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Quality of Life Today

216 replies

Bugsy · 05/02/2002 13:52

Now this is not meant to be a party political thing, but I want to know whether people think that life in this country has improved in the last decade. I am feeling particularly hacked off today, hideous commute, crappy project and grumpy toddler pre-work but I think my quality of life is slowly going down the toilet.
Since I started working, some 10 years ago, I've watched the tube service get worse, the train service get worse, local hospitals close departments & wards, traffic congestion increase, parking become more difficult & expensive. One way or another through NI, VAT, road tax my tax burden has increased and I can't help wondering what is going on.
Do other people feel like this, or am I just Mrs Misery today? As I say, I am not trying to get at any one political party but I would be interested to know how others feel about their quality of life in the UK over the last 10 years.

OP posts:
zoe7 · 25/02/2002 20:08

Callie, please don't worry, its not good for you or your baby. I can see what you mean and I don't think your being paranoid at all. I mostly lurk here and I think your posts are always from the heart and honest. Please don't let anyone get you down . I know robin is having a tough time lately but I don't see that as an excuse to keep posting such comments about mumsnetters.I don't blame callie for thinking those comments were directed at her and I think it should stop.

Robin your posts often seem a cloak and dagger way of getting your point across. Iam thinking of the thread you started calling everyone "bigots and Bitches".

To be honest its mainly robin that prevents me from posting here. If she takes a dislike to you she never forgets and keeps posting comments directed at said person.
It is not big and it is not clever robin to upset pregnant women. I didn't that is what mumsnet is about.

janh · 25/02/2002 21:19

"If she takes a dislike to you she never forgets and keeps posting comments directed at said person."
True, sadly. You are a brave woman, Zoe!

MalmoMum · 25/02/2002 21:37

I feel brave adding an echo to JanH.

Tinker · 25/02/2002 22:04

Er, am I the only one who thinks this is all a bit out of order, particularly at the moment?

Faith · 25/02/2002 22:07

No, Tinker, I agree with you.

jessi · 25/02/2002 23:22

I agree too, both RobinW and Callie are having abit of a s**t time at the moment. That's allowed isn't it? No need to get hyper-sensitive and start saying who you like/dislike on this site.

SueDonim · 26/02/2002 00:46

No, you're not the only one, Tinker. It's about time to stop bringing up the past. Let's have an outbreak of harmony on Mumsnet, before getting back to informed debate!

janh · 26/02/2002 09:32

Well, if we're going to talk about sht times. let me tell you about my year - Oct 2000, diagnosed breast cancer. Nov 200 surgery to remove 2 Grade 3 (aggressive, fast-growing) tumours and all the lymph nodes under one arm. Youngest child 7 at the time.
Jan - Jun 2001, 12 doses of chemotherapy, 2 every 4 weeks, feeling like sh
t a lot of the time, can't work, no pay, house going to rack and rooney etc.
June/July 2001, blood clot on lung, 8 days in hospital during hottest spell of year, daily heparin injections into lower abdomen; discharged to free bed but daily (30 mile round trip) visits to blood clinic until correct dose of Warfarin established, followed by weekly visits, which coincide with 4 weeks of 50 mile daily round trips for radiotherapy, taking up most of the school holidays.
4 weeks after that back to work (finances desperate), having lost most of hair it starts growing back all in different directions in total confusion. And to cap it all, now I am fit enough to catch up with all the stuff I couldn't do while undergoing treatment, I have massive astigmatism in one eye which means I can't see to do cleaning properly, let alone sensible organising or decorating, and I am on the waiting list just to SEE a consultant before I go on another waiting list for cataract-type surgery. I can't drive at night and probably shouldn't during the day.
A pretty sh*t year, no?
Throughout I have tried to post nice helpful messages on here, many of which have been ignored, some of which have been misinterpreted, a few of which have been received in the spirit in which they were intended. Some people have either a gift for concise reasoned arguments or lots of time to polish - don't know which. But some of us just sit down and type and it comes out wrong.
JanZ recently started a thread about the importance of non-verbal signals in communication and how the lack is responsible for a lot of the misunderstandings and arguments on here, and she is quite right, but robinw refused to take even that get out and went on incorporating snide little attacks like this:

By robinw on Thursday, 21 February, 2002 9:41:57 PM
I appreciate what you are saying JanZ but some of the personal abuse posted on mumsnet recently is clearly designed to insult and upset. It was defended as "vigorous debate" but abuse is not debate. We can tolerate any type of view on this site or try to set some sort of standard for what is acceptable.

By robinw on Thursday, 21 February, 2002 9:55:12 PM
This isn't a high crime area so I'm more concerned about bad behaviour in children (and those posting on mumsnet) than reported crime.

By robinw on Thursday, 21 February, 2002 7:04:10 AM
It is no kindness to the children to keep quiet as they will lack friends later. Could explain some of the people who post on mumsnet, jasper.

There are many more like this but these are just the most recent, and yes, I am aware that the date is the same as that on which she posted her "bereavement and grief" message but it makes no difference to the style and spirit of these messages which have been going on for weeks.

And this from the person who started a thread specifically for the "bigots and bitches" to have a "vigorous debate" away from her delicate sensibilities. I believe virtually nobody on mumsnet sets out to insult but if robinw thinks you have you are a non-person. If you are a member of her approved circle you probably don't even notice what she's doing.

Anyway I have had the say I wanted to say and I am off. It was nice knowing some of you.

bells2 · 26/02/2002 10:22

Janh, I admire your strength hugely. Please don't leave - I will miss your helpful and informative posts.

star · 26/02/2002 10:31

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jasper · 26/02/2002 10:35

Jahn, you say " some people have a gift for concise reasoned arguments".

In MHO you are definately one of these people!In the light of what you have just told us about your health I am even more impressed.

Please stay and keep contributing.

callie · 26/02/2002 10:38

Please Please Please!!! Don't go Janh. I for one love your posts and I have just been moved to tears by your post below.
Iam glad I wasn't the only one who noticed those comments by robinw I was begining to think I was paranoid. But just like you I have been thinking about not posting here anymore because of them.
In fact a couple of days ago I was in tears because it felt like Robinw was insulting my parents and the way they brought me up.
I know Iam sensitive but was too begining to feel like I eas being bullied.
Please Janh Don't leave here.

jasper · 26/02/2002 10:38

sorry,excuse pregnancy dyslexia, should have read janh

SueDonim · 26/02/2002 10:43

Janh, wishing you all the best for your health and hoping this year is better than the last one for you.

zoe7 · 26/02/2002 10:53

This is just a prime example of what I was talking about. Not only has robinw brought to tears a pregnant young woman who by all accounts is alone most weeks with a young toddler. Now she has also been upsetting and stressing out a wonderful woman who has been suffering from cancer.
I hope now robinw will see that she has to stop with the snide remarks. Especially refering to how these woman have been brought up by their own parents.
I can see that there are a lot of messages of support for robinw on the other thread and whilst what she is going through is sad it is not the same as losing your own parents or someone close to you. By all accounts robinw did not even get along with her MIL, although I know she will feel huge sympathies towards her dh it is not the same as the all consuming grief you feel when someone you love and cherish dies.

I probably haven't made myself popular by saying that but it is just how I see it and I probably won't post here again in the near future anway as I do post only sporadically.

My point is as there is so much sympathy out there , try giving some to Janh, who hasn't ever told us about her horrific year before and who could definitly do with some support here. I can't even imagine what it must be like to go through cancer whilst you have young children.
Whatever anyone thinks or doesn't think about robins posts the bottom line is they have upset a pregnant woman and a young mum coping with the pains and stresses of cancer and to be quite honest that sickens me.

Bugsy · 26/02/2002 11:07

Janh, sorry to hear about the awful time you've been having. Don't go!
There seems to be lots of tension on some of the boards right now, not sure why but I'm sure none of it can be meant personally. Sometimes, people just have very strong views and when others do too, I guess that's bound to lead to upset.
Can't really think of much more to add, only I hope that things get better for your Janh.

OP posts:
Marina · 26/02/2002 11:08

JanH, sorry to hear about your awful, awful year. We'd miss your postings, please don't go. It can be very hurtful when something you post gets ignored, I think many other mumsnetters feel the same. But it does not mean the opinions expressed are not valued, or taken on board. I think that since the site took off in such a big way, people genuinely don't see every posting in a thread.

star · 26/02/2002 11:18

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Tigger2 · 26/02/2002 12:04

Could someone, please tell me what Robinw is supposed to have done now? I was not particularly close to my MIL, but when she died I grieved for a long time, please do not judge Robinw, yes she can be a bit "sharp" sometimes, but can we all say hand on heart that we have never ever been bitchy towards anyone? I can't say I have, infact I can be down right bloody rude sometimes, so my mother says anyway!

Tigermoth · 26/02/2002 13:23

Janh, So sorry to hear about your hellish year. Please do stay.

Selfish wish coming up: you are one of the small group of regular posters who have older children - with the number of queries my oldest son generates, I need you! PS - my son's school shirt is now mostly buttoned before he puts in on. Helped our mornings no end.

I have to admit I feel guilty because I remembered from your first posts that you were undergoing diagnosis and treatment for breast cancer. Over the months I have wondered how things were going, but didnt ask. I suppose it was because you sounded so upbeat, and, mindful that this is the internet, I was reluctant to bring it up. I didn't know who knew your password, and who in your family might log on. Still, I could have just posted a general 'how are you'. So sorry again.

As for your comment about posts being ignored, just to say I put something similar on another tread recently. You are not alone. I do admit that since the site has grown, I have not the time to read everything, reply to all the messages I want to, or even to keep a conversation with one person going.

As for Robinw - we certainly have different views on some things - don't we Robin? - but we seem to rub along, and I do think, in her defence, that a bit of Robin baiting has gone on recently from numerous people (not you Janh). It's not all one sided.

It's so easy to take outspoken comments very personally. Especially when you're feeling vulnerable, seeing your views attacked or ridiculed on screen for all to see, is not good.

Lots of messages mix debate with insult, deliberately or not, resulting in crossed wires all round. I think there has been a lot of out of order comments in recent weeks.

I don't know what the answer is, except peace everyone! However I'd hate to see mumsnet getting all bland and - dare I say it - mumsy.

Rhubarb · 26/02/2002 14:27

It's easy to be insulting on Mumsnet as you can never see the impact you are making on the other person. You make your comment and then just switch off the computer and forget about it, and I think that is what happens with RobinW sometimes. She threw a few snide comments my way when I was posting under LisaV still (that isn't why I changed my nickname though), and I have to say that there really wasn't much need for it. I have never been particularly outspoken and was fairly taken aback that RobinW seemed to single me out. However didn't we used to have this problem with Jbr? She used to say some really controversial things, but as her comments were open and forthright (never snidey, she just got to the point) she got away with it more often than not. She hardly ever posted any helpful comments, she just used to pick on grammar mistakes and non-pc words! But we tolerated her, so I wonder what the difference is?

Please don't leave JanH, you were there for me when I posted on the Isolation thread, and I really appreciated your friendship at the time, you made a lot of difference to me. Surely all the comments here in support of you makes you realise that you have made lots of friends here. Don't turn away from us just because we are in cyber-space! Do post again, please!

zoe7 · 26/02/2002 17:33

O.k Tigermoth, I've got to ask. Who do you think has been "robin baiting". Because I honestly haven't seen any evidence of it. Saying something like that could have a lot of mums wondering if you are talking about them and I think that is when people start getting hurt and upset. Something none us {except robin I have to say] want.

tigermoth · 26/02/2002 17:41

Sorry Zoe, I'm keeping mum!

I think any insulting-slinging we've seen here is done in the heat of the moment, and I don't want to fan the flames.

zoe7 · 26/02/2002 17:48

Thats true , tigermoth. We are all guilty of saying things in the heat of the moment, even on the net. The problem with robins posts are that they seem to be more well thought out and cloaked attacks and they definitly have a superior air to them. As an avid reader here I can see how this might iritate and down right upset. As far as I can see robin w has NEVER once apologised for her snide comments on ANY thread. She simply doesn't seem to see the need.
Whereas any mumsnetters who post in the heat of the moment always seem to follow it up with an apology.

robinw · 26/02/2002 19:25

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