Child maintenance

[OneForTheRoadThen]

Hi, my partner and I are in the process of separating. He is not going to be paying any maintenance as he can't afford it and I will be claiming UC for both children as well as working part time.

We've discussed residence and provisionally agreed he will have both children for 2 nights a week and then 1 child for a further night and the other child for another night so basically 1child on Tuesday, 2 children in Weds and Sat and one child on Thursday. He is now saying I owe him maintenance for those days he has them. Is that correct?

This is only a good idea if you think he would do a good job of buying all the clothes, he would pay childcare with no hassling. Plus it could be a source of contention between the dc- ‘well daddy buys my clothes!’

I agree. This is a massive risk. It would be absolutely horrible for one child to see the other being bought lots of new clothes and toys because their funding parent has more disposable income than their sibling’s funding parent. And don’t assume he would never try to make you look like a shit mum by showering one child with stuff.

Thank you so much @wornkiwi I really appreciate your kind message and support. Well done to you on getting through this situation

@UhtredRagnarson you are spot on, I actually (naively) hadn't considered any of this but you're absolutely right. I'm definitely going to be getting some more advice and I need to wise up fast I think.

@OneForTheRoadThen - you got this :)

Well done for thinking it all through and seeking advice OP! It’s hard to have these conversations when you just want to keep everything nice and friendly but sometimes you really do need to be firm in order to be fair to yourself

This really really fucks me pff that benefits will pay for you to work just 24 hours and even then stop that to study, whilst he pays fuck all towards his kids.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not criticising you personally for taking the benefit that are there! And it’s fab you want to create your own success by studying, and I will you all the best with that.

But the sooner we put men in prison if they don’t pay maintenance, and sort out the benefit system to include it, the better.

I usually roll my eyes at the, “my taxes...” brigade, but here - yes, I do resent my taxes subsidising this feckless waste of skin 😡

You don’t owe him a penny.
Put the CMS claim in. You can’t back claim earlier than the date it went in, so even if this shameless arsehole doesn’t pay, at least you’re clocking up the unpaid amounts, and you’re in the system if he does start earning. He will anyway owe you something.

Definitely put in a claim, even if this appears amicable now, it may not always stay this way and you need to protect yourself and your children.
Your salary and who is better off has nothing to do with it, he helped create these children he is responsible for paying for them.

@Cocomarine while I'm not disagreeing I just wanted to say that I'm still going to be working 24 hours a week while I'm studying for a CIPD qualification as well as looking after a preschooler and paying for childcare for both children for when I'm working.

Btw if you go to CMS then he's not owed maintenance from you, he gets a discount for the days that he has the kids which he can use on food or whatever. NRP on full benefits pay £7 per week btw

If he were having them 50:50 then it would make sense to claim UC for one child each ( assuming you both qualify ) but this doesn't sound like this is the case so he should pay you maintenance.

@Cocomarine

This really really fucks me pff that benefits will pay for you to work just 24 hours and even then stop that to study, whilst he pays fuck all towards his kids.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not criticising you personally for taking the benefit that are there! And it’s fab you want to create your own success by studying, and I will you all the best with that.

But the sooner we put men in prison if they don’t pay maintenance, and sort out the benefit system to include it, the better.

I usually roll my eyes at the, “my taxes...” brigade, but here - yes, I do resent my taxes subsidising this feckless waste of skin 😡

You don’t owe him a penny.
Put the CMS claim in. You can’t back claim earlier than the date it went in, so even if this shameless arsehole doesn’t pay, at least you’re clocking up the unpaid amounts, and you’re in the system if he does start earning. He will anyway owe you something.

But if he does pay CM - op will still get exactly the same amount in benefits whether he pays Cm or not.

I haven’t read all the replies but just wanted to let you know I had a little chuckle at this. Dream on pal!

He couldn't claim for 1 child on £34k!

@Babyroobs but if you read my post, you’ll say that I wanted two thing - men to actual have to pay maintenance AND for the benefit system to be changed to update.

I believe that benefits should be reduced £ for £ for CMS. The state should not pay for feckless parents.

The reason that isn’t the case now, is that for some reason the state seems to have no interest in criminalising non payment of CMS, so benefits pick up the slack.

[quote Cocomarine]@Babyroobs but if you read my post, you’ll say that I wanted two thing - men to actual have to pay maintenance AND for the benefit system to be changed to update.

I believe that benefits should be reduced £ for £ for CMS. The state should not pay for feckless parents.

The reason that isn’t the case now, is that for some reason the state seems to have no interest in criminalising non payment of CMS, so benefits pick up the slack.[/quote]
Yes I absolutely agree that CN should reduce benefits. It's a very unpopular opinion on here though because apparently the reason it doesn't is because it can be paid sporadically. The government need to get their act together to deduct CM at source for those who won't willingly pay.
I had an ex collegue who had four kids by four dads and each reliably paid CM yet she was also getting a huge amount of Tax credits for four kids. It's absolutely shocking.

Am I the only one thinking the starting point should be 50:50 and each parent standing on their own feet? Regardless of the XH not wanting to pay maintenance, OP says she doesn't want less time with the children and a lower UC claim as a result. Sounds like she's happy to forego the maintenance to avoid that.

I totally understand that whilst the law seems to have zero teeth for non payment, and loopholes abound for the arseholes who hide their income, it simply can’t be implemented.

I worry too about the abused women who would take the benefit reduction without making the claim. I think it shouldn’t be the receiving partner who has to claim - I think the state should step in and force it, so no-one can be intimidated into not claiming.

@WeeFae

He couldn't claim for 1 child on £34k!

Absolutely criminal that he earns 34k and won't pay. Op should absolutely go through CM.

I can (kind of) see where he’s coming from re: housing. London is v expensive but if he moved further out then presumably he’d not be able to see the DC as frequently and may not be as available to have them if OP is working/studying. If he shared with a friend, the friend may not want kids there overnight or to have them in the house for any length of time at all.

He could get a one bed and sleep on a sofa bed. He could pick up extra work, apply for better paid jobs 🤷🏽‍♀️

@dreamsarefree do you have much experience of children with two homes?
The start point should be: “in the interests of the children”. Which it theoretically is.

I’m divorced. We have very flexible arrangements that in some weeks are 50/50. I have no doubt that my two would be absolutely fine with 50/50. They see both houses as home, and wander between them at will. They’re lucky that both parents can provide a bedroom each and duplicate everything (even iPads). So I’m far from against 50/50!

However, for some children, 50/50 is horrid. They feel they have no home rather than two. They feel that they live out of a suitcase and never have the thing they want to hand.

You really can’t start at 50/50, you must start at what makes the child most secure and happy.

@RandomMess

He could get a one bed and sleep on a sofa bed. He could pick up extra work, apply for better paid jobs 🤷🏽‍♀️

So could the OP if the arrangement was 50:50

I do have experience and 50:50 works for us and our DC, it's also not one made based on finances. The question here is about claiming maintenance and benefits which is a separate perspective. This is almost 50:50 in terms of time but quibbling over money.

@dreamsarefree glad 50/50 time works for you - I do think it’s lovely when it does, and feel very lucky that it’s worked out for us too.

I disagree this is nearly 50:50 though.

2/7 is nowhere near 50/50.

Also, you have to consider what’s happening on those 2 days.

My friend ‘s XH does Wed & Sat. He collects them at 18:30 on Wed and they go back to mum at 07:30 on his way to work. So yes, he counts that night... but he has none of the financial impact of fitting work around a child (also not on Saturday). They’re happy so I’m not criticising it - but he wouldn’t even say he’s 2/7th of care, as he recognises that he doesn’t even have to know what time school starts and finishes.

I am doing that @dreamsarefree I'm working 24 hours a week, doing a course and I'm fully prepared to get an evening job in a pub or something. He doesn't want to agree to a specific weekend night but wants us to alternate Friday and Saturday nights so he can go out to gigs etc. So how am I supposed to work around that?