Wow! Some...interesting responses on here.
Ugh who's up for benefit bashing bingo
"I know ONE person on benefits I know a little about their circumstances and from that I'm opining the entire system is 'too generous'" ONE does not equate to the experience of millions, you DON'T know her full circumstances and therefore are not in a position to assess whether it's fair or not.
"I don't understaaaand" tons of info available by simple googling or even reading the MANY threads on the subject here on mn
"But that's as if she's getting a salary of X amount" no it's really not the same at all
"I'm not being judgmental" yes! Yes you are!
Someone in her circumstances but working full time earning £26k would still get £188 child tax credits and £149 child benefit monthly too. That's £2256 ctc and £1788 per annum making their annual total income £30,044 compared to her current £26,520:
So that blows the "you're better off not working" out the water. If you REALLY believe being on benefits and not working is easier go ahead and try it! It's uncertain, at the whim of politicians and civil servants the vast majority of whom are incredibly privately wealthy and have zero experience of ever going without anything let alone basics!
"My point is, are articles in the Guardian, saying that 20% of children in the UK live in poverty actually correct." If anything that's likely a conservative estimate as they can only measure those that are "visible" being poor makes people invisible often.
What are YOUR outgoings op? Could you live on that amount? Could you live solely on the wage and child maintenance?
Child maintenance is NOT a benefit. It's (thankfully) no longer included in calculations. It used to be and this very much meant families, children in poverty - because the benefits system always has been and always will be too slow to adjust to people's circumstances - at least when it's not to the govts favour. I was on benefits when cm was included in calculations, if ex paid one month, even if he only paid £5 it was assumed he was paying the full amount regularly and wasn't adjusted until I'd proven that he'd not paid at all for 3 months running. That's why it was changed because there will be mothers in the same position as her who DON'T get cm of the same amount or reliably. Far too many men are not paying when they should be and are paying far far less than they should be.
ANY change in circumstances is a nightmare to deal with.
If THEY cock up you never even get an apology let alone acknowledgement or help with the consequences.
If YOU (even inadvertently) cock up they come down on you like a ton of bricks.
I hold 2 degrees inc one in English and a vocational legal qualification and even I wouldn't dream of attempting to complete the forms myself. They're deliberately designed to confuse and obfuscate. I get help from the experts who are dealing with this daily.
In reality I suspect she is just about getting by while also having the vast majority of the mental load for raising 2 kids and yet you're begrudging her the help she is getting which she is deemed entitled to even under this extremely anti welfare govt.
If employers paid people a decent living wage the benefits bill would reduce enormously - that's who things like tax credits are REALLY. subsidising.
"Why should her employers pay her a massive salary she's a cleaner! An unskilled job" fuck me! Human decency? Because why should the state be subsidising wealthy employers? Because with our living costs that's the true market rate? I take it you work for free? No? Thought not! Unskilled does NOT equal worthless! HTH!
"Is this because other people aren’t claiming the benefits that they are entitled to?" Giving you the benefit of the doubt still...
Yes partly BUT not because they've chosen not to but because unless you know the system inside out and know exactly what you're eligible for. Know why this is? Because its policy (and has been for many years) not to tell people what they are eligible for unless they specifically ask. This is particularly true of more specialised benefits. I've even had benefits "advisors" outright lie that I wasn't eligible for things I absolutely was! There are still many many such instances being reported.
Organisations that can help are limited not only by lack of funds but restrictions on their advertising so people aren't aware of their existence.
I'm in receipt of disability benefits, they're under particular scrutiny at the moment because the sick and disabled are easy targets because they rarely have the energy (emotional or physical) or the ability to challenge unfair treatment.
Again many multiple examples in the press and reported in activist groups (which have sprung up out of necessity) of assessors outright lying, claiming paralysed people can walk, people born blind can suddenly see, people barely managing to breathe dying of cancer "fit to work", learning disabilities instantly curable by a mere stroke of their pen. Miracle workers!
In addition most benefits have been frozen since 2015 meaning they've gone down in real terms.
The introduction of UC has been disastrous with some claimants left waiting months until they receive their first payment - but their "old" benefits are stopped immediately the day their UC claim starts - BEFORE they receive any money.
These people form a large part of those using food banks etc.
Another large group that need to are those awaiting their first pay cheque - because again the majority of benefits cease as soon as start work, even if they are still eligible for them - the dreaded quote "while your claim is being reassessed" And even those that aren't supposed to even be paused often are "in error" these "errors" if you get them resolved at all is usually many months later - from personal experience, that of friends and family as well as reading that of many others.
This is one major reason why many on benefits are fearful of returning to work - because they know it's likely to mean AT LEAST a month with NO money AT ALL coming in - could your family survive with NO INCOME for a month? Possibly 6 months or longer?
"She could work more hours to be fair, as the kids are at school." What about school holidays? A low wage rarely covers holiday childcare. You also don't know if her or the children's health is 100% may be why she works part time or if she has other caring responsibilities...
She may have said what she did to avoid an awkward conversation with someone she barely knows or to save face.
"Someone who has spent 15 years working as a part time cleaner may well find it difficult to find any other kind of work." Well you don't actually know this do you? She could have a better cv than you're aware of, she could be or could in the future undertake further education or training, she could if her health allows simply take on more hours cleaning or specialised cleaning. A friend of mine has her own specialist cleaning company, my mums been a cleaner at times because the hours and location suited her (school hours, local to our schools) but while she left school young with few qualifications she later obtained a-levels and a diploma via adult education and went on to be head of security in a supermarket as well as holding other managerial roles along the way when she was happy to take on salaried roles with longer hours as my siblings and I grew older. I've known cleaners with degrees and PhD's who were doing the job for a variety of personal reasons mainly relating to hours and caring responsibilities. Just because you know her as a cleaner doesn't mean you know her.
"For those being nasty, you never know when you might be in need of help, plenty marriages, jobs etc end, no one knows what's round the corner." Absolutely!
When I had dd I was happily married, had a good well paid job, had my health and I believed the potential for more success career wise.
A mere 5 years later I was a disabled, single parent, unable to work and on benefits. A nightmare divorce, car accident and other health issues and I now know dds own seemingly minor ailments many related to her later diagnosed disability. Nobody could have predicted that.
"I do know her circumstances actually" no you don't you know only what she's been willing to tell you in an acquaintance relationship. There are things about my circumstances my closest friend even my mum don't know. I believe that's true of most people.
"My point is that, are we building up a problem for the future? If she goes full time, when the kids leave home and the benefits stop, full time hours on minimum wage is a salary of just over 1k per month net. That’s a huge drop in income from 2.2k per month net. Will we have an increasing amount of single, middle aged women, living in poverty in the next few years? Is that not a concern?" As a country? Yes. Because the cost of living continues to rise, people's health & fitness decline as they age, contrary to govt claims there AREN'T more jobs so she could well struggle to find full time employment, the cuts to ALL education means people are neither qualified nor confident to take on higher level roles, an ageing but retired population also needs money to live on which people are struggling to attain...
"I’d throw in the cost of housing too." On another thread there was a link to an article talking about the lack of taxation of landlords feeding into more people becoming unscrupulous/incompetent landlords. Housing is VERY poorly regulated in this country, we're only barely starting to address this - try getting a private tenancy if you're in receipt of ANY amount of housing benefit - virtually impossible. Also a dearth of social housing thanks to Thatcherite policies on right to buy PLUS stopping councils building more.
Notsuchasmugmarriednow1 - wow! Utterly disgusting posts from you. Have you EVER struggled financially yourself? I mean really struggled to buy food and other essentials? I strongly suspect not with that attitude.
"When will some people remove their heads from their arses and realise we rely on these unskilled roles? If everyone in unskilled jobs got better jobs tomorrow society would collapse" exactly the shameful snobbery of some is disgusting and says far more about them than any poor or low paid worker.
Indianamolewoman - no way she is paying for all that on a low paid wage and benefits not possible. So she must have income/support from elsewhere - which could also be legitimate and within limits for her still to receive those benefits but she could also be up to something shady.