'FL / MLM' Thread 3

[Eyespying]

Continuing the valuable discussion of 'Forever Living' and other 'MLM/commercial' cults.

WhiffyBiffer The first video link I gave you keeps buffering, so if you have the same problem, please try this one.

Thanks but it was ok for me

rayofhope With respect, I didn't ask you if you were taught not to retail the product, but if you were taught a plan of duplication in which you didn't need to retail the product to 'achieve financial freedom.'

In 'MLM' rackets, at first, adherents are invariably told that they should retail products, but in reality, the products are effectively-impossible to retail in significant quantities.

That's why 'MLM' adherents who persist always end up buying piles of products themselves and why the 'MLM' racketeers can then claim that they aren't responsible for any 'distributor's' financially-suicidal behaviour, because they teach all their 'distributors' to retail.

rayofhope - In order for you to understand exactly what you were involved in, please try to think about your 'FLP'-related activities, but ignoring the smokescreen products and all the reality-inverting/controlling 'MLM/direct selling' jargon.

The bosses of self-perpetuating criminogenic cultic goups like 'FLP,' and their propagandists, have developed, and constantly repeated, the 'MLM/direct selling' jargon in order to dissimulate centrally-controlled, closed-market, money circulation schemes in which the overwhelming majority of the schemes' revenue has been secretly deriving (unlawfully) from the schemes' constantly-churning losing-participants who quite literally have not possessed the accurate vocabulary to explain the cruel trick which they were (unconsiously) the victims of, and which they (unconsciously) tried to inflict on their friends, and relatives, falsely believing that 'MLM' would be ultimately to their own, and their recruits', benefit.

In 'MLM' rackets, the products hidden function has been to act as a cheaply-procured investment commodity (valueless wampum - effectively unsaleable on the open-market) which has been given an artificially-inflated monetary-value by the racketeers in a closed-market. The over-priced 'MLM' investment commodity has invariably been been ascribed quasi-miraculous pseudo-scientific qualities/powers by the racketeers.

In the false expectation of future reward, chronic 'MLM' adherents have been deceived into regularly buying a quota of the over-priced investment commodity and into wasting their own energy, time and funds, in an inceasingly-desperate attempt to find, and maintain, more vulnerable persons who can be deceived into entering the closed-market and doing exactly the same.

MLM rackets have been specifically constructed to convince victims that failure to achieve success must have been entirely their own fault.

In reality, it has been effectively-impossible for any rank and file 'MLM' participant to generate an overall net-profit from the operation of a so-called 'MLM business.

In this way, billlions of dollars of losing investment payments (laundered as 'sales') deriving from an endless-chain comprising countless millions of people around the world, have continued to be secretly transferred to a relatively small (but growing) syndicate of fabulously wealthy (but sociopathic) copy-cat 'MLM' racketeers (many of whom are US citizens who have bought high-level political/regulatory protection).

I think they're very clever in not saying you don't need to retail (well in my group they were)

One plan I was told to do 1cc of product (worded to me that this would be personal use and retail) and then recruit 2 people a month.

So you're doing 5cc a month through your business and you teach everyone in your downline to do the same so means you're doing over the 4cc to access team bonuses. In reality, most do not recruit 2 people a month. I know a couple of my upline who were then buying excess product to ensure they were getting their 4cc.

You get cc's from everyone in your downline (this turns into a percentage amount of it once manager) so that's how the top people are doing 12.5k cc's a year. The more cc's the better the incentives. Then personally just need 4cc to get paid their team leading bonus.

rayofhope - What you are describing (albeit in jargon) is the classic 'MLM' dissimulated closed-market swndle, in which the losing investment payments have been hidden behind a dense wall of wampum products, jargon and mystifying mathematics.

In your 'FLP plan,' you were actually told to ignore external reality, to keep handing over a specific sum of money each month and to recruit 2 more people to do the same, ad infinitum.

For decades, 'MLM' racketeers have peddled their transient victim/adherents 'plans' to construct ever-shifting 'networks' out of obedient human building-blocks all temporarily handing over their cash each month and trying to recruit more obedient transient human building blocks to hand over their cash each month, etc. ad infinitum.

This type of self-perpetuating cultic fraud behaves exactly like a virus or a cancer.

Ironically, you can get sent to prison for instigating a computer virus, but (currently) if you instigate a virus for the human mind, no one will hold you to account, because the same viruses have been maliciously designed to render their victims incapable of complaint.

I wish I'd never come across it. I'm glad I've realised and can now stop myself spending more money on it.

rayofhope - In the end, you've got to laugh at 'MLM,' despite its tragic results. Fortunately, the damage MLM has caused you, isn't beyond repair.

The 'MLM/cult' virus can get into almost anyone's soul at a time of vulnerablity.

Many people know that 'knowledge itself is power,' but few people seem to realize that, by the same token, ignorance is vulnerability.

The important thing now is for you to make sure that your new knowledge of how 'MLM' functions, makes you a stronger person.

There's no shame in falling for a cultic racket and admitting this: the shame lies in falling for a cultic racket, but then refusing to face up to reality.

I personally consider you to be an exceptional person due to the courageous way you are now facing up to reality.

If only there were more people like you rayofhope.

Well said Spy. Rayofhope, you are an inspiration for us all , I have a glimmer of hope for all the bots that are being duped by these mlm scams, thanks to people like you.

It's widely-known that in cultic groups like 'Scientology,' adherents are programmed never to defend accusations against the group and its leaders, but always to attack the 'suppressive' person(s) making the accusations, by completely ignoring the evidence and incessantly demanding:

'What are your crimes?'

Bearing the above in mind, MN readers should be interested to read this most recent paranoid piece of 'MLM income opportunity' cultic propaganda signed by Michael Johnson (the boss of the 'Herbalife' racket).

www.washingtonexaminer.com/the-case-of-herbalife-and-activist-investing-run-amok/article/2575912

Mr. Johnson follows the above 'Scientology'-style tactic, and inverts reality, by ignoring the quantifiable evidence and steadfastly pretending that anyone who says that 'Herbalife' is a criminal enterprise, is a criminal.

It is also interesting to note that I openly-stated that 'Herbalife' has been the legally-registered corporate front for an 'Amway' copy-cat major criminal enterprise (and is, therefore, an effectively-valueless company) long before Bill Ackman made essentially the same pronouncement in December 2012 and backed it up with a billion + dollar short-selling gamble.

Not surprisingly, Michael Johnson makes absolutely no reference to me nor to my in-depth analysis of 'Herbalife' as an unoriginal cultic racket - in which I predicted his paranoid reaction to persons challenging the authenticity of his group's 'capitalist' controlling fairy story (with almost complete accuracy).

Sadly for Mr Johnson, all apologists/propagandists for totalitarian/ totalistic movements are obliged to follow an inflexible script in which they are the truthful and enlightened good guys battling against the dishonest forces of darkness and evil.

Predictabilty has always been the great weakness of cults and totalitarian regimes.

The What are your crimes defense/attack is used by Lance Armstrong and his team in the Storyville documentary, The Lance Armstrong Story - Stop At Nothing, shown again last night on BBC 4.
There are a number of parallels with MLMs in this documentary. From the public finding it simply unthinkable that a con has been perpetrated on such a scale for so long to the way Armstrong attacks people both within the court system and personally, openly stating that he will destroy those who speak out against him. People are also scared of his political and media connections and, quite simply, his wealth. Thankfully a few see that the emperor has no clothes on and are willing to call it as they see it at great personal expense.
It's a great documentary and is as much about human nature as it is cycling so non sports fans shouldn't be put off.
For those with access to iplayer
www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b048wq0z/storyville-20142015-2-the-lance-armstrong-story-stop-at-nothing

ambler21 - I concur with your Lance Armstrong 'MLM' comparison.

Strangely, French television broadcast Alex Gibney's 'Scientology' documentary yesterday evening

About 3 years ago, I wrote an article highlighting the remarkably-similar, inflexible, reality-denying, narcissistic behavioural characteristics exhibited by the bosses of the 'Herbalife' racket and those exhibited by Lance Armstrong.

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The bosses of 'Herbalife' are manipulative and abusive criminals who have obtained fame and fortune through a highly-organized pattern of cheating and obstructing justice internationally. Currently, in the face of an overwhelming mountain of evidence proving their guilt, Michael Johnson, Des Walsh and their criminal associates, have been steadfastly pretending to have achieved the American Dream honestly and to be patriots and philanthropists who are the innocent victims of lies.

It was mainly as a result of some of Lance Armstrong's criminal associates blowing the whistle that he was finally obliged to confess (albeit indirectly) to being a manipulative and abusive criminal who obtained fame and fortune through a highly-organized pattern of cheating and obstructing justice internationally. For years, in the face of an overwhelming mountain of evidence proving his guilt , Lance Armstrong steadfastly pretended to have achieved the American Dream honestly and to be a patriot and a philanthropist who was the innocent victim of lies.

Lance Armstrong now pretends to be thoroughly ashamed of his previous behaviour and, consequently, he wants the sporting authorities to reduce his unwarranted 'death sentence' (i.e. a lifetime ban from all sport) and give him a second chance.

----------------

You probably won't be at all surprised to learn that Lance Armstrong (who once pretended to be a living testament to the power of positive thinking) has been a paid speaker at various 'MLM' orgies of deluded self-gratification.

He is one of the worst adverts for developing a 'win at all costs' mentality, of all time.

ambler21 Lance Armstrong is a fake sporting hero who deceived a number of authentic corporate sponsors into paying to associate with his dissimulated fraud, whilst the bosses of 'Herbalife' are fake corporate sponsors who continue to deceive authentic sporting heroes into accepting payment to associate with their dissimulated fraud.

Lance Armstrong apparently still imagines he can launch a second sporting career as a triathlete.

Perhaps Lance also imagines he can get sponsorship from 'Herbalife?'

Now if there was an Olympic 'irony' event, surely a 'reformed'-Lance Armstrong promoting the 'Herbalife Income Opportunity' would surely win him, and Michael Johnson, joint Gold Medals?

ROFL. I wouldn't be surprised at any comeback, the american dream leaves the door open to anyone who can appear appropriately contrite on Oprah :)

I do wonder how much Lance deceived his sponsors though. It could be said he was just another, albeit high level, shill for their deceptions. Dropped like a hot stone when opinion went against him and the marketing balance sheet showed a loss. Only to be taken on board again whenever the redemption $ kicks in.
I cant resist linking an old Bill Hicks sketch ....

ambler21 Thanks for the clip.

On the satirical hypothesis that absolutely no American Dream, no matter how improbable (or twisted), is impossible today (provided you have mountains of money and enough media/marketing moguls on your side), imagine Lance Armstrong passing the Oprah 'contrition' screen-test, then going into politics on an 'anti-corruption' ticket and getting elected as US President.

Hopefully, the above scenario will remain just a sick joke, but remember it was Tom Lehrer who said that political satire became obsolete when Henry Kissenger was given the Nobel Peace prize.

Unfortunately, propective Presidential canditate, Donald Trump, evidently is not a fan of Tom Lehrer, but this clip from Oprah in 1988, I think shines a light into the origins of the comic-book Messianic Saviour fantasy currently being recited as reality by Trump and his media machine, and swallowed as reality by many empty-headed Americans.

Taking of media/marketing moguls - they don't need to be on the side of the 'MLM' racketeers, for the 'MLM' racketeers to remain hidden in plain sight: they've only to keep sitting on the fence.

fox13now.com/2015/11/10/multi-level-mecca-utahs-mlms-are-big-business-but-few-make-money/

fox13now.com/2015/11/11/multi-level-mecca-utahns-who-succeeded-and-failed-at-mlm-efforts-share-their-stories/

Less than two days after the recent Paris attacks, I've received a particularly creepy (anonymous) 'MLM' propaganda comment on my Blog.

The comment (which I haven't posted) was sent three times to my article, "Donald Trump fronts 'ACN' - an 'MLM' racket, preying on British Muslims."

mlmtheamericandreammadenightmare.blogspot.fr/2015/07/donald-trump-fronts-acn-mlm-racket.html

The comment (evidently not written by a native English speaker) contained the standard pretence that I'm negative and 'not knowing how ACN business owner working.'

There were also links to recent propaganda videos featuring young European Asian 'ACN' adherents.

The comment concluded with the somewhat disturbing claim that:

'ACN Business giving good path for stopping becoming IS terrorist.'

Since my last comment, an avalanche of further links to 'ACN' propaganda videos has fallen on my Blog.

I've not looked at all of them, but the ones I have opened, feature British Muslim men in an child-like emotional state which can only be described as religious ecstasy or rapture.

These sadly-deluded fellows evidently believe that 'Allah' guided them to 'ACN,' but I'm not quite sure exactly where they get this religious revelation from, or how they reconcile it with the fact that Donald Trump has been fronting the object of their unquestioning devotion.

This particularly enraptured British Muslim 'ACN' adherent has apparently appeared in a Harry Potter film.

www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/17/us-investment-filings-herbalife-idUSKCN0T603Q20151117

Today it was announced that the Soros Fund (which is no longer controlled by George Soros) has dumped 2 millions 'Herbalife' shares. However the person who was apparently responsible for making this amoral investment, no longer works for the Soros Fund.

More than 2 years ago I published an in-depth analysis of how, and why, the name of George Soros had appeared in the tragicomic 'Herbalife/MLM' fairy story.

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mlmtheamericandreammadenightmare.blogspot.fr/2013/10/george-soros-and-herbalife-hlf-racket.html

At the beginning of August 2013, it was reported that the Soros Hedge Fund had bought a large stake in 'Herbalife,' causing shares in the counterfeit 'direct selling' company immediately to jump 9%; for it was also implied that the messianic billionaire, George Soros, had personally been responsible for making this trade.

The temporary re-inflation of the market price of 'Herbalife' shares, meant that (on paper) Bill Ackman was around $300 millions down on his $1.2 billion short-selling bet that 'Herbalife' is a fake enterprise which will soon be closed down, whilst (again on paper) Carl Icahn and the Soros Hedge Fund, were hundreds of millions of dollars up on their own long bet against Bill Ackman's short position.

The person who was largely-responsible not only for the Soros Hedge Fund buying a significant chunk of 'Herbalife' shares, but also for making sure that the rest of the world knew about it, is Wall St. whiz -kid, Paul Sohn. He is reported as boasting to a gathering of fellow Wall St. whiz kids (whom, for obvious reasons, he wanted to pile in on the 'Herbalife' deal) that :

'George Soros broke the Bank of England..! He can break the back of Bill Ackman!'

Not surprisingly, Mr. Sohn's reckless behaviour surrounding his 'Herbalife' trade, immediately became the subject of an insider trading complaint filed by Bill Ackman, with the US Securities and Exchange Commission.

nypost.com/2013/08/28/sec-looking-at-soros-herbalife-trading/

With a level of hypocrisy (and irony) that is close to exquisite, in public, young Mr. Sohn and his wife, Sarah, have professed to being enthusiastic supporters of 'LIFT' - a charity which 'aims to combat poverty and expand opportunity for all people in the USA.' In private, young Mr. Sohn seems to have become so bedazzled by an opportunity to make quick and easy money, that he has completely failed to apply his professed-morality, let alone commercial common-sense, to his deeds. For there is absolutely no doubt that 'Herbalife' has been part of an ongoing financial, and psychological, holocaust (with a small 'h') which has secretly consumed countless millions of vulnerable individuals by brainwashing them into believing that 'Multi-Level Marketing' is a viable, and legitimate, 'business opportunity,' in which failure to make money, is always entirely the fault of the participants never the sponsors. Sadly, whether he cares to face reality or not, Paul Sohn has risked a large quantity of other people's money, supporting an effectively-valueless, and demonstrably-criminal, enterprise dressed up as a 'business.'

seekingalpha.com/news/2935666-feds-to-announce-criminal-and-civil-actions-related-to-dietary-supplements-this-afternoon-major-players-slump

www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/17/us-doj-investigation-dietarysupplements-idUSKCN0T628320151117

www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/reuters/article-3322542/U-S-DoJ-announce-actions-against-dietary-supplement-makers.html

cheeky has posted (on the other mlm thread) an interesting link on Philippines pyramid selling...

www.culteducation.com/group/1256-general-assembly/8460-a-very-thin-line-between-multilevel-marketing-and-pyramid-schemes-.html

stopfaffing - I was contacted by a fillipino earlier this year wanting my opinion of 'One Dream Global Marketing Incorporated.' I told this guy that it was a yet another 'MLM income opportunity' racket and that he should not touch it with a barge pole. A few weeks later, he sent me this link .

www.thephilippinepride.com/p2-billion-pesos-lost-in-latest-mlm-scam/

Even then, the instigators of the 'One Dream' racket insisted that they were innocent.