Is this my sons fault or nursery’s fault?

[Mummymummymummyy]

I just had an email from my 4years old pre school saying there was an incident today and I need to sign the form when he next comes in- as they didn’t mention at pick up. The incident is that he opened the fire door which leads to the nursery main door which opens onto a busy road. The tone of the email is all about how bad it is my son did this and how shocked they all were. It says they they had a talk with him about safety and how bad it is to open the door, and can I also talk to him. I’m glad they took it seriously and mentioned it, but I’m kind of annoyed and wondering if I should be. Surely the issue is that a nursery isn’t properly child proof, if a door can be opened by a child. It’s not like I have taught him to open doors and although of course I will talk to him about it- surely they themselves need to address this. a precious nursery he went to had buttons up high to press to open doors, and buzzers etc.

am I unreasonable to be annoyed?

Yes but they have asked her to sign a document!
Of course she will be teaching her son not to touch things but he is not under her supervision whilst at nursery. He is 4 not 14!

This is on the nursery and if I was OP I wouldn’t sign anything. It may be a disclaimer which implied nursery not at fault if something else happens!

What a silly comment. I hope you don't work in the industry.

A child of four is an unknown quantity. He either understands and doesn't want to, or he has not understood, or has forgotten.

The OP is paying for a service. That service is to provide care for her child while she is at work, or otherwise engaged. If you pay for a service you should get what you paid for.

There is a law on providing goods and services and if the service in preschool services is lacking, then the law is being broken, just as much as in any other industry.

The email the OP received could well indicate that there is a lack of security in the class and the staff are covering their backs and blaming the child. Ridiculous. The staff are in loco parentis. That means they are responsible for the safety of the child as soon as they accept responsibility until the child's parent comes to collect it.

There is no excuse.

DON'T sign anything.

You are paying for a service. You are paying someone to care for your child - in loco parentis.

As soon as your child is dropped off he is their responsibility until you collect him.

They cannot enforce that anyway. If your four year old opens a door and leaves the room, it is their responsibility, not yours. I think they should be reported to whatever authority gives them the licence.

If a child can open a door the child is not being supervised properly. If it is a fire door, then the local Fire service should be called in for advice on how the children can be physically prevented from opening the door.

What sort of fire door is it if a child of four can open it? These are usually very heavy doors.

Perhaps the preschool should not be located in that area?

Staff act in loco parentis from the time the child is dropped off and can be collected. The same applies in all schools.

When you pay someone for a service, you should receive the service you paid for. See Sale of Goods and Services Act. It applies to all services.

A school environment is not the same as the home environment. Children know they cannot go out of the front door on their own, but a school building is different. It is for the staff to ensure the safety of all children.

Fire doors are heavy. If a child can open them, the Fire Service should be informed.

Staff are paid to take care of little children. There is no excuse that the fire door must be left open. Perhaps the location is wrong for a pre school group.

If you pay for a service, you should get what you paid for. A school is no exception. They act in loco parentis. That means they are responsible, fire door or not.

Paint a big red triangle on it and teach the children what triangles - and huge exclamation marks in red mean.

I cannot believe that so many posters on this thread - who I assume are parents in the main - that seem to think that when a parent pays for a service of care of their child they have to bear the responsibility for that child, even though they are paying someone else to do that. Why?

When a child is in his own home, it is the parent's duty to ensure the child is safe and not be able to escape to explore the outside on his own. The parent has to make sure the house is safe for their children. I think all children know not to leave the house alone at such a young age. It is not the same as another location.

When a child is in preschool/nursery/kindergarten etc the parents pay for the child's safety. The staff are in loco parentis as soon as the child is dropped off. They are responsible for the child's safety and welfare in the absence of parents.

They are failing in their duty if a child can open a door and leave the room. There is no excuse. They are responsible.

Do you know how stupid your post is? What you teach a child of four at home is completely different in another setting.

Home is where they are most of the time. They know the house and the house rules. The parents are responsible for ensuring their child's safety at home, and if the child has always lived in the same place, by four he is familiar with it and the rules set by parents.

When the child is in preschool - or any school - it is the responsibility of the staff to care for the child. The parents pay for a service and are not responsible for the child when dropped off. The school is then in loco parentis, which means they are responsible for the child.

The school is not the same as home. It has to have separate rules to abide by, and the staff are responsible for the safety and well being of the children in their care. That is the law. They cannot blame the parent for anything which happens at school.

I am wondering how anyone cannot know that?

You’ve absolutely taken it completely out of context! We are talking about a four year old being accountable for something adults should be. Safeguarding plays a massive part here!
im fully aware that adults can’t keep an eye on all at all times, but we are talking about a child who made it as far as a corridor door! Pretty irresponsible!

OP didn't say he made it as far as the corridor, she just said that's where the door led too. Her child might not have even left the room. He may have just opened the fire door and was told to shut it. There is no indication he was in danger or that he wasn't being supervised.

Any update?
@Mummymummymummyy

We've literally just had our push bar ones upgraded - they've been replaced by newer ones which are more up to modern standards. And guess what, they are the same as the ones that @starsinthedarksky have, with electronic locks that you type a code in to get in or out. Apparently if the fire alarm goes off they should open, we will see when we do our fire drill.

There's never a straight forward answer to the safest way of entering and exiting a school building. Our new fire doors may work well in case of fire, but in buildings that have those type of electronic code locks I wonder what would happen in lockdown procedure where an intruder had managed to get into a building. A shooter or someone armed with a knife. If the supervising adult was unconscious, or dead, how could people who didn't know the code, get out quickly? Are they then locked in the building with the intruder unable to escape? Or is there a "panic button" type of thing which would open the doors? But then, someone would have to know where that was, and that it was safe to use it and that you weren't going to let more intruders in!

You can imagine scenario after scenario, and there isn't just one perfect door/lock for every type of situation.

He may have just opened the fire door and was told to shut it. There is no indication he was in danger or that he wasn't being supervised.

The incident form is what suggests that there was a danger. Preschools don't make you sign an incident form in every time your child is told off.

Excellent response !! Keep it simple and concise so they understand their responsibility

It has to be able to be opened by a child, what if the fire occurs and the teacher passes out or something?

They do if it could have been dangerous