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mums and sons

109 replies

dexter · 03/11/2005 11:45

Has anyone else noticed the prejudice there seems to be nowadays in favour of having a girl? I've read articles lately in which people state that 'every woman wants a daughter' and numerous articles over the months have appeared in magazines looking at 'mothers and daughters' and their relationships. Maybe I've missed them but I've not seen a similar article celebrating mothers and sons and their unique relationships. I'm extremely close to my mother so I am not denying the special relationships there are - but I have a son and I feel that there really is a magical bond between mother and son, he is heavenly, adorable, and glorious. I don't feel there's enough out there about this! It's almost as if some people feel I must be disappointed to have a boy...anyone else sensed this or is it finally time they sectioned me? let me know, girls!!

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Holymoly321 · 04/11/2005 09:21

Flum, if it's a boy you will LOVE him! honestly! There is just something about a bouncing baby boy that is incredible! And I LOVE LOVE LOVE saying 'this is my son'! And he WILL be including me in his life - I intend to have lots of fun fun fun with him - can't imagine being a nagging MIL (but it's very early days yet ha ha!!). COngrats on being pregnant!

saadia · 04/11/2005 10:06

I have two boys and always really wanted a girl. I just think it's nice to have both because then you get both experiences but now I honestly don't mind if we have another boy, another girl or no more kids. For me, it is a case of being extremely happy with what I have and not missing what I don't have.

When they arrive it's not their gender you love, it's because they're yours.

muppety · 04/11/2005 10:42

But do any of you like and even love your MIL. I mean is it possible that the relationship can be any way as close as a mother/daughter one. Would you phone her for a chat or go out fopr lunch?

I know a lot of lovely women who have great relationships with their daughters but whose DIL just don't get on with them. Why? I am trying hard to like mine as I know I will be in her poition one day. My mum knows if my brother has children she will play second fiddle but lucky her that she has me and my children. One of my friends only 'allows' her MIL to see the children once a year. Her own mother sees them daily .

Really I don't see whats wrong with saying I'd like a daughter. would love the experience of that relationship. In no way does it ever ever mean I love my sons less. I am just so scared of losing them one day to another womans family.

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Avalon · 04/11/2005 10:44

muppety - I prefer my MIL to my mum.

spidermama · 04/11/2005 11:04

If I could be sure to have a girl I'd have a fifth child.

I do love my boys though. They're so affectionate and emotionally simple. It's refreshing. They're helping me to understand men in general and I think it's true that men get a bad press on the whole.

Still, I'd dearly love another girl.

Socci · 04/11/2005 11:49

Message withdrawn

pfer · 04/11/2005 12:06

I've got 2 boys and wouldn't change that for the world. They are the centre of my universe, the love overwhelms me at times, sadly not sure if I'd feel that with a girl as I wanted 2 boys. But then as we've got the 2 we wanted we're not planning any more so I'll not get the chance to find out if I'd be Ok to have a girl - I'm sure I would. As cod said, and god help me I actually agree with old fishface on something, you get what you are given and if I'd had my 2nd scan and was told it as a girl I'm just not sure how I'd be, but I do know that I'd love my baby completely. When was sprogged with DS2 people kept saying ooh i bet you're hoping for girl aren't you? all I said was "no, i want another boy" - think I remember what I was like to my mum when I was growing up - poor old mum. We've got a fab relationship now and she adores my lads, they can do no wrong

just remember though:

A son's a son till he finds a wife,
but
a daughters a daughter for life.

A going my me and my bro it's probably true. So make the most of your boys while you can, I know I will..

pfer · 04/11/2005 12:08

Muppety - can't standmy MIL. Wouldn't care if never saw her again - EVER. Sad but DH feels the same so it's not just me - it's the wicked step mum syndrome for DH and his bro's. She's horrid.

bubbles2904 · 04/11/2005 12:24

hi, i totally agree with a lot that has been said here. i have 2 beautiful dds and love them both so much, wasn't bothered what dd2 was, so long as she was healthy, but i did get a lot of "oh, another girl, you must be gutted. never mind you can always try again". that made me so mad. i think no matter how many children you have and whatever sex they are, you still get someone trying to put you down, if that makes any sense.
i always used to agree with the a daughter is a daughter saying, until i met my dp, i don't have the best relationship with my mother, much closer to my dad who is my hero, but all through dd2 pregnancy, mil was so involved. she was invited to scans, even the 3d one, and was asked to attend the birth, but was on holiday at the time. i think it depends on the daughter in laws not so much the sons in my honest opinion. xxx
hope this makes sense

pfer · 04/11/2005 12:27

bubbles - am secretly envious when i see all the pretty dresses in the shops when am stuffing jeans and t-shirts in my basket....

Aren't we all just damned lucky to have kids to love?

muppety · 04/11/2005 12:54

I agree bubbles, the DIL probably the key and if she has a good reltionship with her own mother then you are porbably out of luck IYKWIM.

Avalon you have given me hope!

Your MIL may truly be wicked pfer but not all mothers of sons can be. My mum is great but is still seen as a wicked MIL to my brothers girlfriend.

My mum thinnks if you are going to have boys you might as well have a lot of them. That way at least one will stay close or the family will remain together due to them wanting to see one another. My DH is an only child and I know things would be easier if there were other siblings/grandchildren around.

pfer · 04/11/2005 12:59

muppety thb, if we had the money (to move to a bigger house - in 2 bed at mo. dh and I have the little room and Ds1 and 2 share the bigger room with each other and toys) I'd be happy to keep churning them out. I love kids, even childbirth isn't too bad when you think about it.

My dh is unlucky with his smil. Just a shame. His mum died when he was 11, his bro's were 13, and the twins were 4. All despise the Stepmum sadly which makes for difficult visits. Though, in her defence (and I hate doing this as she's not very nice to my kids either but in an underhand manner) I couldn't have taken on 4 boys of someone elses when my own kids had already grown up and left home. She was braver than I would ever be.

TwoIfBySea · 04/11/2005 21:23

This article was once on Mumsnet but for any who missed it here you go. And I love my dsts and would love another 2 boys preferably not at the same time again! Actually....

Oh, boy

She may never get the chance to dress Bratz dolls or groom My Little Pony. But Emily Bell has no regrets about having boys

Wednesday August 25, 2004
The Guardian

When it became obvious that I was pregnant for the third time, one question predominated. Not the pertinent, "What were you thinking?", but, because we had two boys already, the more polite, "Are you hoping for a girl?"
I wondered if I had two girls instead of boys whether people would have felt so readily able to say "Are you hoping for a son?" There is still a lurid aspect to the popular imagination about the concept of many boys, particularly living - or festering - together under one roof. To have a household where the feminine input is swamped by testosterone apparently invites the prospect of living in a re-enactment of Lord of the Flies. It is as if everyone adhered to the sentiments of Mr Jaggers in Great Expectations: "I have a pretty large experience of boys, and you are a bad set of fellows."
A survey produced earlier this month by Dr Sarah Johns, of the University of Kent, noted that women who gave birth to boys are more likely to be of an optimistic turn of mind and expect to live longer than the mothers of girls. This is apparently because boys are "more difficult to give birth to and raise than girls", falling foul of more traumatising infant diseases, poor school results, low self-esteem and violent crime. Therefore only the most robust and foolishly misguided of us are likely to allow our bodies to produce such potentially troublesome creatures.
Despite the relentlessly bad press that gangs of men, even small ones, get, the truth was that no, I was not hoping for a girl. Having a third child was enough of a shock; having one who might not enjoy Batman figures, being hit with sticks by siblings and Pro Evolution Soccer on the PlayStation was terrifying.
Henry was confirmed as a "he" at the 20-week scan. "Were you hoping for a girl?" sympathised the radiographer. Since Henry's arrival joining Alfie, seven, and George, three ("nearly four"), reactions have also been predictable. "Ooh, three boys," say people, whistling over their teeth, as if they were plumbers inspecting a dodgy stopcock. Other parents of three or more boys chortle in sympathy or just nod in glazed silent recognition of this most unfortunate predicament.
The midwife, who had also come to weigh and measure the first two, was outraged. "This is no good," she said, wagging her head at Henry's recumbent form. "You have to have another one and you have to have a girl - there are too many men in this house." Much as I enjoy our quadrennial get together over my abdominal scar, I am afraid I can't oblige.
My husband who, when our second son was born, confessed to being fractionally disappointed it was not a girl, has since changed his mind, discovering that two allies are better than one and three would be better still. He looks at our baby, who gazes at me still with the desperate adoration of an alcoholic looking at a brewery, and confidently asserts,"You will come over to my side eventually."
There was further reason for medical cheer over the holidays with some scientists discovering that giving birth to boys gives women traces of Y chromosomes in their bones which may help guard against osteoporosis. At least I think this is what the report said, but as the radio news report was drowned out by the sound of a Megazord battling a nude Action Man, I can't be totally sure. The fact that men leave genetic material lying around in their mothers' bones should come as no surprise to those who have had to fish their socks out from under the sofa or retrieve stray shin pads from the top of a bookcase.
Mothers of daughters only related tales in the playground about how their offspring clamoured for more homework before skipping off to braid each other's hair and indulge in (quiet) "role play". The most positive comment about producing three boys was "halfway to a football team", which is both numerically incorrect and unfairly raised the hopes of my eldest son, who thought we might actually be able to produce the remaining eight members needed for a squad, which he would of course captain.
While I would love my boys to continue the happy, civilising effects of co-education, the authorities and parents of daughters conspire against this, preferring single-sex education from the age of 11 lest their already advanced daughters see their work suffer as a result of rubbing up against the oppressive presence of mini men.
Really, being outnumbered by four to one in my own house ought to be a source of some regret. I will never be called on to dress a Bratz doll, or do as my mother did for me - just the once - and fashion a tiny duvet out of an old dressing gown for a knitted squirrel. Nothing in our house outside my wardrobe is pink. My middle son briefly treasured a cast-off My Little Pony before it joined the other fractured plastic detritus at the bottom of a box. They like cooking, but only baking cakes. They do have artistic interests - Alfie is keen on photography, though I had to stop him from paying George £5 to drop his trousers so he could "take pictures of something gross".
Being daughterless has another hidden upside: as well as not having to worry about buying any new clothes/toys/bedrooms for number three, I am relieved of the arduous task of relaying what one friend's mother described as "womancraft". I do not know exactly what this is, but I am fairly sure I would have failed an O-level in it. I am much more comfortable sitting on the sidelines of Saturday morning foot ball practice restraining myself from shouting "Take his legs!" too loudly, while his father tuts and carries on reading the recipes in the Saturday supplements.
I have amazed my children (and myself) by building the whole of Hogwarts castle in tiny bits of Lego, and have reluctantly bowed to the scatological tendencies of small boys by inventing inappropriate lyrics to the irritating Fimbles' literacy song.
I worry, though, that so far none of my children has shown an appetite for interiors magazines or gossip. "What did you do at school today?" "Nothing." "Who did you play with?" "No one." But otherwise I am happy to trade the potential companionship of a daughter for extended periods of peace where I can relax, free from the difficult business of being a 24/7 role model.
Alarmingly, a colleague asked, "Who is going to take care of you when you are old?" Being optimistic (apparently), I like to think that despite being male, my sons will not in fact abandon me in what will be an unbelievably extended old age, but will have inherited their father's unlimited patience with small children and old people. I am resigned however to making most of the phone calls - there is only so much nurture can undo.

hovely · 04/11/2005 21:57

when I was expecting DD and having scans in London Borough of Haringey the radiographer told me they never let anyone know the sex of the baby, even if they could see it, just in case people had a termination if it wasn't a boy. Guess they thought there was a big cultural issue around it.

Mum2OneAndBump · 04/11/2005 22:22

I adore my ds, but i do have to admit when i first found out i was pregnant i was kind og hoping for a girl, we found out at the scan it was going to be a boy so i got used to the idea. Now my son is here & from when i new it was a boy i just began to love the idea, i adore him and we are so so so close, no one can take our bond away. We seem to have something very special between us (he is only 3) but everyday is more and more special.

I am 7 months pregnant with our second, and have found out we are having a girl, i really did not mind if it was a girl or boy as i had a slight prefernece for a girl but i thought about how great it would be for ds to have a brother and they could do "boy" things together.

We only want 2 children and have said this will be our last, BUT and i can not believe i am saying this and i will not tell dp for a long long time yet, i already think i will have one more cause i really would love another little boy, give me 4 boys but all i want is just one girl.

I think to be honest after wrting this whole post i feel a bit ungrateful talking about the sex of babys because to be honest whatever sex i have/will have will make no difference to me, i wanted to be a mum and to have kids, thats what i have no matter what sex they are. I am grateful i can have children as some people can not and they would give there right arm just to get pregnant let alone talk about what sex they would like

bubbles2904 · 05/11/2005 10:20

also, when my nanna died, ny grandad was alone and it was and still is my dad that goes to his house every day to see him and also takes him out on a friday night with himself and my mum. my grandad has 3 sons and 3 daughters and my dad is the one who's around the most.

crazydazy · 06/11/2005 09:13

Not sure if I agree with the saying "a daughter's for life" as its the other way around in our house!!! I do not have a good relationship with my Mum and so as a result of this she never sees the kids regularly but thats because she's never that bothered and I was sick of making the effort for her to see her own grandchildren!!! She's only interested if we go to visit her, if we didn't visit she would never see them!!!

DP's mum and dad are the total opposite, they live down the street from us but always make sure they see the grandchildren every day and we are going on holiday with them for 2 weeks next year the kids just see them as an extended version of us which is the way I think grandparents should be.

My DP is very close to his Mum and his sister is not as close as he is. I know he is closer to me and tells me everything so in that respect the saying is true.

I hope my DS and DD will always be close to me, I would be totally gutted if they weren't!!

Lethal · 06/11/2005 11:11

When I was pregnant, my mother-in-law said to me "I do hope you're having a girl. Girls are much nicer than boys." And I'm married to her son! . Well I had a boy, and he's lovely... definitely wouldn't swap him for the world. My MIL had two boys herself when she was young, but left them and her ex-husband to move overseas with a new man, and then she had her much-treasured daughter. She's VERY close to her daughter but is still quite distant from her sons... her preference for girls is quite obvious and has caused a lot of hurt to her sons.

I've also had pregnant friends (with daughters) say right in front of me, "I hope I'm not having a boy, I would just die if I had a son" and lovely comments like that. I'm just glad that my son has turned out to be the boy that he is, so they can see that boys are capable of being wonderful and loving and gentle, as well as boisterous and rough. They've often commented that he is a nice kid and one of them even said it might've been nice if she'd had a boy, which I never thought I would hear come out of her mouth!!

Then last week, a grandmother of one of ds' school friends told me that I must definitely try for a daughter, even though I told her that dh and I didn't want any more children. "But you MUST have a daughter, you look like someone who NEEDS to have a daughter", then proceeded to tell me about some Chinese fertility chart which guarantees that you'll have a girl. I felt like I was talking to a brick wall when I told her that I'm ok with the way things are, thank you very much, and that I'm NOT having any more children. GRRRR. There really is a lot of prejudice against boys, even in the schooling system which I think is so unfair. Boys can be such wonderful human beings in my opinion.

Lethal · 06/11/2005 11:15

And I also have stepsons who I think are wonderful, I've always been close to my Dad and my brother, so I really don't have any problems with boys at all... I think they're great

marthamoo · 06/11/2005 12:10

Love that article, twoifbysea

Ds2 (almost 4) said the other day, "I don't like girl babies, I only like normal ones."

Heehee, I wouldn't change my two boys for anything in the world - but I'm sure I'd feel exactly the same if I had two girls, or one of each.

pfer · 06/11/2005 13:40

crazyd - your mum sounds much like my inlaws. they don't make any effort at all and if we didn't they'd never see the kids. I don't care much myself as they show such obvious favouritism towards MIL's blood grandkids (she's a step MIL). And since DS2 was born they have actively ignored DS1. They don't even bother to say hello to him when DS2 is there. Just blank him completely and it breaks my heart to see his little face full of hurt when grandad ignores him . Just found out though that they are going to be greatgrandparents next year twice over on the MIL's side - so at a guess both of my will be ignored - the novelty will have worn off

JuliaAndJohn · 06/11/2005 15:36

I have always wanted three children. Luckily my husband did too! We are blessed with three little sons aged 6 mos., 2 and 3 - what we call 'our handful of little lads'. They are all white blonde with curls and quite beautiful. I get stopped all the time and people always comment - the fact that we have three boys, the fact that they are so incredibly close in age, the fact they are so handsome....

Yes I would have liked a girl, but never in place of any of my sons!! I am VERY proud to be the mother of three sons.

As for sons moving away... yes it makes me sad to read it, and yes, it may be true.... BUT... I love my boys and will always be kind to them, cuddle them and listen to them, I will teach them right from wrong, I will respect their opinion and will respect their choice of girls. I will bring them up well and if they make the wrong choices in life and also choose not to spend time with me in later life, I will always know I was a good Mum to them and gave them a good start in life. I can do no more than that.

4blue1pink · 06/11/2005 16:13

this thread is refreshing but i have seen people shudder when i tell them i am pg with a 4th boy - no joke! mine are quite girly boys too! Even my consultant raised her eyebows at me the other day after counting my boys and one girl on my notes!

Tiggiwinkle · 06/11/2005 17:14

I have 5 sons ! Got absolutely sick of the comments about wanting a girl in my last pregnancy. Some "friends" went on about it so much I actually did not look forward to telling them it was a boy, despite DH and I being really happy about it.
I love having 5 boys and would not change it for anything!

yorkshiremum · 06/11/2005 18:03

I really wanted a boy in my first pregnancy and convincd myself it was a girl so I wouldn't be disappointed. When I got a DS I was thrilled and feel very lucky to have my little man.

I am now pregnant again and it annoys me already when people say I must want a girl this time - if I got the same baby all over again I wouldn't care a bit!!!

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