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Original poster

So, us rotten lot....

999 replies

scarredpierced · 11/04/2013 10:19

How many of us actually meet Shona's little sidekicks criteria?
She states that all of us on Mumsnet are in our 30s, living in London and have a degree. How many people here meet that criteria?
How many are popping prozac depressed at the shit life we now have with kids?
Damn that woman is nasty!

OP posts:
Scoobyblue · 19/04/2013 11:15

I was going to very happily say that I'm in my 30s, live in London and have a degree, but have just realised that I'm in fact 45. Boo hoo.....

lljkk · 19/04/2013 11:31

MrsJay: I shall explain Xenia-think (honest).

She reckons...The situation of women is still so oppressed that personal freedom/choice needs to take distant third place to our moral duty to set the right example for our daughters (forget sons, I think they don't matter, I am pretty sure Xenia views men as leeches anyway) and to establish a precedent of women as society's powerhouses in every arena. "The personal is the political" as Xenia often writes.

Didn't you realise that your life wasn't your life but it's a political statement instead? Wink

Xenia · 19/04/2013 11:43

I certainly we are all an example to all in all kinds of ways, not just by being successful working women who out earn men and want to rule the world but in other ways too.

Yes, some couples have a good balance but I think the rot which keeps many women down is marrying up as from that flow all the evils of being the pin money earner. This is changing. Women under 30 earn more than men now. So more women in their 20s are going to be choosing from a pool of men who will never earn as much as they do and that's really good . It means it is more likely men will do things fairly at home and women will get to rise to positions of power.

Maryz · 19/04/2013 12:20

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kotinka · 19/04/2013 12:25

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kotinka · 19/04/2013 12:29

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Maryz · 19/04/2013 12:29

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BrigitBigKnickers · 19/04/2013 12:40

48, under and post graduate degrees, 2 fairly easy teens, no pills, live in Essex.

Feelingood · 19/04/2013 12:55

I'd be scared to have Xenia round for dinner, might get wrong for cooking it a very least.

Xenia · 19/04/2013 13:45

I don't see why by conicidence though the "strengths2 women have are to clean up vomit, iron shirts and mind children and men have strengths to lead companies and have a fun life outside the home with a wife doing the domestic stuff. Sounds like a pretty awful set of strengths to be given if you have that kind of a sexist view.

if 50% of the women on the thread earned more than their husbands and/or their husbands stayed at home whilst they worked I woudl have no problem with those different relationships. Instead men own 99% of the world's wealth and women get lumbered with dull childcare and housecleaning 24/7 time and again and many of them don't like it and it's very unfair and leads to a very unequal planet. Every woman on mumsnet who finds her strengths just happen to lie with the duster and in the kitchen is ensuring that inequality continues.

Feelingood · 19/04/2013 14:14

A strength - don't you mean personal choice or even in some case enjoying, no loving, looking after their children.

Looking after your child is the most important job you will ever do whether some aspects are considered dull, and whether it is done by either parent.

JugglingFromHereToThere · 19/04/2013 14:20

I agree there's a problem Xenia - I just don't agree with your analysis of it, or see that you really offer a solution !

mathanxiety · 19/04/2013 14:52

There are a lot of men who don't find life outside the home fun. This is reflected in health stats. There are millions of men who are out there day in and day out doing work they do not enjoy and do not get any respect for, not the 'leading companies' sort of dashing career you use to illustrate your point. For every one company leader there are millions of road warriors and road workers and binmen and farmers out saving lambs in the snow and mechanics and solicitors scraping by, and all the rest of the men out there who are never going to have CEO after their name. And for every woman who feels she is being driven nuts by the day in and day out slog of taking care of small children and the home there is at least one more who loves every bit of it and will look back on it as the best time of her life. There are dull and unfulfilling moments in the lives of 99.9% of people.

exoticfruits · 19/04/2013 19:16

I get so depressed at being continually called a drudge and that child care is dull. It beats any career in my view.
I also get fed up at being told I was sacrificing myself for a man. I was a widow. I was having my free and best choice.

mrsjay · 19/04/2013 19:20

that's what is pissing me off mrsjay. I care not a jot the choices that other people make, as we all do what we can with the life we have made for ourselves, but I object strongly to be doing told that my way of life is intrinsically wrong just because it is different to someone else's and that I am being oppressed by my dominant husbeast because I have been forced to give up my lovely career to pander to his every whim. That is insulting in the extreme.

yes it pisses me off too and it is insulting to think if women are not back at work the next day after giving birth or out working 100s hours a week then they are a lesser person just gets right on my wick #

I did Grin @ your husbeast though,

exoticfruits · 19/04/2013 19:21

I can also think of a lot of men who would love to get off the career ladder and have a life. My father had a high powered job and he was going to retire early, live by the sea with a sailing dinghy and get back to painting. It was so sad that he died before he had the chance- and that all he had was work. I think that people have a lot of regrets at the end of their life but 'I wish I had spent more time in the office' rarely features-not if they know what really matters in life. I think that plenty of men wish they had spent more time with their children as they were growing up-they realise how short it was.

mrsjay · 19/04/2013 19:25

I am sorry about your dad exotic
I agree with you about people working far too hard and it taking over their life,

Sparklingbrook · 19/04/2013 19:31

My Grandad died a month after he retired. My Nan spent the last 32 years of her life feeling cheated out of their 'growing old together'. Sad They ran a Post Office together so don't know where that would go in the 'marrying up' thing.

exoticfruits · 19/04/2013 19:32

There is room for all sorts. I think that Xenia said somewhere that she isn't going to retire. I don't mind her feeling that way at all-I just object to being told that we should all feel that way. I enjoy working but it is only ever the means to have the life I want -it isn't the reason I live. I wouldn't want children if I couldn't be with them most of the time. I don't want just the quality bits when I can fit them around work. I want to fit work around the DCs and I couldn't care less that my career suffers and DH's doesn't-it is what I wanted-it was MY choice.

mrsjay · 19/04/2013 20:00

isn't feminism all about choice anyway ? we all do what is making us and our families happy I am not a drudge who gave up my life for a man I what we all do is making the best of life

exoticfruits · 19/04/2013 20:15

Feminism is choice. We are all different and I can't see why that can't be accepted, even if we wouldn't like it for ourselves. I can quite see that some women would climb the walls at home and find a career more satisfying. Xenia can't seem to understand that while I understand that her job is deeply satisfying to her, I would be bored by it. It doesn't mean one is right and one wrong- just different.

Xenia · 19/04/2013 21:30

well it's some choice -though that women choose so often to sacrifice everything for a man who often deserts them and then they regret they earn nothing. Some choice. Isn't it just just the choice of the Pakistani or Saudi housewife who thinks she w3ants that - no job tied down to hearth and home and yes she is choosing it because that's the sexist culture. She hasn't realised how bad the deal is that chains her to the home but if she reads enough of our posts on mumsnet the scales will be lifted from her eyes and she will get a more balanced happier less sexist life.

mrsjay · 19/04/2013 21:38

*She reckons...The situation of women is still so oppressed that personal freedom/choice needs to take distant third place to our moral duty to set the right example for our daughters (forget sons, I think they don't matter, I am pretty sure Xenia views men as leeches anyway) and to establish a precedent of women as society's powerhouses in every arena. "The personal is the political" as Xenia often writes.

Didn't you realise that your life wasn't your life but it's a political statement instead?*

Ok then I have been doing it ALL wrong obviously Wink

mrsjay · 19/04/2013 21:39

if we were talking about these saudi housewives xenia i would agree with you I really would but I dont think that is what we are talking about here

JugglingFromHereToThere · 19/04/2013 21:49

We all make our way through the patriarchy, and our lives, as best we can !
And we should support one another, and respect each other's choices sister !