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Original poster

why do church schools have such good reputations?

122 replies

startingtobehalloweenylover · 26/10/2005 17:02

The best school in my area is a Catholic one and it would seem from various threads on here that this is the case in a lot of other places too...

but why? is it a respect thing? do church schools seem to have better "control" (for want of a better word) of the children... is it the school environment... is it just the kids that go there?

hmmmm

OP posts:

zippitippitoes · 26/10/2005 19:07

dp went to a church school and also to church weekly but neither he nor his sibs were "model pupils" and did nothing to further the schools excellent reputation at that time or benefit from it

it has dropped in the last few years from what semed a permanent slot as the best in the area

so really it's not necessarily the case

this particular school was very popular with middle class parents at one time..a bit progressive and got the results

the head changed the ethos changed and the non church parnets drifted and the school started to sink down in achievement and reputation

puff · 26/10/2005 19:08

Have friend who works in beacon status RC primary school. It's all in the selection process. The % of children with special needs in her school is significantly lower than the area average.

puff · 26/10/2005 19:10

Oh and parp or is it toot?

skinnycow · 26/10/2005 19:11

ds now goes to a CofE school and just in the last half term I can see his attitude to school work has changed - obviously my children are extremely well behaved and respectful but at his old school he could have been accused of being "lazyish"

Blu · 26/10/2005 19:28

Parp maybe - but in addition to the other likely reasons (including the discipline and focus implied in religious observance), there are a percentage of families in every religious school who conform exactly to Aloha's analysis.

jellyhead · 26/10/2005 19:35

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

gingerbear · 26/10/2005 19:45

Our local RC primary has poor SATS results, terrible attendance record & a higher than average absentee record. However, it also has a high proporton of special needs children and19% of the families are from the traveller community.
BUT, the ethos is caring and respectful and the children very well behaved in classes.
So why isn't it a top notch faith school? Maybe the fact that it welcomes children of all abilities has something to do with it.

gingerbear · 26/10/2005 19:46

errible attendance record & a higher than average absentee record...
Drat, should edit first.

PeachyClairBingoBabe · 26/10/2005 20:46

Ours is good and I think it's because of good discipline/ parental input and community support. However, they've started teaching creationism. We have no school choice as it's the only one in village, but I could do with a slightly lower place on the league in exchange for more wide raranging views.

I did offer to go in and help do something for Diwali (related to my degree), but they only do Judaism as an alternative to Christianity, as that's just coz they can read the same bible stories again.

twinsetandpearls · 27/10/2005 01:03

I think church schools tend to be good because often you ahve to jump through hoops to get into them so they attract parents who care about education and are therefore supportive of the school.

The points made about community are valid as well, my dd will go to the local Catholic primary because it is our parish school, to get into the school (with a few exceptions as set out by the LEA) you need to go to church. I would say on average about ten kids in every class at least will be week in and week out from birth church attenders. The head master and many of the staff also attend mass, this means that I will know many of the parents and staff and will see them on a weekly basis. This must improve behaviour as the kids know that their parents will find out if they get up to something.

I have also noticed that all the single class entry schools in our town are faith ones. Having taught in large schools I know discipline and high standards are harder to mantain in larger schools just because it is difficult for the staff to know all the children.

Enid · 27/10/2005 09:02

dd goes to a church school and it is absolutely fantastic, mainly because of the tireless work done by the head and the strong ethos of sharing and community. so there.

I am beginning to think that experiences of education in London are so massively different to those outside London that its pointless trying to have a reasoned discussion.

Enid · 27/10/2005 09:04

and they do diwali

Blu · 27/10/2005 09:28

Enid - excellent that your kids DO get a great experience in your local village faith school, and that you are happy with it. But it isn't just in London that the experience is not always so great. My niece and nephew in a rural area a long way from you have only CoE schools for miles around. Academically o.k, but they are being taught a very tigt model of morals re marriage, who can have children, creationism, etc.

I guess there are differences - in rural areas, the CoE is very often the only altrnative - so the religious motive and focus of parents may not be so intense - you don't have to prove church attendance to get there.

Where I live, the best school in the borough is a Catholic primary, at the bottom of the hill, and one of the worst schools in the borough is the catholic primary at the top of the hill.

There may be averages which show that faith schools do better, but you can only ever look at an individual school to consider what makes it tick - or not!

OrribleOliveoil · 27/10/2005 09:29

dd1 did sparkly light holder things (glitter!!! ) for Divali at her playgroup linked to the CofE school. Think they do all the main religious ceremony things.

Enid · 27/10/2005 09:32

yes but maybe only in London and parts of the South East are they the domain of the middle class, faith-pretending parent. In some rural areas they are the norm rather than the exception - for better or worse as Blu's experience describes.

Blu · 27/10/2005 09:39

I think faith-pretending is very likely a London phenomenum! Not to mention the sudden need for middle-class high-earning families to move into tiny 1 or 2 bedroom flats overlooking a playground for a year (or less).
And maybe a few other places where community schools are not up to scratch, it's big enough to have more than one school which happens to be faith! (I do know of a sudden religious convert in a comfy part of middle england!)

aloha · 27/10/2005 09:58

Creationism?! Oh what are they going to teach next? Use science lessons to tell kids that walking under ladders is proven to cause bad luck?
Why do I have to fund this mumbo-jumbo & superstition?
Oh....PARP!!

Blu · 27/10/2005 10:01

And 'doing Diwali' is one thing - what if the local school started teaching re-incarnation as a fact, and building it in to the fabric of teaching across the curriculum?

Parp - we will be a traffic jam in a minute, Aloha!

buffytheharpsichordcarrier · 27/10/2005 10:06

it's the lack of choice that really p**ses me off. all the schools around me are CofE.
statefunded, natch.
the nearest secular one is miles away and hugely oversubscribed (on an estate with lots of young children) so I am v unlikely to get a place there.
and worst of all I keep trying to start a row about it on MN and no-one will fight with me....

RachD · 27/10/2005 10:21

All the best schools round us are CofE.
Whole of dh's family is catholic.
All have gone to local CofE primary schhol.
It is the best.
I will do my utmost to make sure ds gets in.
Sent in his application when he was only a couple of months old !!!

Agree with twinset - schools are better because parents care and really want their children to be there.

Plus, you needed a degree to work out thei admissions policy !!

We are not really catholic.
Not really church attenders.
But have had ds christened in the catholic church.
Dh and I have agreed that we will go to mass, from time to time, only to get ds into school.

I admit the fact that I would go to quite some lengths to get ds in.

Go on shoot me down.
I know I deserve it.
I am willingly playing the game.

Blu · 27/10/2005 10:24

BuffyHarpy - you are just not concentrating at the back!
There have been LOADS of rows about this, and where were you? Gazing out of the window! If you've got somnething else more important to think about, maybe you should share it with the whole class! Come up here to the front...

piffle · 27/10/2005 10:28

I herard a joke about this the other day
A kid joined a catholic school after being expelled for naughty behaviour at his local non denom primary school.
He came back from his first day eager to do his homework and polite and respectful - a changed boy infact!
After a few days of this reformed behaviour the parents asked their son what had brought about this massive change
He replied
" When I saw that picture of the other poor bastard they'd nailed to a cross I knew they weren't pissing around"

bossykate · 27/10/2005 10:30

sorry, blu, i've just looked at the tables and there are no catholic primaries in the bottom half of the table.

buffytheharpsichordcarrier · 27/10/2005 10:34

oh Blu! don't tell me I missed them...
honsetly, I have tried at least three times to start a row. All that happens is I end up agreeing with edam. and tortoiseshell says something incredibly reasonable and the thread dies...
no criticism from me RachD. you do what you have to do.

Blu · 27/10/2005 10:34

What's that one near Holmewood Gardens / upper Tulse Hill? That was way down last year, wasn't it?

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