What should I do about husband's demands?

[paulaL]

Hi, this is my first posting on mumsnet, although I'm a regular visitor to the site. I know that you are a supportive, non-judgemental bunch, which is why I am turning to you now for advice. I have got a wonderful circle of real friends but this is not the sort of problem that I could ever discuss with them because I don't know whether they would laugh or be shocked. I know what I'm about to say probably will sound funny, but to me it is a very real problem, and one that is occupying every waking thought at the moment.
I have been married to the most wonderful, loving man for the past 10 years and we have 4 gorgeous children. Our sex life, I thought, has always been quite good, although my husband dropped a bombshell last week and told me that he finds it boring. Naturally I felt devastated, but he did reassure me that that he still is in love with me and doesn't want anyone else. He suggested that we try some experimentation, which I was reasonably happy to go along with, until he said that he wanted us to dress as animals (his suggestion was horses) I wouldn't say that I am a prude, but I felt a bit taken aback. I would feel foolish dressed as a horse and if I feel silly how can I feel in the mood for sex? At the same time, I love him and want him to be happy. What do you think I should do?

[Kia]

My instinct is now screaming say no, Paula. If you must do it, don't do anything that makes you loose your own self respect. Can you do it without 'dutch courage' and can you face yourself in the morning, is what I would ask myself.

I don't want to undermine your belief in your relationship with your husband, but he is already living most men's fantasies working where he does and he may have already asked one of the girls to play horsey and been told to naff off. I'd say your initial reaction is the same as any other woman's regardless of what she does for a living. Be careful and think of yourself in this too.

[mollipops]

PaulaL, I don't have much to add except that I think you are very brave to post as you did, and I hope you have considered your own feelings/needs carefully, as well as those of your dh. Maybe working in that kind of environment has made him think more about erotic or kinky things (like men don't already think about it enough lol ).

Anyway, if you do decide to go ahead with it, I hope you have a lock on your bedroom door! Hope it all turns out well for you.

[tigermoth]

Good luck,PaulaL. As you find out more about this and other sexual variations, perhaps you'll discover something that appeals to you more.

Hope your husband is as understanding as you, if you present him with an option you'd like him to try. Fair's fair after all!

[bloss]

Message withdrawn

[amelia]

well PaulaL, good for you for giving it a go but I have no idea about how dressing up as a horse - which is bound to look like a panto thing - will be less uncomfortable than the wearing of sexy undies. is it a panto thing where you are both in the same costume? Who'd go in front?? Could be good fun!!! Oh this is making me laugh now. I'm sorry, but i just can't get my head round how sex is going to work and what you would actually do. Would watching porn that features this sort of thing help? And i so want to know what's in his contact mags! Other people's sex lives are fascinating I think, but as someone said, we shouldn't get our kicks vicariously. I'd happily dress up in thigh length boots and a thong if it'd help things along for a change and who says sex can't be a bloody good laugh - Enjoy!! And tell us how you get on anyway, we won't know it's you even if we're next to you at Tescos checkout!

[Moomin]

I am SO sorry if there's some poor person out there wondering whether tonight's the night she'll be harnessed up and subjected to an evening with a dh who thinks he's Champion the Wonder hourse, but REALLY... PaulaL, this is a wind up isn't it? You're taking the p.....

[Moomin]

For hourse read HORSE!

[Enid]

We had friends over for dinner on Friday night, and once I mentioned this mumsnet thread, boy, did the conversation get started!

It IS a wind up, isn't it? I mean, HOW?? WHERE?? WHY??

[salalex]

Oh don't be mean. I don't think it's a wind up. Why would she? Anyway, you only have to watch Channel 4 to realise that this may be strange to some folk but my word, there's a lot stranger going on. Whatever lights your candle PaulaL, you carry on. Ooo Amelia, thigh length boots...!!!

[tigermoth]

Well, as for me, the jury's out on this.

I have read about some very strange ( to me) happenings in the bedroom: men who like to dress up as babies, couples who parade around in matching furry animal costumes .... and why not? as long as it harms no one.

[Rhubarb]

I'm sorry, I saw the word 'horse' in the beginning lines to this thread and my curiosity got the better of me. After the initial 'Ohmigod' (sorry) I thought about it and came up with this:

Sorry if someone else has beat me to this particular piece of advice PaulaL - but tell him to stuff it! It is the most ridiculous idea I have ever heard of! To me sex is supposed to be special, an intimate bonding between husband and wife. Ok, it's fine to have fun with it, it is meant to be enjoyable as well, but dressing up as animals is simply degrading it. Animals hump with no emotion, it is the crudest form of sex, you and your husband are civilised human beings for Heaven's sake! I would find it degrading, humiliating and offensive to be asked. And if you say 'yes' to this, what else will he come up with?

If you feel uncomfortable at his suggestions then you should not do it. He is putting pressure on you to satisfy his own desires and that is unfair. Sod the girls at the club, you are his wife and if you feel that he might run off with them then what marriage do you have? You should be able to trust each other and respect each other's feelings. I would tell him in no uncertain terms 'no' and explain why. If he cannot accept this then I would suggest counselling - seriously! For him that is! Sounds all very Freudian to me!

Can't you just do it doggy style and have done with it?

[sniksnak]

How are you PaulaL? I hope you haven't been upset by messages implying that you are making this all up - along with others I'd like to say how brave you are to make this posting. We could all do well to remember that this board exists to pool advice and knowledge, not to offer meaningless judgements.

I was even more concerned to learn about your dh's work environment and your fears about the girls who work there. I do feel this is an example of the fact that constant exposure to attitudes and images of sex (as opposed to making love) do change our views, desires and standards of what is normal/acceptable. I know I wouldn't be able to stand my dh working in such an environment.

It worries me greatly that you sound sadly acquiescent about taking part in what he has suggested - your original post made your discomfort and confusion quite clear. Don't perform degrading acts because you are trying to keep your dh in love with you, or out of fear that he will find someone else to do it with - if he really loved you he would not pressure you to do it if you voiced your real feelings.

Tell him exactly what you've told us. If he won't leave the issue alone I'm afraid I would insist on going to a counsellor/sex therapist, as otherwise this will prove to be a very destructive force in your relationship.

Good luck and thinking of you.

[tigermoth]

I'm no zoologist, but I feel uneasy with the view that when animals mate it is degrading and dirty - what about those animals who have one mate for life? Emotion, as we know it, may be lacking, but don't many species of animals then go on to look after their young with extreme care?

To us, animal sex might seem disgusting. To animals isn't it simply nature?

[paulaL]

Thanks again to those of you who were so understanding and offered such constructive advice. I'm sorry that some of you think this is a wind up, it really isn't, though I can appreciate why you think it might be. Have to say though, I am surprised by some of the conservative attitudes to sex within marriage expressed here. You don't really think that just because you and your husband don't do it, others don't either? Are you really sure that your husbands would not like to try something different but are too embarrassed to say? In some ways, I'm glad that my husband did let me in on his fantasy. Ok, it may not be my idea of fun but at least he felt secure enough to tell me. I suppose that is one of the strengths of our relationship, we're honest with each other. My husband says that 99% of the men who visit his club are business/working/family men, very normal looking and not the dirty mac brigade that you may think. I wonder how many of their wives and girlfriends know that they go there? All men have sexual fantasies, some the stereotypical type, some rather more strange, but at the end of the day atleast I know what my husband's really is, how many other women can really say the same?
Haven't given his suggestion a go yet, but I will because I love him. Now that it has had time to sink in and I've had time to think things over, I'm feeling happier about things as at least we've got two important things going for our relationship, honesty and openness. Thanks.

[Rhubarb]

Tigermoth - I appreciate that animals do what they have to do to survive. What I was getting at is that we are not like that, to ask us to behave as animals is degrading to us. Whenever anything is done with apparent disregard for others, it is described as an 'animal act'. For not all that is natural is very pleasant, after all animals also kill and eat each other.

We are the only animals to express such complex emotions and sex is one of them. I'm sorry if this sounds so conservative, but sex is supposed to be an act of love. It is a shame that so many people now take great pride in having so many partners, it's as if sex isn't special anymore. I don't know about anyone else's partner but I do know that my dh would never go to erotica clubs. If he wants to try something different that's fine. Sex can be fun too, it would be boring if we just did one position the whole time. But if he asked me to do something I did not feel uncomfortable with I would not do it, just as I would not expect him to do anything he felt uncomfortable with. It has happened actually, I said no and the subject has not been broached since. But at least he does know that he can ask me stuff like that.

At the end of the day I want my husband to make love to me, not a horse! I want him to look me in the eyes afterwards. Lots of women get upset if their husbands admit to thinking about other women when they make love, never mind horses! I doesn't matter what you do whilst having sex, so long as your partner is doing it with you and not pretending that you are not there at all. That's the bit I find so disrespectful.

But if you want to go ahead PaulaL that's fine. As someone said, it's not hurting anyone and as long as you are comfortable with the idea....

[Janus]

I am so surprised no-one has mentioned last night's SO GRAHAM NORTON, the whole theme was on horses and, as you expect!, it then went on to show various costumes for those people who fantacise about sleeping with horses. So, there you go, it is a real fantasy that obviously quite a few people indulge in. PaulaL, it looked quite revolting, the different costumes pretty much bordered on S&M, with harnesses, whips, etc. I would really check on how far your husband wants to go before you do agree to this.
Also, I'm sorry but your initial posting said you were 'taken aback' and would feel 'foolish' to go along with his suggestion. I don't care if people want to whip eachother senseless or whatever AS LONG AS BOTH AGREE. Don't do this to 'please him' only do it if you think you might enjoy it too. Really question your motives here, if you don't agree with it but decide to do it anyway you will feel degraded and it could be a really damaging experience. Do think hard.

[Enid]

Well, good for you paulal. You go girl! But it just seemed such a specific fantasy that it didn't quite ring true. Did you watch graham norton?

[tigermoth]

PaulaL, it's really now all up to you, isn't it? Your husband has been open with you - a very great plus, as you say. You now have the choice. As long as this is not causing hurt, and you want to try it, then, IMO it's`not degrading.

On the other hand, in your heart of hearts, if you don't want to try it but go ahead to please your husband, then it would be degrading - just as any other way of making love would be in this circumstance.

IMO it's the lack of mutual consent and respect, not the act itself, that makes it degrading or not.

It sounds like you have an honest relationship with your husband. Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

[Cazhass]

PaulaL - the title on this thread made me 'look in' Thursday is my 'mumsnet night' (dh pub with friends) and I have to say I read you post and laughed so much I cried, had a bath and a glass of wine, returned and read the replies then began to take it all seriously. I can't understand why working in an erotic club would encourage 'animal' tendancies - fixing a pole to the bedrooom and encouraging you to slide and slither yes!. Anyway like many have said at least he feels he can be honest with you. Perhaps you could suggest a pig (miss piggy style: pink fluffy headband, pink undies and a few grunts and demands - (sorry!!) If you have enjoyed a perfectly happy regular sex life (with 4 children well done love) then the animal thing seems a huge jump (sorry again) But then again with Graham Norton featuring it - perhaps it is quite common (I, again have led a very sheltered life!!)-Hope I don't regret this reply in the morning....

[Rara]

Just to put my two penneth in - PaulaL, you say that 1stly your dh said he found your sex life a bit of a let-down, even tho you were quite happy with it. The he introduced the idea of the horse stuff. It sounds like he's had this fantasy for quite a while, as the usual avenue for a mundane sex life would usually be the more expected experimentation, wouldn't it , like watching/reading porn together, sexy undies, different places and positions, etc. If this is the case, I'd definitely take on board what others have said about it having to be MUTUALLY agreed and enjoyable for both of you. If he's got such a set idea of what will turn him on rather than just a notion that your sex life needs "pepping up", it sounds more of an issue that needs to be dealt with by a professional of some description. You can arrange to see sex counsellors thru Relate if you want to pursue this. Don't agree to sg you're not happy with as you'll both end up unhappy in the end.

[Tortington]

why dont you do the graham norton thing? say your well up for horses - it really floats your boat - but only if he sticks the tail up his bottom and puts a bit in his mouth! switch it round - see how he feels, this is what i said to mine when he fancied it this way too! yes paula you are not alone! the outcome is one day a week is kinky night we take it in turns - i can always think of something more degrading if he pushes his luck!

[Rhubarb]

Really Custard! I say giddup! Seriously though, do tell what your dh had in mind please!

[Wallace]

Just read this

[Wallace]

No I didn't, I just read the pirate one and followed the link to this one, and accidently posted on the wrong one

[noddyholder]

You can give it a go and if you hate it don't do it again Although there must be other ways to spice things up as this conjures up images of panto costumes and shall i shan't i but thats probably just me