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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

MNHQ here with a request...

45 replies

RowanMumsnet · 18/09/2019 15:22

Hello

As part of our Publish Parental Leave campaign, we want MNers to ask their bosses/management whether they publish their parental leave policies for all to see - and if they don’t, we’d like you to ask whether they’d consider it.

You can find out more about the reasons behind the campaign here, but essentially it’s a way to help close the gender pay gap, give prospective parents the information they need to plan for children, and encourage a race to the top among big organisations.

We recognise that this ask will be most applicable to bigger organisations - those with 250+ employees. If you work for one of those we would LOVE you to pop the question.

If you work for a smaller organisation we’d still love you to ask, but we realise that if it’s a two-woman start-up, the chances are everyone has quite a lot on their plate already.

And of course we know some of you ARE the boss. In which case, please take yourself into a corner office and have a word with yourself, agree to publish and then slap yourself on the back. (Maybe draw the blinds first.)

Finally, we know most of you won’t (understandably) want to say on here who you work for. We would really appreciate it if you could email us on [email protected] to tell us which organisation you’ve spoken to and what the response was. Your email to us won’t be linked with your Mumsnet user name and we promise we won’t share your email address or name with ANYONE unless you’ve given us express permission.

So, to upsum:

1 Please ask your employer whether they publicly publish their parental leave policies.
2 If they don’t, please ask them if they’ll consider doing so. (You can find all the reasons why they should here, and you can see a list of FTSE100 companies who already do here, plus a further list of more FTSE100 companies who’ve promised to start doing it here.)
3 Please say here (if you want to) or email us on [email protected] to tell us which company you asked, and what the response was
4 Cake!

We’ve put together a draft email for you if you’d like to use it - copy is below.

Thank you!
MNHQ

[draft email]

Dear [boss/Head of HR]

I wanted to ask whether we publicly publish our parental leave policies anywhere - and if we don’t, whether you would consider doing so.

As you probably know, starting a family is expensive and it really helps people to be able to plan how much they will need to save, how much time they will have off, how they might be able to split paid leave with their spouse or partner, and how much childcare they will need to pay for.

Mumsnet is campaigning for organisations to publish how many weeks of leave people are entitled to, and at what level it is paid.

Being able to find this information on company websites means that job-seekers don’t have to ask at interview - which, understandably, they are very reluctant to do because they fear it would make a job offer less likely. You can see Mumsnet’s figures on this here.

Pregnancy and maternity discrimination hits women very hard, so understandably they’re reluctant to ask potential employers for information that gives away the fact they want to start a family. This means they are flying blind in this important respect when applying for new positions, and aren’t able to gauge how far employers genuinely welcome parents on staff.

We would be in good company if we do this: more than one-quarter of the FTSE100 already do, and a further 19 FTSE100 companies have committed to publishing or considering publishing their parental leave policies.

I’d love to see [our company] take this step. It’s an easy, cost-free change that demonstrates commitment to equality and diversity, and it could make a real difference.

Yours etc,
[Ms/Mr Mumsnetter]

OP posts:
FirstTim3Mummy · 18/09/2019 16:45

Hello! Ours is available on the intranet and I was able to find and read it before announcing my pregnancy! PM me and I can tell you the company I work for, it's known for car breakdown.

It's not good pay. Only 6 weeks 90% pay then statutory. No pay after 9 months. Accrue holidays and bank holidays that can be used at the end of mat leave.

My plan is to take the 9 months (any more and I won't be paid for it) and then use my holidays (will be around 20 days) to do a phased return to work. I work Mon to Thurs 28 hours a week so not full time already which is good otherwise I would have requested to go part time

Hope that's helpful x

AutumnCrow · 18/09/2019 17:24

Good campaign. Thank you.

I'm a gimmer now but fought for this stuff for other women and me when I was a bit younger. It's really important.

Itsarainyday555 · 18/09/2019 17:44

@FirstTim3Mummy is that the intranet or the internet? I think the aim is for the policy to be available to see (i.e on the internet) rather than just employees.

FirstTim3Mummy · 18/09/2019 17:53

Ohh i didn't realise it meant public to non employees? Definitely intranet and NOT internet. @RowanMumsnet can you clarify please? I'd have to ask and I'm pretty sure it was isn't!

FirstTim3Mummy · 18/09/2019 17:54

@Itsarainyday555 I think you're right after reading the template email! Sorry. I'll send the email :)

EggysMom · 18/09/2019 18:13

I believe I have already posted this public link: cdn.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Family-friendly-policy.pdf

Ratbagcatbag · 18/09/2019 18:21

I work for one of the 23 in your list that already does it. :) I found it really useful when I was planning maternity leave as they also run some excellent courses. One before you go off, one as a kit session when you're off and one when you come back.

CountFosco · 18/09/2019 19:51

I wonder how many companies have the same policy across all sites? We've been bought twice in the time I've worked at this site and in neither case did any HR policy change. So I don't even know if my colleagues at a different UK site have the same maternity policy.

Garfieldsarm · 18/09/2019 21:07

This is so important.

Nobody will bring it up at interview because it screams "I'm going to get pregnant and be off for at least a year!" (Which shouldn't matter, but it bloody does.)

And then you find yourself at the mercy of the company's policy. I was massively lucky and landed on my feet with 6 months' full pay; the policy had been changed a few days before I joined from 12 weeks' pay. It was absolute pure luck.

When I'm choosing a new job, I look at salary, promotion prospects, prospective bonus, annual leave... why shouldn't I also factor in sick pay, parental leave and maternity pay?

Failure to publish is indirect discrimination against women.

EmeraldIsle81 · 18/09/2019 22:04

The company I work for recently brought in the same pay and time off for fathers as for mothers. They have used it as a big PR event. You can google it and they come up immediately.

Although before this occurred I don't believe they published/made me aware -as a prospective employee- of the mat leave policy.
No one ever asks about mat/pat rights at offer of employment stage.

Thanks!!

OrangeYellowLeaves · 18/09/2019 22:53

@RowanMumsnet the draft email needs tweaking. It starts talking about “the campaign” before actually introducing which campaign it is!

NewNameGuy · 19/09/2019 06:55

I'm already talking to our HR about shared leave and paternity.

Mat leave and adoption leave are fantastic but options for men to share too, or go part time, are limited

RowanMumsnet · 19/09/2019 09:50

Morning! Thanks for all your thoughts so far. Glad to hear you've been on the case for a while @AutumnCrown Grin

@FirstTim3Mummy thanks for sending the email and do let us know how you get on

@eggysmom Thank you for that, that's great

@Ratbagcatbag whoop!

@CountFosco we've had a few companies say that to us, although more usually because they're global and have different policies in different countries. We've got a few suggestions for how they can handle this, eg publishing all the individual policies for different sites or including links to the applicable policies within job ads.

@GarfieldsArm well said Grin Your employer sounds great

@OrangeYellowLeaves aargh well spotted, thank you. Will edit now

@NewNameGuy absolutely - supporting dads to take the time off is a major piece of the puzzle, which is why we're asking employers to publish all their parental leave policies, not just mat pay and leave. Hope you'll ask your employer to publish too, if they don't already?

OP posts:
WingDefence · 19/09/2019 10:26

I've just checked my company's website (large, top UK professional services firm) and I'm pleased to say that the following are summarised on the main website:
Adoption (including surrogacy) and Maternity Leave
Ordinary Paternity Leave
Shared Parental Leave
Parental Leave
with a caveat at the bottom that these don't set out eligibility criteria etc and are only there to show the main points.

CassianAndor · 19/09/2019 12:28

I don't actually think parental leave is the answer to the structural inequality women face in the workplace. The reality is that parents are not equal when a baby is born - the mother must take precedence. Pretending that fathers are equal to mothers at that point helps no-one.

We need something far more radical that this, something that acknowledges the biological differences between men and women and stops trying to pretend that they are the same, and also stops this endless tweaking of a set up (the workplace) that was designed for and by men, into which women have been shoehorned.

Women should not have to act like men in order to succeed at work. Anything that seeks to make men and women the same (parental leave) should be treated, IMO, with a degree of scepticism.

Dollywilde · 19/09/2019 14:05

DH has just verbally accepted a job and as part of the offer letter is a benefits pack which includes maternity, paternity and SPL pay and leave entitlements. It’s not quite as good as publishing it online but that could be a sort of middle ground for organisations. I’m not sure having got all the way through the process id pull out at that stage, but is it worth suggesting to employers who are reticent that they could send that benefits pack to people when they get accepted for interview maybe?

Pandamodium · 19/09/2019 14:49

I'm a carer receiving carers allowance for a elderly relative. I think legally it's two week off a year before the allowance all £66 a week for 35+ hours is stopped.

When DS was Ill in neonatal I was going from her house sorting dinner to neonatal back to hers for tea back to neonatal then back to hers to put her to bed. When he was realised he was on home oxygen him and the portable oxygen cylinder came along to help Grin

Family carers definitely receive shitty treatment in this country. She has dementia and is entitled to the full 4 home carer visits a day so I'd love to know how much I actually save in care fees. The entire 200 and odd is took off my UC any other low paid job you can earn so much before your UC starts getting lowered.

Doesn't matter it's my beloved gran she cared for me as a child I will repay the favour in her older years (not ageist in the slightest she is 85!) for as long as I can.

Pandamodium · 19/09/2019 14:53

Sorry that went on a bit of a tangent Blush I just wanted to put the other side across when you are at the mercy of the DWP and benefits.

I worked for the council then civil servant I left voluntarily to look after her when my grandad died.

CountFosco · 19/09/2019 18:21

we've had a few companies say that to us, although more usually because they're global and have different policies in different countries. We've got a few suggestions for how they can handle this, eg publishing all the individual policies for different sites or including links to the applicable policies within job ads.

I suspect companies who have different policies on different sites (due to legacy agreements) probably don't want to publish their policies because there would then be pressure to even out any discrepancies. I think everyone at our US sites know they have less good terms and conditions than the European sites so that's actually less of an issue, but if people discovered the site 200 miles away have better T&C that would not go down well.

Watfrordmummy · 19/09/2019 18:35

All our policies are available for everyone to see - Head of People here.

PickledGulag · 19/09/2019 22:24

carers definitely receive shitty treatment in this country

Yup.

MindyStClaire · 20/09/2019 07:32

I work for a university and the policies for maternity, paternity, adoption and shared parental leave are freely available on the website, I checked them before accepting the job. There is also a policy on flexible working and work life balance (can't remember what it's called).

The policies are reasonably generous.

  • maternity leave is enhanced, I was on full pay for a few months, although I know many with a more generous package
  • paternity leave is full pay for three weeks. Two weeks has to be taken as a block but the third week is flexible, so DH went back four days a week for the first five weeks which was nice.
  • shared parental leave pay is the same as maternity.
RowanMumsnet · 20/09/2019 10:09

@Pandamodium

Sorry that went on a bit of a tangent Blush I just wanted to put the other side across when you are at the mercy of the DWP and benefits.

Don't blame you - sounds like a very raw deal indeed

OP posts:
RowanMumsnet · 20/09/2019 10:11

@CountFosco

we've had a few companies say that to us, although more usually because they're global and have different policies in different countries. We've got a few suggestions for how they can handle this, eg publishing all the individual policies for different sites or including links to the applicable policies within job ads.

I suspect companies who have different policies on different sites (due to legacy agreements) probably don't want to publish their policies because there would then be pressure to even out any discrepancies. I think everyone at our US sites know they have less good terms and conditions than the European sites so that's actually less of an issue, but if people discovered the site 200 miles away have better T&C that would not go down well.

(Wondering who you work for now!) Yes, I don't think any of the companies we've spoken to have said they have differing policies within a country. Can see how that would get awkward

OP posts:
RowanMumsnet · 20/09/2019 10:12

@Watfrordmummy

All our policies are available for everyone to see - Head of People here.

We'd love to add your company to our list if it's not there already (if it's in the FTSE100 or FTSE250 we should know about it) - if you're comfortable with letting us know via PM or email ([email protected]) which org it is

OP posts: