh, I see".

Am a bit worried by "I turn his face to me to make sure he is listening" - are you saying that you hold him while you shout in his face? You're blaming him for turning his eyes away?

It sounds like you might be being quite an angry parent to them at the mo.

I've found that after-the-event consequences are the best way to get them to listen. Obviously this doesn't work if they're doing something life-endangering like running into the road.

You're over-discussing again. Understandable if you were never listened to as a child but over-discussing can be just as bad as ignoring. Children that grow up thinking every utterance they make is valid and that everything can be negotiated if they stick their lip out far enough can find real life very frustrating. 'Because I said so' is a complete sentence that traumatises no-one. Use it when you have to.

Toaster. To get him to pay attention i need him to look at me, so yes i turn his face to me but he avoids my gaze if its not something he wants to hear. Who said i shout in his face!?

It was a good walk by the way now i can put the kids to bed as a happier mummy.

"because i said so" is something i use occasionally but not too much as it was something i heard a lot as a child. Along with "we'll see" and "maybe". Nothing was ever actually explained to me and it was the most frustrating feeling. When it was "no" or "not today" i was never told why. I usually just had to keep out the way or keep the peace to avoid setting off my violent relation. A relation i wasn't protected from due to inability. It was easier for me to just take it. For everyone else concerned anyway. So i learnt from that i didn't matter. Some other horrific stuff happened as well. I remember trying to tell my parents that i was having panic attacks, although of course i didn't explain it like because i didn't actually know what it was that happened, and the response i got was "oh".

Its not that they were horrible parents or anything, just had their own mental illnesses and were not able to cope.

Glad u enjoyed your walk,
We all have to find somehow to destress / recharge etc..
I think it's a good idea to go down the CBT route,
Could be really empowering, to feel more in control of your responses to emotions,
Regards x

Thank you bum!

"Nothing was ever actually explained to me "

There's a huge difference between 'nothing' and 'everything'. Sometimes it's fine to sit and have lengthy philosophical discussions with a child about the rights and wrongs of a situation. It can even be quite fun and illuminating. Other times it's just not appropriate and you have to pull rank.

If you're parents had mental illnesses they couldn't balance that judgement. You don't have their disadvantage. You are not them and your DD is not you.

your not you're, of course.