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Original poster

Its all going to get nasty.........(rant alert)

60 replies

Lizzer · 29/05/2007 16:55

ARGH! There that feels better already. I'm in such an awful position that is making me feel part disgusted with myself and part completely right. Can you decide what is right?

Ok I'll start...Dp's dad sadly and suddenly died in Jan, its obviously not good and has been tough on all of us. Finally we get some good news that I'm pg and we have afocus again and are looking fwd to the future.

When dp's dad died he left a house and not much else to dp and his brother (who I get on well with, always have been a close family) HOWEVER, his bro and fiance have now moved into his dad's house and instead of selling and splitting it, he's going to buy dp out. Makes sense.

EXCEPT, he's not in any rush, and why would you be when you have relocated, don't have much work on, you're grieveing, and you don't need to pay a huge, or for that matter ANY, rent like they were doing in London?

We're renting and want to buy a house before baby comes in dec, but apparently will get penalised if we pay a huge chunk off early,and we can't afford a massive mortgage,and a small mortgage leaves us little choice on the housing market here (which is why we're renting in the first place) I don't want the family to start arguing or get involved but it's really annoying me, but then on the other hand I think to myself 'stupid cow you wouldn't even be buying if this awful awful thing hadn't happened, you horrible bitch!'

I'm so

OP posts:
PetronellaPinkPants · 29/05/2007 17:01

Have you sat down and discussed it with them? I mean really explained your situation? I appreciate that it is not great timing etc but they have not waited to move in have they?

You can get plenty of mortgages where you can pay off lump sums, or you could get an offset mortgage and put the lump sum in to offset?

I guess you need to decide whether it is worth potentially falling out with them over, or if you could wait by getting a suitable mortgage or renting for a bit longer. This sort of thing can cause awful rifts so tread carefully

Original poster
Lizzer · 29/05/2007 17:10

Thanks petronella, yes I do want to say something but the problem with discussing it is that dp is convinced we can afford this huge mortgage (I don't know exactly why there's a penalty but something to do with him being self employed/certified) And GET THIS, his bro has said he would offer us £10K towards the mortgage of his own money! (Rather than the £80K house money) This means we would still have this huge mortgage. Dp will not stand up to him and Ifeel like the bitch if I say anything.

Just to clarify I would be happy with a 3 bed ex council property up for sale up the road but dp wants a 'project'. I keep trying to get him to see how much he would have to work to afford the 'project' he wouldn't have any time to do up said 'project'. Leaving me , dd and baby in a draughty old house for the next 3 yrs!

And yes I'm so scared of there being a rift

OP posts:
Twiglett · 29/05/2007 17:14

quite simply DP brother has to value the house and mortgage your share so that he can give you that as deposit

it makes no financial otherwise unless he is happy to pay the difference in interest and any redemption penalties on top of your fair share

tell DP that this is about your family's security

oh and consider getting married because you'll be up the proverbial creek without a paddle should something happen to DP

Twiglett · 29/05/2007 17:15

house is only worth 160K .. where is it? are you sure? I didn't think one could buy a house for 160K any more

MissGolightly · 29/05/2007 17:17

Hello, I have lived in similarly complicated situations after the death of my mother.

The solution is: your BIL is living in YOUR DP's house (or half of it). Therefore he should either buy your DP out or pay your DP half market rent for the property as long as he lives in it.

If they choose not to buy you out immediately you need to talk to a mortgage adviser about the mortgage options. In a "normal" fixed rate mortgage you should be able to pay off about 10% a year without penalty and the remainder at the end of the fixed period, again without penalty. But as PPP says there are plenty of other options. If you get a variable rate mortgage you will probably get a less favourable rate but will get complete flexibility on the terms.

Twiglett · 29/05/2007 17:17

80K is worth about £366 a month on your mortage (based on 25 years at 5.5% which is base rate)

tell DP that .. its a huge amount of difference to you

tribpot · 29/05/2007 17:17

Very sorry for your loss, and congrats on the pregnancy.

Sounds like the first thing you need to do is take some independent mortgage advice so you know where you stand re: the capital tied up in the other property. That way you can be on surer ground if you do want to raise it with the BIL (and why wouldn't you?).

We're in a similar position in that dh co-owns his parents' house, so we have capital tied up there which we cannot liberate because they need to live in the property, and obviously can't afford to buy us out. That's sustainable for us in the medium term but I'm not happy about it.

Can't believe they just moved into the house without discussing things, btw. What if you wanted to live there?

MissGolightly · 29/05/2007 17:20

Cross posted with Twig. You don't need to get married (unless you want to) but you MUST get your DP to make a will leaving his half of the house to you. Otherwise as Twig says, if he gets run over by a bus you will have nothing.

Original poster
Lizzer · 29/05/2007 17:21

The North! It's only a 2 bed cottage, pretty though.

We only want our mortgage for £180 which must sound so little to you but to us it's £1000 a month we can't afford (rent is £440 - again 2 bed cottage) We can do £700ish which is what it would be with a huge deposit.

Thanks for being so blunt twiglett, I need to stop being so emotional about it (blame pg)

We were going to get married before I got pg and don't want to be fat bride, perhaps I should reconsider.Fast.

OP posts:
MissGolightly · 29/05/2007 17:22

BTW I don't think it's disgusting to want to sort this out sooner rather than later. There is no point in letting this drag on, the longer it continues the harder it will be for your BIL to buy you out - the market is rising so it's in his interests as well as yours to get the property transfered to him at as low a rate as possible.

PetronellaPinkPants · 29/05/2007 17:23

ok I do have an idea

Based on your figures you are going for a repayment mortgage

So...just go interest only until you get the cash from bil. Then you can switch to repayment again.

PetronellaPinkPants · 29/05/2007 17:23

Maybe he is hoping the property market will crash and he will have to pay less

At the very least get it valued now and agree that that is the figure otherwise you are not buying in the same market

Mumpbump · 29/05/2007 17:24

Agree with your dp making a will asap. I would also check if the value of half the house is assessed at the date on which you are paid out which would be logical to me if your dp has a half share in the house. The way house prices are increasing at the moment, it is likely that your dp's brother will end up paying more which is a good incentive for him to pay your dp out sooner rather than later.

Original poster
Lizzer · 29/05/2007 17:33

Thanks for your msgs girls.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who's gone through it...

Tribpot, I think dp is going next week and that sounds like the type of mortgage that you said, Miss G.

Yeah they were a bit sneaky, first they moved in to 'do it up' before putting it on the market, then said they would buy dp out. BUT I don't think its maliciousness, I really don't, its just a bit of dark pragmatism on their part. People ARe funny creatures when it comes to saving a few quid aren't they?

OP posts:
Original poster
Lizzer · 29/05/2007 17:35

PPP, can you do that? Sorry, I'm such a crap financial non entity! Does it make a huge difference to monthly payments?

OP posts:
Original poster
Lizzer · 29/05/2007 17:35

I like your thinking Mumpbump

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Twiglett · 29/05/2007 17:45

Lizzer I do come across rather bluntly sometimes .. .. sorry

OK say you want a 180K mortgage and you've put down a deposit

say your mortgage rate is fixed at 6% (you can probably beat this but as self-certificated might find it difficult)

at that rate it would cost you (assuming standard 25 year mortgage)

Monthly repayment: £1173.40 (most sensible option)

Interest only: £900

IF YOU ARE GIVEN THE 80,000 you are due

Monthly repayment: £651.88(saving £521.52 PER MONTH)

Interest only: £500

Plus don't forget as you're buying you'd have to pay stamp duty at 1% of value which BIL doesn't have to because he's inherited so again you're £1,800 worse off than they are

mortgage calculator here

Twiglett · 29/05/2007 17:47

now THAT was blunt

Twiglett · 29/05/2007 17:51

oh and you really should try to put down a minimum of 10% deposit in order to have the best range of first time buyer mortgages on the market .. on a purchase of 180K that's 18K (so the 10K BIL offering not really enough .. well it would be but would limit your mortgage choice)

Original poster
Lizzer · 29/05/2007 17:53

Well poke me in the eye with a blunt twig!!

Thanks so so so much for that twiglett. It's really helpful, I'll show dp when he gets in... I think it puts things in perspective...

OP posts:
LIZS · 29/05/2007 17:55

Can you get a part and part mortgage short term , the interest only part being the 80k you can pay off with the capital, the rest as a repayment for longer term. Set a deadline for bil to pay and importantly agree the amount now plus interest for any delays , in writing. At very least he should be renting your dh's "share" in the meantime. Realistically you probably won't move until the autumn now , by the time you have looked, made an offer, done the legal stuff etc so he has ample time to get his finances sorted in time for you not to have to worry about the 80k (and btw having a large deposit might make a big difference to the interest rate you are charged, saving you money too)

Original poster
Lizzer · 29/05/2007 17:57

We've got a bit in savings too but then that could be the 'doing up the house' money and the main deposit can be the house money. I feel quite positive about this, hope the woman selling the house can wait for a wee while til it all get sorted out.... there's no other offers on it yet so fingers crossed.

How long do you think a mortgage application should take start to finish if they went in next week?

OP posts:
Tinker · 29/05/2007 18:00

Can't you get some legal advice? Who was the executor of the estate?

Twiglett · 29/05/2007 18:01

don't see why you can't treat it as a standard purchase with BIL mortgaging at the same time as you're sorting out the purchase so that his funds hit your solicitor on day of completion

what I'd do is get 2 illustrations of your mortgage at the 180K and the 100K rates.. then invite BIL to dinner and show them to him and ask him if he could sort out his mortgage

would be difficult to say no with the cold hard facts in front of him and it puts him in the 'embarrassed position' rather than you

Blunt Twig

Twiglett · 29/05/2007 18:03

oh I am not an IFA nor do I have financial training .. I've just sorted out a few mortgages and consider myself quite financially astute (don't know whether its the economics degree or the Scottish mother that did that to me)