Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Money matters

Find financial and money-saving discussions including debt and pension chat on our Money forum. If you're looking for ways to make your money to go further, sign up to our Moneysaver emails here.

Original poster

Deprivation of Assets and UC

171 replies

V2Schneider · 15/02/2025 21:48

I am aware of this topic being posted a few times, but having read many of the posts and replies, I can’t seem to find an answer that covers my circumstances.

BACKGROUND
My wife has Myeloma Blood Cancer, had a stem-cell transplant in 2020… now the cancer is back, and she’s back in chemo, and probably set for her second Stem-cell transplant later this year.

My eldest (19) has a recent diagnosis of autism, which explains the difficult times we had with school and education since they were 11.

My youngest (15) has a genetic condition, and attends special school.

I don’t live with them anymore. I also have an autoimmune disease, Vasculitis, and so I am not working.

QUESTION
Since my wife’s illness has got worse, she is finding it increasingly difficult to maintain the house, and garden. So much so that it needs a complete clear-out and repairs etc. My kids don’t have the capacity to help, really, and so things have just got out of hand.
I decided that I have to do something, so I looked to one of my pensions. I have applied for early retirement, but I have to take the initial lump sum all in one go, and that could be between 15-20k…

I am on UC, with LCWRA, and PIP. Having so much money will obviously stop my UC.

i am planning to use the money (£6000 of it initially) to put things right at my wife and kids’ home.
I also wanted to pay for my wife and kids to go on holiday.

so, my question is: Does paying for repairs etc. to my wife and kids’ home, and paying for a holiday for them (by god, they need one!) count as me willingly depriving myself of capital to keep benefits?
Has anyone been through something similar?

The rest of the money I will be using to clear my own debts, and may even take a holiday myself!

TIA

OP posts:
Original poster
V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:11

Phase2 · 16/02/2025 00:00

www.gov.uk/guidance/universal-credit-money-savings-and-investments

Does this link not help? It says you have to tell them about pension lump sums. It says payment for essential goods and services may not count as deprivation of assets .

Yes, but it doesn’t give enough explanation of what is considered “essential”.

OP posts:
Original poster
V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:12

OwlInTheOak · 15/02/2025 23:55

Its under 16k so whilst it may reduce payments until it is gone it shouldn't stop them. Take the payment, clear debts then report what you have, then report changes after house repairs are done. That should put you under the 6k amount and then it's your choice if you spend the remaining amount on holidays.

So you’re of the opinion that the house repairs are ok?

OP posts:
Moier · 16/02/2025 00:14

Also PIP isn't taken into consideration.
Just other benefits.
I was on DlA ( long before it changed to PIP) I'm severely disabled ( ex threw me under a bus.. he's in jail for attempted murder).. anyhow l had to claim DLA.. but years later after yearly assessments to see how my disabilities were going to effect my life.. l finally got my Payout.. and it was a few Million.. they stopped my incapacity benefit ( this was before it changed to ESA) .. But not my DLA because it's not means tested.. but l stopped it myself because l didn't need it.
So please get help through the CAB.

Miley1967 · 16/02/2025 00:15

I would imagine giving away money to pay for house repairs for a house you don't even live in and paying for a holiday for a wife you don't live with could be considered deprivation of capital. One of the things the DWP look at in deciding if a couple are a couple for benefits purposes is holidaying together so you do need to be careful if you are planning to do that.. As soon as your account goes over 16k your Uc would stop unless debts etc are cleared within that same assessment period, so you would need to time things carefully as you wouldn't want your claim to end and then have to start form scratch again with the work capability assessment etc. I'm not sure if there is a way to get that LCWRA automatically re-established if your claim did close temporarily.

Original poster
V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:15

FiveBarGate · 16/02/2025 00:06

When will you get the money?

Are they all big jobs or could they be broken down into smaller chunks?

I.e if you spent say £200 this month on garden clearance. And next month spent a few hundred pounds on fencing or on gravel for the garden, I don't think there's anything to stop you doing that. But you'd be best to pay directly not transfer the money to your wife.

You can't suddenly give her 3k though as that would be a deprivation of assets.

They are quoted jobs. I can’t do the work myself as I’m also disabled.

I would be paying the money straight out as soon as I got it… the workmen are just waiting fur my go ahead… I wouldn’t be giving my wife/kids anything… paying for all the work myself…

OP posts:
Miley1967 · 16/02/2025 00:16

V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:15

They are quoted jobs. I can’t do the work myself as I’m also disabled.

I would be paying the money straight out as soon as I got it… the workmen are just waiting fur my go ahead… I wouldn’t be giving my wife/kids anything… paying for all the work myself…

Show quote history

The thing is if the DWP want to see invoices and receipts for any bigger work whose address will it have on the invoice? I guess you can ask the tradesperson to put your address on then the DWP would never know !

FiveBarGate · 16/02/2025 00:16

As another thought, if you are not divorced and haven't done a financial settlement, isn't your wife entitled to a share of your pension?

It wouldn't be right for you to spend it as it's a joint asset surely? So it might be worth checking if legally you have to give her half (which in your situation is a good thing).

Miley1967 · 16/02/2025 00:17

FiveBarGate · 16/02/2025 00:16

As another thought, if you are not divorced and haven't done a financial settlement, isn't your wife entitled to a share of your pension?

It wouldn't be right for you to spend it as it's a joint asset surely? So it might be worth checking if legally you have to give her half (which in your situation is a good thing).

Good point. 10k each would keep both households under the savings limit !

Original poster
V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:18

Moier · 16/02/2025 00:14

Also PIP isn't taken into consideration.
Just other benefits.
I was on DlA ( long before it changed to PIP) I'm severely disabled ( ex threw me under a bus.. he's in jail for attempted murder).. anyhow l had to claim DLA.. but years later after yearly assessments to see how my disabilities were going to effect my life.. l finally got my Payout.. and it was a few Million.. they stopped my incapacity benefit ( this was before it changed to ESA) .. But not my DLA because it's not means tested.. but l stopped it myself because l didn't need it.
So please get help through the CAB.

Wow, you had it tough.
The amount I am due wouldn’t amount to much once these things are paid for… I wouldn’t have money sat in the bank.
I have no intention of buying loads of new clothes, or dining out every night. I just want to pay for things to make my family’s life that little bit better… :(

OP posts:
Moier · 16/02/2025 00:23

V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:18

Wow, you had it tough.
The amount I am due wouldn’t amount to much once these things are paid for… I wouldn’t have money sat in the bank.
I have no intention of buying loads of new clothes, or dining out every night. I just want to pay for things to make my family’s life that little bit better… :(

Show quote history

I fully understand.. and l totally agree with you.
You still need your UC to live on for food/ bills etc.. because basically your pension will be paying for repairs.. plus an holiday which will help with mental health. Go to the CAB.. I've been many times for various things and they are so helpful.
Best wishes.

Original poster
V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:24

Miley1967 · 16/02/2025 00:15

I would imagine giving away money to pay for house repairs for a house you don't even live in and paying for a holiday for a wife you don't live with could be considered deprivation of capital. One of the things the DWP look at in deciding if a couple are a couple for benefits purposes is holidaying together so you do need to be careful if you are planning to do that.. As soon as your account goes over 16k your Uc would stop unless debts etc are cleared within that same assessment period, so you would need to time things carefully as you wouldn't want your claim to end and then have to start form scratch again with the work capability assessment etc. I'm not sure if there is a way to get that LCWRA automatically re-established if your claim did close temporarily.

We wouldn’t be holidaying together, which I could see would be problematic.
the holiday I would like to sort for my wife is more for the kids, to be honest. We are very aware of my wife’s mortality… we need to make memories for the kids… and they also need a break after a very tough few years…

Debts, garden and house work, etc would be paid immediately…

in fact, were I to decide holidays were ok, that would also be paid immediately, as I’d book them all there and then. So in terms of having too much in an assessment period, I don’t think I’d be there.

my debts could well amount to £12k, if I count loans from my parents and a friend… so the £6000 limit MIGHT not be relevant… it’s just I don’t yet know exactly how much the payout is going to be…

OP posts:
Original poster
V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:25

FiveBarGate · 16/02/2025 00:16

As another thought, if you are not divorced and haven't done a financial settlement, isn't your wife entitled to a share of your pension?

It wouldn't be right for you to spend it as it's a joint asset surely? So it might be worth checking if legally you have to give her half (which in your situation is a good thing).

Never thought of that.

I might have nominated my beneficiaries at some point. I’m not very good at understanding my pension, despite being good at mathematics! 😂

OP posts:
Miley1967 · 16/02/2025 00:26

V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:24

We wouldn’t be holidaying together, which I could see would be problematic.
the holiday I would like to sort for my wife is more for the kids, to be honest. We are very aware of my wife’s mortality… we need to make memories for the kids… and they also need a break after a very tough few years…

Debts, garden and house work, etc would be paid immediately…

in fact, were I to decide holidays were ok, that would also be paid immediately, as I’d book them all there and then. So in terms of having too much in an assessment period, I don’t think I’d be there.

my debts could well amount to £12k, if I count loans from my parents and a friend… so the £6000 limit MIGHT not be relevant… it’s just I don’t yet know exactly how much the payout is going to be…

Show quote history

It's fine to clear debts but if you've borrowed from family and don't have proof of this then that could be problematic and considered non essential by DWP.
Paying for a holiday for someone else when you are not going is also likely to be problematic as would be considered as giving away money surely? Sorry but I do think your plans are going to be problematic sadly.

Original poster
V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:28

Moier · 16/02/2025 00:23

I fully understand.. and l totally agree with you.
You still need your UC to live on for food/ bills etc.. because basically your pension will be paying for repairs.. plus an holiday which will help with mental health. Go to the CAB.. I've been many times for various things and they are so helpful.
Best wishes.

Show quote history

There is the thing about mental health. All four of us have issues with MH… the wife especially is suffering more because of concerns about the future with her being so ill.
I’m on MH meds, the eldest is also. The youngest is under CAMHS as well as counselling in her special school.

holidays are good for MH, and we all sorely need a holiday (not been for over 5 years… )

OP posts:
Miley1967 · 16/02/2025 00:30

I'd get her to book the holiday herself, pay from her account and then give some money back under the guise of it being child maintenance?

Crispynoodle · 16/02/2025 00:31

Moier · 16/02/2025 00:14

Also PIP isn't taken into consideration.
Just other benefits.
I was on DlA ( long before it changed to PIP) I'm severely disabled ( ex threw me under a bus.. he's in jail for attempted murder).. anyhow l had to claim DLA.. but years later after yearly assessments to see how my disabilities were going to effect my life.. l finally got my Payout.. and it was a few Million.. they stopped my incapacity benefit ( this was before it changed to ESA) .. But not my DLA because it's not means tested.. but l stopped it myself because l didn't need it.
So please get help through the CAB.

No advise for the OP but what an awful ordeal you were put through I can only be inspired by your bravery and send some virtual FlowersFlowers

Original poster
V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:31

Miley1967 · 16/02/2025 00:26

It's fine to clear debts but if you've borrowed from family and don't have proof of this then that could be problematic and considered non essential by DWP.
Paying for a holiday for someone else when you are not going is also likely to be problematic as would be considered as giving away money surely? Sorry but I do think your plans are going to be problematic sadly.

Edited
Show quote history

Debts to family: we do have signed agreements with a payment plan from the time I was loaned the money. Both my parents, and a friend who have helped me in the past didn’t want a formal agreement, but I insisted at the time as I wanted everything to be above board, and was determined to pay back properly… sadly, due to events over the last year or so, I haven’t paid back as I promised, and need to sort that, really…

OP posts:
Original poster
V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:33

Miley1967 · 16/02/2025 00:30

I'd get her to book the holiday herself, pay from her account and then give some money back under the guise of it being child maintenance?

Edited

Would a one-off child maintenance payment not look suspicious?
we’re not divorced, and no financial agreements are in place. I just “pay as I go” for whatever the kids need.

OP posts:
FiveBarGate · 16/02/2025 00:42

V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:25

Never thought of that.

I might have nominated my beneficiaries at some point. I’m not very good at understanding my pension, despite being good at mathematics! 😂

Show quote history

It's more than being a beneficiary. It's an asset of the marriage.

If you were to divorce your pensions would form part of the pot to be separated.

Did your wife have her own pension or is yours the main one? If it's then you drawing a lump sum and then spending it wouldn't be a fair division of assets. You'd be spending what is legally part hers..

Giving some to her as part of a financial settlement might be your easiest way around this as she probably is entitled to it.

Original poster
V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:45

FiveBarGate · 16/02/2025 00:42

It's more than being a beneficiary. It's an asset of the marriage.

If you were to divorce your pensions would form part of the pot to be separated.

Did your wife have her own pension or is yours the main one? If it's then you drawing a lump sum and then spending it wouldn't be a fair division of assets. You'd be spending what is legally part hers..

Giving some to her as part of a financial settlement might be your easiest way around this as she probably is entitled to it.

Show quote history

I will definitely check on that. She doesn’t have a pension… she was a stay at home mum for quite a while, especially when the youngest came along. Only did voluntary work after that.

thanks

OP posts:
ForgotwhatIcameinherefor · 16/02/2025 00:51

Why don't you take the holidays now before the money comes through and put them on a credit card so that it will be a debt 🤷‍♀️

Original poster
V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:53

ForgotwhatIcameinherefor · 16/02/2025 00:51

Why don't you take the holidays now before the money comes through and put them on a credit card so that it will be a debt 🤷‍♀️

If I had credit cards I would not be taking the pension… I’m taking the pension as there’s no other way of getting the money to pay for the housing work etc.

OP posts:
Livelovebehappy · 16/02/2025 00:53

V2Schneider · 15/02/2025 23:49

No. It’s a council property.

The repairs and clean-up that is required is not their problem. It’s not repairs for faulty things in the house, it’s installing new fencing, clearing the garden so it’s safe for my kids, and clearing the house of clutter etc. that my wife is now unable to do because she is so poorly.

Show quote history

So not repairs, but home improvements? Putting a fence up isn’t a repair. And decluttering isn’t a necessary repair. Assuming it isn’t so messy as to be inhabitable, surely you just employ a specialist cleaner, who declutters and cleans, which would be the best option.

Original poster
V2Schneider · 16/02/2025 00:57

Livelovebehappy · 16/02/2025 00:53

So not repairs, but home improvements? Putting a fence up isn’t a repair. And decluttering isn’t a necessary repair. Assuming it isn’t so messy as to be inhabitable, surely you just employ a specialist cleaner, who declutters and cleans, which would be the best option.

Show quote history

Replacing a fence that has been destroyed in storms is a repair I would have thought? In order to secure the property for the kids?
Looking at nearly £3k for the fence and garden work.

The house IS just about cluttered enough to make it unliveable … I did say that my wife is seriously ill, and I have 2 disabled kids, and an incurable illness of my own?
the situation is dire, and will cost in the region if £3k to rectify…

OP posts:
NotaCoolMum · 16/02/2025 00:59

WellsAndThistles · 15/02/2025 21:55

Only the DWP will know but ultimately, you are depriving yourself of assets for non essentials and the tax payer having to fund your future benefits isn't the best use of public funds.

I totally understand why you want to help out though but thay maybe shouldn't be at the tax payers expense.

Oh be quiet.

@V2Schneider I don’t know the answer to your question but wanted to say you sound like a lovely human and I wish you and your family well 💖