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Miscarriage/pregnancy loss

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mmc - let it happen 'naturally' or not - what to expect?

69 replies

nevercansaygoodbye · 27/09/2010 18:12

Hi.
I am about 9 weeks pregnant but after an early scan was told that the pregnancy looks like it didn't develop past week 5 or 6. I have a follow-up scan next week, and have been told I might miscarry in the meantime, but if not I have to decide whether to pass naturally or have a d and c.
I am a bit worried about the pain and what I might see if it happens naturally - can you see anything other than clots with a 6 week old embryo?
Also, I'm not sure how much time to take off work afterwards - right now I can't concentrate on anything at all and want to hide at home with the phone off the hook! Just sort of numb and sad and want to not really be here...
thanks in advance.

OP posts:
ChoChoSan · 27/09/2010 18:24

Hello, I'm so sorry to hear what you are going through, I can only let youknow what I did and why. I had an mmc at 9+5, baby had stopped growing at over 8 weeks.

Having had a previous mc I decided I didn't want to spend anymore time in the early pregnancy unit, and so decided to let things pass naturally at home. I was worried about what I would see, and I think I passed a sac but it was like a large clot. At 6 weeks I would expect it to be just clots. I found it very painful, like contractions, but again sac was considerably bigger than yours might be, so hopefully that would not be the case for you.

In my case, I had already started bleeding, so I did not have to face the unknown 'when will it happen' that you will. For me the most important thing was to be home, and I hope you make the right choice for you. Whatever you decided, I will be thinking on you, and wish you happines for your next pregnancy, though I know that can seem a distant hope.

FrameyMcFrame · 27/09/2010 18:38

Hi, I'm also sorry to hear about your mmc.
I did and felt the opposite to ChoCho, they offered me the d&c there and then and I went ahead that afternoon as I just wanted it to all be over.
I wasn't particularly worried about seeing anything, I just didn't want to be in limbo any longer. Feeling pregnant but knowing I wasn't going to be having a baby after all.
I was in the same situation as you having to have a follow up scan after a week and also at 6 weeks.
After that week of waiting I just wanted it to be all over and get on with my life.
Best wishes to you whatever you choose to do.

emptyshell · 27/09/2010 18:44

I've just had one - it was quite long and drawn out before they decided it was an actual miscarriage (took them about a month to make their minds up).

I've been through one before which passed quite easily - but by the time they'd decided what was going on (we had a glimmer of hope at the rescan with something visible in the previously empty sac and a second sac visible too - but sadly by the third rescan it was all starting to fall apart) I'd been on "am I aren't I going to bleed" pant paranoia for so long I was pushing over 10 weeks and just needed my life back to get a future to be honest.

As a young woman I'd had the medical version with the tablets for an abortion (long story involving quite a very unpleasant man and an abusive relationship) and it was so distressing and painful - and hadn't fully passed everything - that I went for the surgical option. Went in at 7.15... surgery by 9... discharged myself by about 11.30 (wasn't going to stay longer as the lady in the next bed had her toddler with her so I came round to cries of "mama mama mama").

Worst bit of the D+C (I loathe that other term for it) was coming round wtih no knickers on and a pad just shoved there like I'd had the cowboy builders in (I'd actually been suffering really bad insomnia so remember feeling really fucked off that someone had woken me up from my sleep to be honest). Oh and they absolutely butchered the shit outta my hand getting the canula in - considering I've got the most nice exposed veins in the world - the bruise they ended up with giving me was horrific!

vnewmummy · 27/09/2010 18:44

Hi,

I only found out last wednesday at my 9 week scan that I had had a missed miscarriage. I had an EPRC the next day. Ithought I may want to wait a week to see what happens naturally. I already know it was the best thing for me to do. It was a simple operation and I think it has not been anywhere near the pain level that a natural MC would be. I am at the start of a long journey to get better and recover.

Have they confirmed that the baby has stopped growing or do they just suspect it? Do you have any pains or bleeding? I had none so total shock and had had a scan at 7 weeks which looked fine, heartbeat and everything.

I feel for you and know exactly how you must feel. Sending you hugs xx

vnewmummy · 27/09/2010 18:49

Emptyshell I am sorry you had such a bad experience but I really dont think that kind of information will really help anyone.

I appreciate everyone is different but reading the other posts I get the impression that it is not all bad. As I say they looked after me so well, my heart will take a long time to get better but at least my body is not in limbo.

ljg72 · 27/09/2010 19:04

So sorry your going through this... I have had two mc's in the last few months, and both came away naturally. Both early, 5 and 6 weeks, but the second was very painful.

Passing naturally also is a longer process, and to be honest with you passing the clots was quite upsetting...

Try and do what feels right for you, and please take some time to recover...take care x

emptyshell · 27/09/2010 19:06

Thank you for being so unecessarily unpleasant to someone posting their version of something that's still very raw and distressing.

They don't generally confirm the baby's stopped growing until they've done a rescan a few days later, in my case there were changes but still no heartbeat so it took over a month to get the official confirmation of the end of it all - a month during which I was ready to start bleeding at any time - and by the end of it all, the being in limbo was the worst part about it all.

I'm giving you an honest assessment of how it felt to come around from the D+C, my abiding memory of it IS the shock of having no pants on irrationally and that shook me up massively... and you decide to go on the personal offensive against me.

I'm not talking about blazeness or something in the distant past either - this happened over a week and a half ago, so it's raw and your personal attacks on a poster are directed at some one who was where you are now less than a fortnight ago. Thanks for that. How unpleasant.

Sorry to the OP who's had her thread hijacked in such a nasty way.

FrameyMcFrame · 27/09/2010 19:09

Please don't worry about the op if that's what you decide to do.
I was nervous before hand but I couldn't believe how quick it was. You are only under for about 5 minutes and there is no pain at all.

KTRace · 27/09/2010 19:17

Hello,

I am so sorry you are going through this. I have had 2 MC (one was a MMC) and they were as below.

MC#1 - was 8+6 when I started to see blood when I wiped, had a scan and they saw no heartbeat and told me to come back the following week. The next day the bleeding got worse and painful (more painful because you know why it is hurting iykwim). That night I passed the sac - I could make it out and grabbed it out of the loo. I continued to bleed quite heavily and painfully for about another day then just blood for less than a week. I MC on 19th Dec, by xmas day I was not bleeding so much I could not go on long journey to family and no need to take painkillers. I was scanned on xmas eve and was told it was complete.

MC#2 - this time MMC. Found out at 10+2 that no HB. (died between 8&10 weeks) I decided to go naturally again. Took 10 days for the process to start, but I had back ache from about 3 days after being told. The gushing of blood started about 9pm one night and then was up all night going to the loo every 30 - 60 mins when I felt an urge to let something out. Was not as painful as first time but I think this might be because it took longer in the build up. This time the clots were big and I was unable to rescue the fetus. It was a truely unpleasant time added to which I was on holiday in a strange bathroom - not something I would recommend. The clot passing has this time taken (on and off) nearly 3 weeks, as has the back pain (for which I have been taking painkillers). I think FINALLY I may have had a complete MC and don't need to worry about where the loos might be if I am out and about.

I would suggest that you take time off work, say 2 weeks to allow yourself to grieve and to get over the worst of it physically.

Whether you let it happen naturally or not is up to you, for me personally I would have an ERPC next time if I am unlucky enough to require one. I am a SAHM and I have found dealing with all the mess (emotional as well as physical) hard enough with a 3 year old, I could not have done it and worked as well.

I felt numb at first then when the bleeding started so did the tears.

I am so very sorry you are going through this, whatever you decide to do will be the right thing for you.

Take care xxx

KTRace · 27/09/2010 19:20

empty I am so very sorry for your loss x

nevercansaygoodbye · 27/09/2010 19:35

Hi everyone
thanks so so much for all the support and information - although a little hard to take in right now while I am still a bit stunned at what is happening, I will go back and read it again later or tomorrow.

I suppose a silly part of me wants it to happen naturally so there will be no danger of terminating a viable pregnancy (my dates are a bit messed up as in I think I am one week/ten days less pg than my lmp shows) but I suppose the next scan will definitely definitely confirm things.

As I have 2 small children who I am at home with two days a week maybe the d and c would be best as I am fearful of being out with them and it all suddenly starting, them seeing me in pain and fear.

In answer to someone's question - they have written in a report that I have 'most likely a non-developing IUI pregnancy' - they have not seen a heart-beat, presence of an embryo is 'inconclusive' and keep telling me that we all need 23 pairs of chromosomes and what probably happened was this embryo didn't have the right number. I am 40 which I guess is also a factor.

I have had no pain or bleeding and asked for the early scan because I went from feeling very pregnant to only a bit pregnant.

I live in Ireland where there was a recent scandal of women being told they had mc, and then insisting on a second opinion and everything being ok so I suppose I am a little wary of all that - see for example miscarriage.about.com/b/2010/06/19/irish-mom-gives-birth-after-miscarriage-misdiagnosis.htm

as for anyone hijacking the thread - no worries, the rawness of the emotions comes across so clearly. How we are treated through this horrible process makes such a difference, and I personally was really disappointed at the way the news was told to us and the so-called 'counselling' follow up - basically a prescription for painkillers and advice to call an ambulance if the pain was too much!

OP posts:
MiniMarmite · 27/09/2010 19:39

I'm so sorry for your loss, I have had 2 mmcs
under similar circumstances - the first time I had no bleeding but felt something was wrong and had a scan at 10 weeks. The second time I booked a scan for 8 weeks and found out then.

In both cases the embryo stopped developing at 6.5 weeks (approx).

I was told that you see nothing more than clots if you choose the natural route.

The first time I was in two minds about whether to wait so I gave it a few days but really found I wasn't coping so booked an ERPC. I'm glad I did. Even though I had started to have some light pink discharge (so my body had started to recognise the need to end the pregnancy) I didn't even start bleeding when I took the pessary to open the cervix and start the bleeding. I think it may have taken a while for the process to complete naturally and I didn't feel able to move on until I knew the pregnancy had ended fully.

It is also worth noting that, even after the ERPC, I tested positive for pregnancy for several weeks after the procedure which I found difficult emotionally and from the practical perspective of trying again.

The pain for the first 12 hours after the first ERPC was considerable but manageable but I had barely any pain at all the second time.

The second time I did not hesitate to book the ERPC straight away. Partly because (thankfully) I had DS by that point and wanted to be able to be physically well as quickly as possible.

Both times I found the process of going into hospital to be looked after quite comforting. I took a couple of weeks off work and they were very supportive of this.

It still took a long time to get over losing those babies - until I fell pregnant again really and even then I have some difficult associations with scans.

Natural management may be the way for others - it is a very personal thing but I feel that ERPC was the best thing for my physical and emotional recovery.

I hope you receive the support you need whichever route you choose.

emptyshell · 27/09/2010 19:45

nevercansaygoodbye I know they scanned me three times (leaving me to cook for nearly a fortnight between each one) to compare measurements and make sure there was no changes in the sacs before they took the decision to call it all over.

First scan showed one empty sac (and your blood runs cold when you get asked, "you ARE sure of your dates aren't you"), second showed some changes in there but no viable baby and the second sac that had by then appeared just to mess with my mind (since found out there's a family history of twins) - because there'd been changes in there they wouldn't proceed at that point, third scan showed no changes apart from that the sac was starting to become less distinctly shaped and basically everything was starting to fall apart. By then I just wanted it all over to be honest - I'd had enough (and was sick of the sight of the ceiling of the EPU scan room). I needed desperately to be out of limbo by then.

Like I say - the D+C was straightforward, just the disorientation of coming round with no undies on threw me completely. Apart from that, like I say, I just remember feeling utterly cheesed off that someone had dared wake me up!

I joked, when they put us in the private room to "get over" the bad news that they proudly had a leaflet for every eventuality out there... by the second scan when they were mildly stumped about what was going on - we did giggle about whether they should make a "we don't have a clue what's cooking in there" leaflet too. THAT was the sum total of their aftercare and counselling.

nevercansaygoodbye · 27/09/2010 19:50

thanks minimarmite.
I really do want to try again asap, time not being on my side age-wise. We have been ridiculously lucky in getting pregnant each time so hopefully it can happen and the right egg and sperm meet next time! If anyone knows if a erpc or it happening naturally is any factor in conceiving soon again please let me know.
I do realise I may have no choice and it all might happen suddenly and dramatically.
At the hospital I was told to take at least two weeks (incl scan time and mc time) off work from today, and I can't imagine really being able to move on or concentrate on anything until this is all all over

OP posts:
Lobyd · 27/09/2010 20:00

I'm so sorry for what you're going through.

I've just had a natural miscarriage - I was scanned at 8.5 weeks and the baby's heart rate was slow. I had a scan booked for 10 days time, but I miscarried day after the scan.

I had had bleeding already, which is why I went for the scan, then when it really started I had some bleeding with very large clots - (big enough to make a splash in the toilet, sorry if TMI)

This was from about 1pm. At 6pm I started getting severe pain - definitely more than period pains. Then an hour later came the last large clot and the pain stopped.

2 days later I am still bleeding but to me the pregnancy is so obviously over. I will still be attending the scan I had booked in to make sure.

So that's my very recent experience - I kind of feel that despite the pain and general goriness it wasn't the worst way to do it - plus I have a small DD and it meant I didn't have to be away from her for any length of time - although the painful hour I did have to leave my DH to put her to bed.

I'm thinking of you and everyone else on this thread- I hope whatever you decide works out for the best

sneezecake · 27/09/2010 20:38

my first pregnancy was a mmc, I was 14 weeks and was going for my dating scan as I was over the 12 wk I had told everyone I was pregnant, I was a shock when she said thre was no heart beat. Sad

I was taken to EPU where they gave 3 options,
1 let me mc natturally (they gave me a week for this to happen before they would intervine)

2 medical management, pessary which opens the cervix

3 D&C

I went for option 2 as nothing went over the week, and I didn't fancy a general anaethetic.
In my experience it was quite painful, I had numerous pain killers and gas and air!
I had to pass everything in a bed pan so they could see if everything had come out, ie the foetus and the placenta.

I personally wasnt disterbed by the placenta or the blood clots, but the foetus (abut 9wk) did upset me.
that was nearly 4 years ago, I do still think of that time occationally, but now I have my beautiful ds.
All I can say is that over time you will accept things which have occured. but let yourself heal Smile

goodnightmoon · 27/09/2010 20:46

i'm sorry you're going through this and hope your scan makes this decision theoretical.

i had two mmc - one naturally after a similar situation to yours and the second by ERPC after an earlier (but late-developing) heartbeat stopped.

I highly recommend ERPC over natural miscarriage. I found it incredibly painful and literally thought I was going to die at one point. (went into shock, temperature plummeted, weak pulse)

It took about six days with lots of huge clots, a sac, etc. and was just a miserable experience.

i have a 2 year old son now and definitely wouldn't want to be going through a natural miscarriage and trying to look after him.

lilmissmummy · 27/09/2010 20:55

My 3rd pregnancy was a mmc, I went to my 12 week scan at 13+4, the baby had died at approximately 6 weeks. I was given the same options as sneezecake.

I went with the D&C option, My scan was on the Friday and they booked me in for Monday morning.

When I went in, they were very kind and gentle with me. I went in to theatre with a hospital gown on and nothing else with a towel put between my legs. The surgeons were friendly and pleasant and put me at ease. I woke up exactly as I fell asleep just with my blanket pulled up around my chin in a recovery room with lots of people coming and going.

It was the best that I could have expected and I feel so so sad for those that have struggled with having to deal with a bad miscarriage along with the heartbreak of losing your baby.

I bled for about 2 weeks lightly afterwards, I didnt pass any tissue or clots and physically felt better after a couple of days. I didnt need any pain relief stronger than Ibruprofen.

So sorry for your loss :( all of you

MiniMarmite · 27/09/2010 20:58

NCSG I was lucky enough to fall pregnant 4 months from ERPC both times. I feel like because they were MMCs where my body seemed to be wanting hold on to the pregnancies for I don't know how long that the ERPC was the quickest route from that perspective but I have no stats on it.

kat2504 · 27/09/2010 21:04

emptyshell, I can relate to your experience had pretty much the same in early August.

I actually wish someone had told me the truth about the operation beforehand. I'd still have gone ahead, I couldn't bear the limbo any more and I had to wait five days as it was. The leaflet from the hospital and the info from the nurses made it sound all ok and no pain or discomfort, so I wasn't prepared for the reality. As I said, I'd still have done it but it would have been easier to cope if I had known the truth. It would also have saved me from being admitted to the gynae ward in the middle of the night unnecessarily three days later if I had just been told that what to expect might be rather heavier and more painful than a period. Unlike what the leaflet said!

Thanks to the lovely mumsnetters i knew about the coming round with no pants and the towel just shoved there. So I did expect that. And had a pair of pants pre-prepped with a towel already stuck in to make life easier for me. I was not prepared for the fact that they had not wiped me clean down there after they had finished and I was covered in orange stuff (antiseptic?)from the theatre. Maybe some hospitals are better. But if I knew that, it wouldn't have upset me much.
I'd never had an op before so I naively imagined that I'd come round in the ward and the first person I'd see was my partner. Not the case, obviously they bring you round in recovery room next to theatre. So long trolley ride through the hospital before seeing partner. This upset both of us as he wanted to be there with me when I woke up. I never thought to ask about this as my head couldn't cope much with thinking at the time.

The canula for the anaesthetic does hurt. I have good veins but they messed mine up too and then had to mutilate the other hand. I had bruises and couldn't have my hand held tightly for about a week. But that's a relatively minor problem!

I was discharged at lunchtime, had some painkillers and went home to rest. It was really not all that bad. The staff were nice, i was given my own room, it was a bit painful but not excruciatingly so and at least it was all over.

As I say, the info told me to expect a period like bleed and perhaps a day or so of cramps. This slowed down to spots and then three days later I ended up at A and E as I was in a lot of pain and passing clots. By the time I was discharged the next morning I felt a bit like I had wasted their time and all I needed was to be told the truth (and given stronger painkillers!) If I'd have known that could happen I would not have been so scared and would have put up with it at home. It was three times the bleeding I'd expect on a heavy day. But no fever, no infection, no giant clots so I had no need to be in a hospital bed.

vnewmummy am glad that your experience of the erpc was as positive as it could have been at such a hard time. It#s always better when things go smoothly but it isn't the case for everybody. Mine was the best thing to do at the time, if I'd been a couple of weeks less far along I might have opted to avoid it, but it is still a nasty thing to have to go through and I think it is better to be prepared for it. It will hurt a bit, it will be a bit messy afterwards, general anaesthetic is no fun, and there may be a bit leftover to pass yourself. Most of that paled into insignificance for me compared to the awful pain in my heart.

I wish all the best for a speedy recovery to the ladies on this thread that are suffering a m/c at the moment. I'm a few weeks ahead of you and I am (I think) fully physically recovered now and hoping to try again. My emotions have dulled from anguish to a sort of dull heartache and I am able to get on with my job and enjoy things in my life. It still hurts me a lot but it doesn't consume me entirely anymore, it's now 8 weeks since my erpc. I hope you are all feeling better soon.

kat2504 · 27/09/2010 21:05

blimming heck sorry about the essay!

InMyPrime · 27/09/2010 21:34

nevercansaygoodbye - this is my experience with natural miscarriage but I was a bit further along than you, 11 weeks and foetus had been 8+6 (I like to say 9 weeks to make myself feel a little better Sad ) so an earlier MC might not be so bad. I am Irish too and struggled with the ERPC option / D&C as it is basically the same procedure they use for abortion and I had seen those graphic anti-abortion videos with blood everywhere when I was at school so I was quite scared of the surgery option and delayed in booking it out of fear. In the end, I waited too long as the MC happened by itself before I had a chance to get the D&C:

Thread I started

If you scroll down, my second post relates what happened with my natural MC. Wrt to seeing the foetus, I just passed it into a commode at the hospital and it felt about the size of a small fist coming out. Mine all came out in one go so I didn't have the numerous clots others speak about. I didn't see anything as I was (luckily) in the hospital so the nurses took the bedpan away as they had promised me I didn't need to see anything. Then they came back and told me it was most likely all out and I had a US scan the next day to confirm.

So, to sum up, natural MC can be very painful. I don't think it would be the same for you as you have been through labour and you are at an earlier stage BUT you never know. The upside of the D&C procedure is that you get it over quickly and the risk of complications is not that high. The risk of natural MC is that you go through all that pain and still might need the D&C if it isn't all out and you might also see the foetus if you are left to manage it at home. At 6 weeks, it'll be very small, no identifiable limbs or features etc, but it might still be traumatising Sad. It's a tough decision to make.

Sorry for your loss, by the way. I hope you are feeling better soon, once you are over the shock and get the physical side of things over with.

JaynieB · 27/09/2010 21:47

So sorry that you're going through this.
I had a MMC with my first pregnancy and a natural miscarriage, I'd started to bleed already and went for a scan to be told there was no heartbeat.
The experience was distressing, physically like a painful, heavy period, but I felt terribly sad and was grieving for the baby I had lost. I more or less went to bed with a hot water bottle for a couple of days.
I had good support though - the hospital provided a lot of information about groups to contact and when I rang my GP she asked me to come in and talk to her, which I did and she was lovely and it helped me a lot.

nevercansaygoodbye · 27/09/2010 22:03

inmyprime - just read your other thread - ' faint and cold with heart palpitations' sounds pretty horrible. I am so sorry for your loss, and for every one else posting, so much suffering and determination.
did anyone else just want to hide? I do! Also scared of moving too far in case it starts very suddenly...

OP posts:
kat2504 · 27/09/2010 22:10

Yep I wanted to hide for a few weeks and that's pretty much what I did. sofa days. I needed that for a while and listening to the often unintentionally insensitive things that people around you come out with to comfort you made me think hiding was the way forward! It took me a month to be able to get back to a normal routine.