Campaign to end Bounty sales reps' access to maternity wards - please read and share

[JustineMumsnet]

Evening all,

Thanks to all of you who have taken the time to fill in our survey on Bounty and share your stories - from the initial idea onwards, this really is a campaign that has been prompted by your concerns, as posted on Mumsnet.

The survey showed that a very large majority (82%) felt it was unacceptable for Bounty sales reps to be on hospital wards, as well as highlighting a number of other concerns about Bounty reps' selling practices, so we're calling on government to end this kind of direct selling/data collecting on NHS wards. See more here.

It's clear, from the survey results, that, even after Bounty updated its code of conduct (these results only include users who gave birth from May 2012 - the full results containing prior data are here) its practices leave a lot to be desired, and that Mumsnet users feel very strongly that the maternity ward is no place for a hard sell, so we're really hoping that government will listen to us.

Here's how you can help...

Please sign the petition

If you're on Twitter please tweet your support for the campaign with the hashtag #bountymutiny and the following link:

tiny.mn/1bsnpNw

If you're on Facebook then please like campaign page our campaign page (there's a FB link to click at the top on the left).

If you're on Google+, well, you'll know what to do.

We'll, of course, keep you posted here about the campaign and any developments. Thanks to everyone for their stories, honesty and input. Here's hoping we can make a difference!

The statement is rubbish.

The statement is rubbish.

Passing the buck.

'It is up to individual Authorities whether and to what extent they want to take advantage of vulnerable women. We have no say, nor do we wish to though we have no policies against such abuse of power and trust'.

I am absolutely OVER THE MOON about this. I am so glad to see that Mumsnet took what was said in the original thread seriously, and supported what was done before.

My jaw has been dropping over the fact that this is being covered by the rest of the press. I am so pleased. I didn't think that this would be taken up with such conviction.

Please MNHQ have a few . You deserve it.

A Department of Health spokesperson said:

"Women should be able to give birth in a safe, comfortable and relaxing environment.

"It is up to local NHS hospitals to decide locally whether to allow Bounty representatives on to their maternity wards. They also have a say about which mums the representatives are allowed to visit and when.

"We do not hold any central contracts with Bounty or have any influence over the conduct of their sales representatives. But as with all hospital visitors, we would expect them to respect the privacy of all women and their families.?

My question in response to that, and put in the FOI request I put in, is simply, why are hospitals letting ANYONE they don't have influence over on their wards have DIRECT access to patients? Why are they not taking their duty of care to patients seriously?

This is completely unacceptable. No one should have such levels of access. This isn't like a contract cleaner; a contract cleaner does not interact and ask questions of patients. If they are, they simply shouldn't be.

As for comments about 'women loosing out' by a ban. Why can't companies like this have a presence somewhere, in the hospital, where women can come to them rather than the other way round? Perhaps it could be a book in service, if people really want it. The problem with the practice is the unsolicited cold calling of vulnerable people in a situation they are unable to walk away from - not the fact that they are taking photos.

Thanks to all that pushed this forward - I completely support the campaign. Expecting my first baby in a few months and already dreading the thought of a salesperson intruding on my family in whatever state we're in after the birth. This simply wouldn't be allowed were the patients in questions emerging from surgery or similar - why do they reckon new mothers are fair game?

I wonder if the D of H fully realised that their statement included the words ...

"We do not ... have any influence over the conduct of their sales representatives"

So, they let people onto maternity wards enabling them to have direct contact with patients (new mothers), and yet have no influence on those people's conduct ?

Have I got that right ?

Everyone on here does realise that Emmas diary is a rival company to Bounty right and nothing to do with Bounty but a seperate entity?

Bounty is taking the stance that very few mothers complain and they take those complaints seriously, they are of the stance that MNers are clearly articulate and educated women and if the campaign were above board that the mothers would have complained to them but no such thing has happened, they are currently suggesting that MN have their own agenda that they are vying for a larger market share as they are competitiors of Bounty.

Which I think is utter tosh, MN does not get income from corporate membership like Bounty.
Bounty is in competition with MN I know that they want the market MN has ie the type of website users that MN has and Bounty does not.

I know this as I know someone there, and they've been trundling this crap out to me, when I queried why Bounty didn't offer packs in A&E for example there didn't seem to be a reply.

I have just commented on the wright stuff Facebook page. Some of the comments on there are ridiculously naive. I can't believe people think the freebies are actually free! Most people are so careful with their personal details nowadays and yet hand them over readily for a bag of crap.

What I mean is everyone who loved/hated Emmas diary did not love Bounty that was a different company entirely

The D of H is passing the buck with that statement.

It's basically meaning hospitals have people on maternity wards who are not accountable to the hospital in any way for their behaviour.

So whatever Bounty say about their code of conduct, on a day to day basis, their reps are on wards with no checks on their behaviour.

The only way short of a ban this can be resolved is to have the reps located where mothers go to them and not the other way around. And that the contracts with the hospitals for this include a contractual version of the code of conduct that can be enforced.

"It is up to local NHS hospitals to decide locally whether to allow Bounty representatives on to their maternity wards."

Unfortunately, it seems the hospitals can't be trusted to make the correct decision. They put money ahead of the wishes of new mothers who don't want intrusive sales reps barging in when they're trying to get to know their new baby.

"But as with all hospital visitors, we would expect them to respect the privacy of all women and their families.?

Clearly this expectation isn't being met, so can something therefore be done?

MN competitors?

I don't recall anyone from MN bursting into the cubicle at the maternity ward, making out I had to give personal details and getting huffy if I didn't do what they wanted!

NoFork - if the comments on the Wright stuffs Facebook page say that, that's brilliant! Because it illustrates exactly the fact that people are unaware of the marketing behind it and the fact that their personal data is being sold.

Why can't they be in the foyer with the other shops/people selling stuff and the mothers who want a Bounty pack can take one on the way out?

And the hospitals retain the financial contribution from Bounty?

Hospitals have a duty of care to ensure the privacy of patients. If this isn't being done - and our survey says uhuh - then why aren't the DoH stepping in to enforce this?

Its very clear in guidelines about the financial abuse of vulnerable patients...

Elquoa EXACTLY, that's what I said, the market is utterly different, Bounty pushes their packs which contain crap from their paying members who are large corporate companies, ie Johnson & Johnson, Procter and Gamble, etcetcetc.

Last year I was asked what would make me go to Bounty instead of MN, I said I wouldn't, I'd used the Bounty website when I'd had my first child (because of the pack) and I didn't like it at all so haven't used it and dont want to.

Bounty wants to attract the website traffic that MN does. They are in competition with MN not the other way round as far as I can see.

So so pleased to see this campaign. I felt my privacy was totally violated by a Bounty rep after the birth of DD1. When she knocked on the door I assumed she was an NHS professional so welcomed her in. At the time I was feeling traumatised after a very difficult labour and still high on pethadene. I was feeling extremely vulnerable and very upset when I realised this was actually a commercial rep wanting my personal details rather than to attend me and my daughter. I don't think they should be allowed to approach women so soon after childbirth which are very precious and emotional hours - not a time for pushy commercial reps to intrude.

I am just astonished that at a time when partners/siblings are not allowed on the ward (and I appreciate this is to maintain privacy and allow exhausted women to rest), totally unsolicited strangers are permitted free access. WTF?

I guess the people who 'kick off' if they don't get their bounty bag, do so because they perceive it has a great value.

Of course this will have a lot to do with the fact that it is being given out on the PN ward of an NHS hospital and therefore appears 'official' or 'recommended' which of course it isn't.

I liked the Bounty stuff too. All 5 of my DC had the photo and I appreciated the packs. Didn't find them pushy. Would have been gutted to have a newborn pic with some but not all DC! (I was in hospital a while each time and my own pics were not as nice). Lots of my friends like them too and had good experiences with the 'Bounty woman'.

I was in hospital with DS for three days, in a private room for 2 days. . I'd been aware of Bounty from MN and agreed to the photos (crap) on the first day, knowing that I had 14 days to return them.

BIL is a pro photographer, awardwinning I might add. The Bounty photo didn't even look like my DS and they were charging FORTY NINE QUID for a blurry photo. Crapola!

That isn't my main gripe though. I was put in a private room so that I could noisily express milk every three hours and not wake other mums. There would be a knock on the door and I'd say come in, only for the Bounty Woman to traipse in, sometimes two or three times a day, even though she'd already got the photo and my detail
I saw more of her than anyone else. She saw my breasts more than anyone else. co

Could she not just fuck off and writedown "Room 1, done" instead of bugging me when I have my norks hooked up to the dairy pump in my private room?

Its so personal, I can't imagine them allowing this in, say, a fertility clinic.

I've just been to look at the Bounty forums & they're much quieter than MN. As for their content... it doesn't interest me. Partly because DD is 12 but I don't think it would have interested me when she was younger either.

But if it did, then why on earth should being an MNer stop me using it? There's no one-parenting-site-only rule, there are people who use MN and Netmums perfectly happily & I don't see MN kicking them off. Suggesting that we're after Bounty's traffic is bollocks.

I agree with others who've suggested that the Bounty rep should be in the day room & mums should be able to come to her if they choose.

I can't imagine reps being allowed onto a post-vasectomy ward either.

Does anyone else remember the case of the little girl that got snatched from a maternity ward (Alex I think her name was), it was a long time ago and I am sadly old enough to remember.

My point though, is that as a new mum we all assume everyone on a postnatal ward is supposed to be there. What if someone faked their way in on a bounty pass?