Low heartbeat and slow growth between scans - is MC inevitable?

[digitalgirl]

I've had two early miscarriages in the past 12 months, but I have one ds conceived with no problems.

Had a scan last Monday at 6+1 where sac measured correctly for dates, yolk present and hb detected. Was advised to return in two weeks for a repeat scan.

Felt a loss of symptoms for a few days last week so brought scan forward to today. Even though I felt symptoms come back today went ahead with scan for reassurance. But it's been horribly inconclusive - baby only measures 6+3 when I should be 7+2. Heartbeat very low. Have been told to return for weekly scans.

I asked what they would do if there was no change next week. They said as long as there's a heartbeat they won't do anything ie no erpc.

Am I just going to have to wait for my baby to die? Or is it likely that it could still 'catch up' and get the heart rate up?

I don't know how I can keep going? Do people have any success after 3 mc's?

hi, this is horrible - i'm really sorry to hear you're going through it. i've never actually heard of the exact situation you describe so i don't really know about the likely outcome and if they can 'catch up' - though i do know that measuring the embryo at this stage is incredibly difficult so the dating may not be accurate.
what i can say is that people do have successes after three miscarriages. i had four in a row, all at between seven and nine weeks, and though i don't have a baby in my arms yet, and feel as cautious as anyone who has been through so many losses, i'm now 28 weeks pregnant. i certainly began to feel it might never happen but we just kept going. i wish you all the best getting through this.

Thanks sotough, congratulations on getting so far in this pregnancy. You may be a stronger woman than me, I don't know if I could go through this again. I so wanted a sibling for ds.

It's a difficult one digi.

On one hand, early scan's are highly inaccurate in regards to measurement, as are heartbeats. I have asked 2 different sonographers at the same stage as you for heartrate and they wouldn't tell me, they said all that matters is a heartbeat or not.

On the other hand, there are guidelines for growth (1mm/day) and if yours has only grown 2mm, then I would think its an ominous sign.

If I were you I would absolutely keep the faith but in my heart prepare for the worst.

I have had 2 consecutive mc's and 1 healthy DD. I am currently going through the should I/Shouldn't I go for testing nightmare and keep reminding myself that at least if it happens a third time I will get referred for testing and possibly some answers.

Thinking of you. xx

Hi digi

I am so sorry you are going through this fraught and worrying time.

I had 3 mc (well, 4 I think). Last one was immediately before I conceived ds2.

Sonography can be alarmingly inaccurate at this stage digi. Depends on the sonographer and how experienced they are tbh.

Thinking of you x

Thanks banana and bec.

Bec I've been lurking on the sep 08 thread. Wanted to post with my news but didn't want to jinx it. I remember you saying you'd had 4 mc. And I'd wondered how you got through it. But I suppose you just do.

Interesting about sonographers. Last week I had a consultant and a sonographer. Today I just had a fertility nurse do the scan and make the diagnosis.

I am not the best person to talk to re: sonographers!!!!

I have not had great experiences with them tbh...I had very regular scans with ds2 as you know because of ds1's issues at birth and every month it was a different one and every month they would completely contradict one another and worry me silly. With ds1 they scanned me 16 hours before he was born (didnt know I was in labour!) and told me he would be 7lbs. He was 4lbs 15oz and very poorly Its not an exact science.

Are you sure of your dates, digi????

It is easy for me to be philosophical now about my mc as I have 2 lovely dc but it was very hard at the time, especially as 2 of them were incomplete and led to me being quite ill but oddly the worst one was the quickest and most painless It was the week before xmas 2007 and I mc at 6 weeks exactly. Cried for a week. Was devastated. Really thought that was it and that I would never have any more children. I couldnt take any more, physically, mentally or emotionally.

New Years Eve I had a glass of wine and.....ds2 was born on 25th Sept 2008

Where there is life there is hope digi

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Am completely sure of my dates. Was charting bbt, cm and cervix position. I tested positive 14dpo. At 17dpo a cbd showed conception at 2-3 weeks. If today's dates are correct then I would have tested positive at 8dpo.

Have never done any of that so cant help!!!

When is your next scan digi?

Still having pg symptoms?

Scan next Tuesday.

Didn't have many symptoms to begun with then lost the tiredness, hunger and reassuring heaviness in my womb late last week, which is why we brought the scan forward. Got a few twinges this morning which led me to feel positive but that all went out the window after the scan. Definitely had ms and sore boobs by this time with ds.

Feeling a bit nauseous tonight, but think that's more stress than anything.

Could be. Be kind to yourself this week
x

Hi Digi,

Hope you are holding up OK. Here is a whole thread full of people who believe sonographers are often wrong

and here is another one full of people who believe that taking low dose aspirin helped them hold on to their beans. Obviously I am not a doctor and it would be really foolish of me to suggest you take aspirin, but is there someone you can ring and ask if it would do you any harm? I am under the impression that if it is low dose it isnt considered harmful and may just help - can you get that verified by your doctor?

I really hope you see that strong beating heartbeat on Tuesday xxx

Digi
I am crossing everything for you. I just had my 6 wk scan and the sonographer said I had my dates wrong (I'm like you, my DH doesnt say 'dya fancy it' any more, he says ' whats your temperature?'...so I damm well know what my dates are!) Anyway, my sac was measured at just 3mm with faint visible hb which he (yes a male sonographer) said was about 5+3 (I was 6+4). However, the lovely EPU consultant completely dismissed that and said the yolk size and hb was consistent with my dates and that he may have measured the wrong axis ie width rather than length so not to get stressed about it. Like you I have another scan in 2 weeks which will show if there is growth. Also had hcg levels taken.
My symptoms are coming and going too which is turning me into a bit of an obsessive knicker-checker but when it comes down to it, the best I can do is stay healthy, stay rested and keep taking the folic acid..also stay occupied to prevent dwelling on it all. Yes people do have success after 3 mcs, I've had 4 and there are many many stories of reassurance from people who got there in the end. Stay strong, stay well and try to relax. Let us know how you get on
xx

Hi Jasmine thanks for your story - keeping my fingers tightly crossed for you too.

Unfortunately I've started cramping today and spotting light brown. Which is how my last mc started.

Just finishing off some work then will go home to watch telly and eat chocolate.

Oh digi sorry to hear that. Thinking of you x

digi I just wanted to add about the low dose aspirin. The gynae nurse I've been talking to at the recurrent mc clinic told me last time round about taking it when I had my last BFP. She said it can't do any harm so it may be worthwhile giving it a try. Anything to feel like you are doing something.

Stay strong honey, I know it probably seems that all is lost, only you know yourself how your body feels. I have everything crossed it's not bad news for you. Be gentle to yourself. Thinking of you x

The aspirin thing is definitely something I'm going to ask about. Dh has been on the phone to the epu today. As soon as this has 'run it's course' I can finally see a consultant and get the recurrent mc tests rolling.

Part of me desperately wants to be pg again - the other part knows I'd be a quivering mess if I somehow got a bfp straight away.

Me again,

every time I read something about aspirin, I keep thinking of you Digi!

Thought you mind find this interesting, its copied and pasted from the Recurrent Buns thread (page 28) Frieda is talking about an extract from Lesley Regans book:

(this is a quote from the book)
"Aspirin is a drug which combats inflammation and also prevents blood from clotting. It has been tried and tested in pregnancy and found to have no side effects upon the baby, although it does cross the placenta' '...fortunately the investigators went on to follow all the babies who were exposed to aspirin during their time in the womb. Happily I can report to you that the physical and neurological development of these babies is entirely normal - some of the children have been followed to the age of seven years and no problems have been identified'"

Just to be clear on this, she is talking about LOW DOSE aspirin.

best wishes xxx

Thanks mummya funnily enough I just posted on that thread after reading your quote there.

It's good to know there is something I could try next time but also makes me feel sad thinking maybe I could have saved this baby if I'd taken it this time. The last two mc's I put down to bad luck - first one was while breastfeeding and I thought my body wasn't ready to sustain a growing baby and a nursing toddler. The second one I thought maybe I still hadn't balanced my hormones after giving up breastfeeding. This one, everything was right. It had been 6 months since my last miscarriage, I had three periods, was doing acupuncture, temps were looking good. Hormones tested fine. Inhad been very healthy. Did everything right. Still it's gone wrong.

hi digi really sorry to hear you're bleeding and hope it's over soon. i don't think you've said how old you are, but several consecutive miscarriages after a successful pregnancy seems to be a lot more common than I had realised. I had no problems conceiving and carrying my son, who is now three years old, and was only 34 when we started trying again, so the four miscarriages that followed were a complete shock. after three miscarriages you will be entitled to tests on the NHS, as i'm sure you know. However, they don't test for everything, so if those tests reveal nothing, i would consider going private if you can afford it. now is not the time to make any decisions about whether or not to try again - nobody is eager to subject themselves to the possibility of another miscarriages until they have had a good few months to recover from the one they are going through. in my case each miscarriage took about four months to get over enough to contemplate risking it again.

Oh I'm so sorry, I see from the other thread you are bleeding and cramping now. Wish I had some comforting words for you, it just seems so very unfair that you have to go through this.

Digi....am so sorry

You need to grieve for this baby and the future you had looked forward to BUT wrt trying again the EPU nurse that I saw after my last mc gave me great advice...

I asked her how long I would have to wait to try again (I was 35 at the time) and she said that as the mc was straightforward and my HCG levels went back to normal very quickly there was no need to wait. I know some docs day wait a few months but she didnt agree with that. I got pg again straight after that mc (no period in between) and ds2 is now 2

If you feel up to trying again straight away there is no reason not to.

Thinking of you
x

Digi - so sorry for you, sending you hugs.

Can I add bit of a warning about aspirin? Be careful taking anything 'just in case'. I have a minor blood disorder picked up by the recurrent clinic which is being treated. My blood has the opposite problem to most in that my clotting point is high ie I have thin blood which makes me alot more at risk of bleedng and haemorrage (sorry, still cant spell it). I have been told in no uncertain terms to stop taking it after being told originally to take it 'just in case' by my gp. Please have the various tests at the rmc clinic before trying anything, I think its the TEG test, I know you probably want to have the feeling that you are doing something tangible but be aware that not everyone needs the same treatments.
Take care
xxxxx

thanks jasmine. Have a scan on Tuesday to confirm, and will ask then about the pros and cons of taking it.

Can the test for clotting be done fairly soon? I got the impression that for some of the tests they wanted to wait 2 complete cycles in order to do those. My cycles are so long (40 days, but last cycle after MC was 60 days), that I don't particularly want to wait for ages just to find out nothing's wrong.

Hi Digi
I havent heard that tests need to be delayed. I'm just thinking back to mine - my previous mc was July and my tests were started later that month...so no, there was no suggestion of waiting. They were done at St Marys, Paddington. The clotting tests were done immediately and the others about a week after (because they had to be done at another clinic)I think there were about 8 of them in total plus the pelvic scan. Good luck. Oh and dont do what I did and take a nurofen the morning you have the appointment...makes the consultant tut alot and will then tell you to come back when you are drug free!

xx