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Original poster

Do you think our children will grow up unable to recognise/deal with danger?

122 replies

SoupDragon · 22/03/2009 17:25

Filling in ponds, not letting them walk home from school, removing poisonous plants, safety this that and the other...

Now I am as guilty of some of these things as everyone else but I do wonder if we are doing or children a disservice to some extent. We had a small pond and knew how to be safe with it, we climbed trees, we went out on our bikes for hours and hours and went to the park alone (amongst other rather risky stuff).

Obviously there are more cars about etc than when I was young but do you think we've become too risk-averse in our parenting?

OP posts:
southeastastra · 22/03/2009 20:35

he'd be good for a mn live chat.

spicemonster · 22/03/2009 20:47

I am really worried about it soupdragon and try and leave my DS to his own devices as much as I can (unless there's real danger). I am scared he either won't recognise it so will fail to deal with it or be scared of his shadow, imagining bogey men in every corner. Not sure what's worse

Original poster
SoupDragon · 22/03/2009 21:00

I can't imagine letting my children have the same freedom to roam as I did but I will certainly try to. I wonder why it is so worrying, given that I had the freedom and see it as the norm...

I guess we'll see what happens when DS1 walks home tomorrow!

Riven, that's madness. But best you put the axe out of reach just in case.

OP posts:
Original poster
SoupDragon · 22/03/2009 21:01

As an aside, I wonder how many children drown in their own ponds rather than pond-free children falling into other people's ponds.

OP posts:
ijustwant8hours · 23/03/2009 10:21

I can't help thinking that if I had fallen in the pond as a toddler it would have been treated as an accident and no (or not much) blame would be attached to my mother. However if my toddler fell in the pond I'm sure I would be widely critised for letting him near it in the first place.

Its not a good reason for not letting him near a pond but I do think that we don't just have accidents anymore...

Portofino · 23/03/2009 10:30

I've just started to let my 5 yo play outside with the girls next door. It's a cul de sac so not much danger from traffic and she knows not to go pasty the end of the road with her bike. We've had a lovely weekend with all 3 girls running in and out of each others houses and having races outside, whilst we "keep an eye" out. This is what I did as a child 30 odd years ago. But even though I KNOW the risks are not much greater (traffic aside), I can't see me letting her wander off out of sight, in the way my friends and I did, for many, many years.

georgimama · 23/03/2009 10:31

A sanity thread. How refreshing. I totally agree with exposure to controlled risk from a very early age. Children are at no greater risk of paedophiles than they were 40 years ago, and whilst there are more cars on the road, road deaths have decreased.

Equip children to deal with the world, make them aware, give them the tools they need to judge danger and then let them get on with it.

There'll be threads in 30 years time on the future equivalent of MN with people bemoaning how little their parents (us) prepared them for the world, just wait...

georgimama · 23/03/2009 10:33

Quattrocento, I feel guilty now for not voicing my support for you on the cooking thread. I was cooking dinner for my mum from the age of 12 and I have been offered sympathy on MN before for my neglected childhood.

You are right, they are mad.

Original poster
SoupDragon · 23/03/2009 10:36

"road deaths have decreased." But is that because there are fewer children playing out? I had no idea there were so many children in our road until it was shut off due to snow and they were all trying to sled down the hill.

OP posts:
Original poster
SoupDragon · 23/03/2009 10:40

I packed DS1 off to school with his doorkey this morning (after checking he could actually unlock the door!). I told him to make sure DS2 goes and gets changed sensibly for afterschool football so that will mean a) traffic is less and b) he'll be home alone for a shorter time.

It's still nerve wracking and I'm sure it shouldn't be!

I wasn't surprised at the reaction you got Quattro - not in the current risk-averse climate.

I agree that accidents sometimes need to happen. No one wants their child hurt but it only takes one fall through the shed roof before you learn it wasn't such a great idea to be up there in the first place.

OP posts:
georgimama · 23/03/2009 10:42

I think it's a combination of things - tougher drink driving laws, strict rules on use of seat belts and appropriate car seats for children, lower speed limits, better road safety awareness and probably fewer children playing out in the street.

You probably had visiting children if there was a good hill to sled down!

AitchTwoOh · 23/03/2009 10:43

dd aged three sits right beside the gas cooker and stirs frying onions, sauces etc, and has done since she was two i think. she is right beside the kettle as well, and next to a knife rack, lol. (we only have a small kitchen). what's the worst that can happen? minor burns, really. and we have ice in the freezer. she is RUBBISH at chopping things, though.

outside, though, it's the cars that scare me. i think dd is pretty good at stopping at roads etc so that's not a worry, but i do think that people drive more aggressively now, and the volume of cars and their size has increased greatly. that's what worries me about the future, and letting her walk places on her own.

taipo · 23/03/2009 10:50

We live in Germany and dc here have a lot more freedom than in the UK. Sometimes it takes a bit of getting used to but on the whole I think it's a much more sensible approach.

Where we live the vast majority of children start walking on their own to school from the age of 6/7 and next year dd will cycle (she did her cycling proficiency test this year) to secondary school (she'll be 10). I think both those things would be pretty much unthinkable in the UK.

Dd has also been on a trip into the woods with the school where they were told to take a pocket knife. I was very nervous about that but she was fine.

southeastastra · 23/03/2009 10:53

this is a good site too london play are going to start closing off streets so children can play out.

agree about the cars though, they whizz about round here.

Mumfie68 · 23/03/2009 11:32

I'm glad I'm not the only one who lets her kids be kids! I've felt like I've been banging my head against a brick wall sometimes - I try and explain to people that if you don't let your kids out and about to learn about the world, they'll never learn those 'streetsmarts' that we did when we were growing up. I mean, how else do you develop that sixth sense that tells you something/someone is dangerous? We all used to play out and we all knew whose house you shouldn't knock at, which people you shouldn't talk to - you didn't need a website, it was common knowledge and we all looked after each other!

I see my job as a parent as bringing up my kids to become independent adults, it doesn't just suddenly happen when they're 16/18, you start right from when they're babies. And if I don't trust them, how will they learn to trust themselves?

OK, rant over lol - can you tell I get a bit heated about this?

traceybath · 23/03/2009 11:39

ds1 has been helping stir porridge/risotto etc since he was about 3. I think its better to teach children to do things safely than just not let them try.

But them i'm definitely of the benign neglect school of parenthood. DS1 whose 4 forgot his snack for school last week and i was laughing with teacher about this and said he won't forget to do it again and honestly you'd think i'd said i made him hoover the whole house rather than just get an apple out of the fruit bowl.

As an aside how bad is it that ds1's current big treat is to get to mop the floor with my new flash powermop!

prettybird · 23/03/2009 11:59

Another supporter of benign neglect

I have a theory that older parents (of which I am one - 48 in two weeks time) go one of two ways: either ultra paranoid or ultra relaxed. I am definitely in the latter category. I am determined to give ds the freedom that I enjoyed when I was a kid in the 60s.

Ds started walking to school on his own occasionally last year when he was 7. Once he is walking again (he has only just ogt his cast taken off after breaking his leg - playing football at school), we are considering letting him walk home from school on a couple of days.

We also need to teach him how to use the key to the door. ALl the last few times I have tried, he has not been strong enough to turn it (it isl also quite high so therefore awakward).

Talking about risk, it is really sad that two other parents have asked us if we are going to sue the school 'cos he broked his leg there! He's a boy who plays football. These things happen FFS!

jack99 · 23/03/2009 12:07

My friend in Finland sent her DS (from age 8) out to school by himself, a journey involving 2 bus journeys. It is expected that all children at this age will get themselves to school. Also all the children in their street run around and play together, right down to young ones of 2 or 3. The older ones look out for them and they run in and out of each others houses when they need something. Adults do not feel the need to watch them. It is a lovely childhood.

They live in Helsinki, so an urban area though not as busy as larger cities in UK.

They lived here in London for 4 years while her DCs were small. One of the reasons she was keen to move home to Finland was the lack of freedom kids here are allowed. I agree with her wholeheartedly.

jack99 · 23/03/2009 12:11

I have just announced to other parents at the bus stop that I intend to allow my DD to walk home from her school bus when she turns 10. It is a 10 minute walk involving crossing one not very busy road.

The general reaction has been horror, I will probably be reported to social services.

When I was 10, EVERYONE in my class walked home alone! Has the world gone mad?

jack99 · 23/03/2009 12:13

Prettybird - at parents telling you to sue the school!

That attitude explains why schools are not prepared to let kids do anything fun anymore! A real shame.

prettybird · 23/03/2009 12:16

From about the age of 8 (might have been 9) I was getting a train into Glasgow (Partick) from Bearsden, walking along a road and up a narrow path to get to a ballet lesson - and then the reverse trip home, with about a 15 minute walk from Bearsde n station to get home. In winter, this would be in the dark.

I can remember being "trained" to do it, with my mum showing me where to get off and going over the route and then letting me doe it "on my own" a couple of times, when really she was following me (I know the first time - but she may well have follwoed me a few more times! )

Mumfie68 · 23/03/2009 12:19

Jack99, we still have Middle Schools here and being fairly rural most kids have to get the bus, starting in Year 5 - I can only think of one or two kids who get driven (yes driven!) the half-mile or so to the bus stop, they are embarrassed by it and the other kids think they/their parents are weird. Hell, I think their parents are weird! You, on the other hand, are not, and I hope social services have got better things to do! You just wait, give it a little while and more and more of the other kids will walk too!

handmedownqueen · 23/03/2009 12:22

My 12 10 and 7 year old all walk to and from school unaccompanied - its fantastic not ot go to playground! 12 and 10 often at home alone for two to four hours . they cook simple food for themselves. they go out cycling and use train to next village to visit friends go to shops for me.

but I think i am seen as neglectful and as having too mant children, the main reason for me letting them do all this is as i also have a 3 year old and 18 month old

but I think the independenc the older ones have gained because of this has been wonderful for them. To be honest the main barrier in stopping them doing things was me not wanting to cut the apron strings. The 12 years has six years till he can leave, he needs to master a lot more complex life skills by then than making beans on toast and crossing roads so I think the earlier the better for these things

disneystar · 23/03/2009 12:27

i dont let my dc,s out there 8 7 5 9mths,
i also have a daughter (grown up now) but i did let my kids (23,21 17 ) out when they were younger until my dd was snatched and raped and dumped 3 days later,sounds horrid doesnt it but believe me its true
i re marriecand i do not let my boys out whatsoever.....
we have loads of play dates, many many supervised activities and i let them tree climb etc etc....
but out there on the own i just cant people have suggested i may need therapy and i am so terrified of what can happen and i know how it feels to live it...maybe i do...
my dd was 9 and outside my house playing right outside my back gate.
imo children are no threat to a weirdo they cannot put up a fight no matter how sensible they are
i cant find a balance with my children now
this thread is helping and i am really listening to what you guys are saying
i know they need freedom i just cant let them go....

prettybird · 23/03/2009 12:29

Dh did tell one of the mums who suggested it to "F off"!

The thing about always escorting kids every where is that they never learn road sense for them selves. One of the reasons for the big blip in RTAs at c.12 is that kids are going to scondary school on thier onw and have never had to dela with traffic.

We have made sure to train ds from a very early age on road safety and road judgement. That means I am now happy for him to corss roads safely on his own and with certain (but not all) of his friends. The reason that I am not confident about some of his friends is that they have no road sense.

jack99 - ask the parents at the bus stop what speficially are they worried about? I feel stongly that "benign neglect" parents should come out of the closet and start to challenge the current prevailing orthodoxy of "cotton wool kids".