I'm dying to grass up the benefit cheats living next to me but..

[ssd]

..dh won't let me as they have 3 kids and he feels its unfair on the kids

they are the laziest young couple I've ever met, she told me she can't afford to work as she is getting so much paid for her by claiming to be a single mum, but her partner (kids dad) work on the side so they have that money coming in too

they seem to spend all their money on takeaway deliveries, about 3 a week, but sod all on their kids who come chapping my door every day trying to get in to play with our toys, and probably for a feed as they get their takeaways about half nine at night

we both work here, I'm part time on minimum wage and she actually told me what she "clears" a month and with income support, job seekers and rent paid she's better off than us bith working

I'm heartily sick of seeing them swanning about, she always seems to have new clothes and their car is much better than ours, her mu mtakes the kids at weekends so they can go out and party, she told me they can afford to go out every Sat and they lie in bed all Sunday till the kids are delivered back to them

I'm so bitter, I'm sick of the injustice

should I go ahead and tell social services and let dh go mad or just let them live their dishonest life and shut up? I really don't know what to do

Unfortunately for many people the chance for promotion/senior posts will never arise.

utter rubbish

you work hard, do your hours well and there's every opportunity

Sounds like my neighbour, she doesn't work but she does look after her elderly mother and 6 kids...how could she go to work?
She does have a partner, he turns up every evening at around 6pm and leaves at 6am, not even seen him in the 8yrs we've been here!
The benefit system in this country, encourages you not to work at the moment as at least you are guaranteed your benefit cheque and an employer could sack you on the spot.

say nothing.

just get on with your own life.

if you're working opposite shifts to make both of you working worthwhile, there may be an opportunity - but it doesn't mean it will be financially viable.

Extra responsibility often equals more hours, which means you have to pay for childcare, by the time you've taken child care out of your increased salary often amounts to nothing.

And unless you're prepared to "job hop" (which doesn' look great on a CV imo) to find somewhere that will give you the opportunity of a senior post/promotion you're kind of stuck.

I'm 100% certain I could have stuck at my minimum wage night shift job for 10yrs and never managed to get a senior position when/if they came up. It just wouldn't have happened - for starters I would have had to work more nights which with working around my (ex)H's job would have been impossible - when I did do extra shifts by the time the taxman had his cut it was neglible the extra I earnt - thankfully at the time I had someone to help with childcare - otherwise I would have had to pay for that (and with H's salary wouldn't have got much help towards it). Not to mention the fact that the manager didn't actually like me.

My mum worked as a general kitchen assistant for YEARS, she was excellent at the job, she even took the kitchen managers job for about 1yr when they were on long term sick leave, was praised for how well she did it.........but when it turned out the manager wasn't coming back, they advertised for the post and she wasn't even called for an interview (didn't have the correct experience ).

"Dead end jobs" aren't called that for nothing. Yes if you're a cleaner you may get the supervisor role, but money not likely to be that much different - and where next?

connie, its not utter rubbish

I work as a cleaner, no scope for promotion there

and dh works in a factory, no areas for promotion there either unfortunately, he should know he's been there for years

your posts make me feel you have never worked in a minimum wage/blue collar job, not every job has prospects, some of ou are working in jobs that benefit the family time wise, not financially

us not ou

I think you need a reality check actually cd - you sound like some of those people on Secret Millionaire "well I worked hard and worked myself out of it - and look where I am now".......then they meet people who have been working hard all their life and not managed to move up the scale - it's never going to happen - there's only so many senior/promotion jobs going - there's always going to be people stuck at the bottom of the pile.

'A system where it's supposedly fincially better to not work than work can never ever ever do what it was supposed to do.'

exactly connie. Sums up why the system is an utter mess. Going to work in any job, however unskilled and lowly should pay signficantly better than living on benefits. Just as living legitimately as a couple should not disadvantage you.

The message that's gone out to a whole generation is that being married/in a partnership and doing an honest day's work are not valued. There is something seriously wrong when people find themselves better off by splitting with the other parent of their child/not going to work etc.

It's interesting that there's so much hostility on this thread yet I haven't seen any threads complaining about the rich bastards in the City who have been creaming off million pound bonuses out of ordinary people's pension funds and endowments and have screwed the economy. They were happy enough to play with the companies that employ Mr and Mrs Average, throwing people out of work for short-term gain to their advantage.

I know receptionists and post-room people in the City have lost their jobs too, but why isn't anybody angry at the fat cats?

People bitch about the poor playing the system but somehow accept the rich when they do it.

absolutely findtheriver, it's no wonder so many people play the system....i would never grass them up though...if the government can't be bothered to sort it out i'm not gonna waste a phone call. good luck to them, thats what i'd say.

I certainly don't need a reality check. We are trying to sell the family home because we are at risk of repossession but we have plans and we are doing all we can in the mean time to maximise our income and potential.

You only get stuck at the bottom of the pile if you are happy to stay there. And actually job hopping is the best way to get a better paid job and I believe this applies from minimum wage job upwards to senior levels...

if you're working hard and not getting anywhere then you need to be proactive about that...assuming you want to progress that is. I think if you are stuck at the bottom of the pile you either don't want to progress or it hadn;t crossed your mind that you could!

And the poverty trap - making it hard for people to get off benefits - is there because the fat cats keep wages low, by employing immigrants on very low salaries, for instance. Why do you think the owners of care homes employ so many immigrants? Because they won't pay a living wage. I am NOT having a go at immigrants on low wages - I'm complaining about the company directors who do very nicely thank you out of screwing the poor.

but it doesn't happen like that findtheriver - if I were to go out to work tomorrow 20hrs a week minimum wage - I would be £100 a week better off......

Sounds brilliant doesn't it?

Well no - not actually - as that doesn't take into account my housing costs £400 a month (which I currently pay without the aid of housing benefit as I don't qualify) , and the council tax which I would then have to pay - so actually - I'd be worse off. And I (like millions of minimum wage earners) already struggle on what I have - I simple couldn't do it,

When I and I were together we scraped by doing what the OP does - working around each other. We were better off that if we'd been on benefits - however, I can't do that on my own.

FAQ - of course there are only going to a limited number of senior jobs going in any particular area! That's the nature of jobs! And why is it a problem? A lot of people don't want promotions, or extra responsibilities. I know many people who are good at what they do and are comfortable to remain where they are.

I do think that there should be s signficant gap between the minimum wage and benefits. If benefits provided the basic living standard, and then any job provided a significantly better lifestyle, it would solve the problem - there would be an incentive to work. EG if living on benefits provided enough for you to eat (not takeaways but basic wholesome meals), clothe yourself and family, heat the house etc, but getting a job enabled you to do all of the above AND run a car/take a holiday/have lovely days out/ etc then people would start to see the benefits of working.

But too many people at the moment get a job, and suddenly realise that they are paying for all kinds of bills that were previously paid for by benefits, or they end up using all their income on getting to work and back... and they see no difference to their life style.

I am a great advocate of work for other reasons - I believe it's not good for people to be unemployed long term, there's a lot of evidence that work improves self esteem and confidence etc. And I have to say I worked even when nearly all my income went on nursery fees - but that was for the long term benefits as I am now in one of those senior positions you describe FAQ.
However, despite all the other good reasons to work, the bottom line is that work should also make you better off. That's why the gap between working and living on benefits needs to be much wider.

Connie, that's like saying because there are some well-off people in showbusiness, we could all do it if we tried. There are fewer senior managers than junior workers and even fewer company directors. Simple maths says not everyone can get to the top.

Connie - you have no idea do you?

There are 1000's of bloody hard working, ambitious invidiuals in this country - who despite working hard all their life will never get out of the poverty trap - it's life, it sucks, and it's true.

and I do agree Edam.........but whether it be the top end drain or the bottom enbd drain it is always Mr and Mrs average who get screwed

i personally cant do anything about either apart from moan about it on MN so instead focus my energy to my own family and our life.

edam - that is a really poor argument. This thread is about a specific situation. I'm sure plenty of people ARE hopping mad about city fat cats who take their bonuses out of pension funds etc - I think it's a fucking disgrace! But it doesnt therefore follow that if you're at the other end of the spectrum it's ok to cheat either.

Cheats deserve what they get, end of.

Well, where are those threads then, findtheriver? It's just very odd that the crimes of the poor breed such visceral resentment and the crimes of the rich are met with a shrug of the shoulders.

An old music hall song went: 'It's the rich wot gets the pleasure; it's the poor wot gets the blame'. Not much changed in the past 80 years, then.

Well start one then edam!!! Who's stopping you??!! I would bet that if you started a thread about the bastards in the city who screw up hard working people's pensions just so they can buy their holiday home in the caribbean, you'll find that 99% of people agree with you!!

Seems strange to complain that there isnt a thread about something when you can't be bothered to start it yourself!

No, have restrained myself because there are MNers whose dhs have probably lost their jobs.

edam - of course not everyone can get to the top....not everyone wants to

but you can progress in anything

and taking benefits out of it...if you can find a job that pays the bills and you can eat then you should do it........whether you'd be £10 a week better off on benefits is really a moot point because you are going nowhere fast in those circumstances

If anyone is at fault here it is the Government. They pay out so much in benefits to people that when it comes to being able to work they choose not to because, in most cases, they would have less money coming in to the household. So why go out to work every day to have less money to live off?

I know of people who are more than capable of working, have their kids in full-time education, have their rent and council tax paid and live off benefits. They always have far more money than me, are able to pay for new shoes, school trips etc quite easily, get free school dinners, nice car parked in the drive, kids have the latest mobile phones.....etc etc. - in this house we struggle with a mortgage, live off one wage until I am finally child-free and can go back to work and get no benefits help whatsoever and have to pay each and every bill that comes through the door.

I didn't start this thread, either, but I am allowed to post on it, you know.