Has anyone NOT been on HRT? Has the menopause been ok if so?

[ForeverDelayedEpiphany]

I'm 44, and think my body has been in perimenopause since my youngest daughter was born in 2020.

Literally textbook symptoms, itchy ears, hot flushes, weird tingling, itchy skin, horrible palpitations and awful waves of anxiety, much worse migraines, dry eyes, thinner hair... it's not been too good, but it's been bearable.

The thing is, I am extremely sensitive to medication side effects, especially ones that affect the endocrine system. I have a medication induced neurological involuntary movement disorder called tardive dyskinesia that is like Tourette's and Parkinson's disease combined (and was caused by an off label antipsychotic). When I had to use some antifungal cream for thrush after breastfeeding once, it made my involuntary movements worse (as I think it is probably something that affects oestrogen and therefore dopamine receptors (.

Anyway, my rambling post is basically a way of saying I'm not sure about HRT but perimenopause symptoms aren't really great and seem to be getting worse.

Has anyone been through the menopause but not taken HRT? If so, how are you doing? Has it been ok?

They aren’t exactly the same though because every woman is different. They are chemical replications of hormones.

How fortunate you had such mild symptoms. Thankfully medication exists for women who’s lives are badly affected by menopause.

Now 67, I chose not to put more ‘chemicals’ in my body. I did go through a year or so of chronic sleep issues but came out the other side. I supplement B12, D3, K2 and magnesium with zinc and eat a sensible diet. How did generations before us cope!??

Their molecular structure is the same. It's estradiol. And micronised progesterone. All women have that.
The dose may be different but that's controlled by how much is used.

It's not me calling it 'body identical'- it's the medical profession.

Many didn't.
Women called it' nerves'.
Many of my Mum's friends were on tranquillisers for decades, didn't leave the house and withdrew from life with all kinds of ailments.

And until not that long ago, they died a few years post-menopause. And before that they died from the plague etc.
Many women died post childbirth in their late 40s. Not all, of course, but they didn't live 1/3 of their lives post menopause.

This isn't saying they should have used HRT, but it's wrong to minimise something that affects a lot of women even if it wasn't talked about so much.

I find it interesting how there's so much discussion over HRT but not the Pill which is synthetic.

But they are still manufactured chemical compounds, there's no getting away from that.

I agree with many points raised, particularly in the fact that even "natural" or body identical medication is very much something that can affect different people in different ways, depending on their genes or the way they metabolise the drugs etc.

Heck, when I was taking melatonin once after I'd been injured by the off label psychotropic drugs and had my movement disorder, I found that even a so-called "natural" substance was something that made my voice sound "brain damaged" and weird/slow (I think the medical terminology is bulbar).

Hence why i am terrified in some ways of any chemicals as I can react to even innocuous substances like soy sauce, calcium vitamin pills, or something like the flavouring carrageenan.

My body is weird lol 😆

This is something I find fascinating. Years ago, women just "coped" (or not!)

God knows how. It must have been terrible and soul destroying knowing you'd potentially have years of terrible symptoms that could never be relieved! 😳😢

TLDR: eat healthily (low sugar) to feel good.

I'm out the other side (60s) and didn't have HRT. I had a few hot flushes at night but it wasn't awful. Had tingling in my feet and read that gluten can cause this, so I cut out wheat for a few days, felt such an improvement I stayed off gluten for about four years. Felt really good, and lost loads of weight.
I do eat the occasional croissant or bit of sourdough now with no ill-effects but if I have low-quality industrial bread or cake, biscuits I get stomach ache, so I think it may be the process/ added sugar or modern wheat varieties rather than the actual gluten. I think your body can tolerate less as you get older - when I was young I could eat ( and drink!) all sorts of crap with no ill-effects.

I never took the pill either….

I've been through the whole thing without prescribed HRT. Not because I have any strong feelings about HRT itself, I took the pill for over 20 years, but somehow I never got around to it.

Perimenopause was far worse in my opinion than menopause. That went on for about 4 years and is when I had flooding, hot flushes, mood swings, strange aches & pains, forgetfulness etc. However, the symptoms kept changing and every time I'd think "Fuck this, I need HRT" the symptoms would change and the flooding would stop and something else would kick in. The most persistent and annoying thing was the hot flushes. I used bioidentical progesterone cream that I purchased myself and that helped alleviate the flushes a bit. I'm not sweaty, so I didn't get drenched in sweat, I just felt like I was on fire from the inside out. It was so intense, I couldn't believe that I wasn't glowing red like a furnace, but actually outwardly, no one would have any idea! I also found that if I stayed very still and didn't get agitated they would pass in a few minutes. For about six months at their peak, I'd get woken in the night by the flames raging inside me, but again if I lay very still, it would pass in minutes.

Now, I'm about 3 years post menopause and I use vaginal estrogen pessaries twice a week, not sure if people call those HRT but otherwise that is it. I love being menopausal. I feel so much more even keeled and really enjoy never having periods.

There's evidence (e.g. the LIFTMOR study) that it is indeed possible to make a significant difference to bone density in later life, not just slowing decline but actually increasing bone density. Preserving muscle and improving balance also have a significant, and often underestimated, role to play in preventing falls and fractures.

Of course building muscle and bone is much harder than in your 20s (sigh!) and I very much agree with the message that osteoporosis prevention needs to start earlier. But it's also really important that people don't give up because they think it's too late, particularly as staying strong and mobile has few downsides and many benefits.

I agree menopause does blur with age. But I think of aging as running up a down escalator that steadily accelerates through our lives so it gets harder and harder to make upward progress. We're all going to end up at the bottom eventually, but staying still will get you there much more quickly than consistent efforts to make upward progress!

Here, have this -->🥇

Middle age women have the highest rate of suicide because of debilitating perimeno symptoms. 'Coping' is a pretty poor substitute for enjoying life.

I'm not sure the comment about all tablet forms of HRT not being body-identical is correct. I take Elleste Solo tablets as I simply don't absorb the gel (confirmed by blood tests - and I sometimes wonder if some of those women who say HRT didn't help them also don't absorb the gel which is heavily pushed by doctors). These tablets contain estradiol and are body identical according to my consultant and Dr Newson's web page confirms this;

''There are some oral estrogen tablets that are body identical such as Elleste Solo and Zumenon. These contain the hormone estradiol, which is identical to the estrogen made naturally in your ovaries. While there remains a small increased risk of blood clot with any oral estrogen preparation, it is less with the body identical tablets [1].''

It's misleading to attribute that high rate entirely to peri symptoms. There are many other recorded factors, including the pressure of caregiving responsibilities to children and ageing parents and economic pressures. Peri symptoms will be a factor in some cases, but definitely not all.

That's really interesting what you've said about gluten. I too had to cut it out when my peri symptoms were at their worst – just a tiny bit would make my stomach hurt and I'd ache all over, like I had flu. I have been thinking about trying to reintroduce it now I'm off HRT and my symptoms haven't (so far) returned. I would kill for some fresh sourdough slathered in butter! It's also so inconvenient to always have to cook separate pasta etc from the rest of my family.

I was talking mainly about the progestogens, but you're right about the tablet you take.

@Ohnobackagain hi please could you say what the side effects were?

Lots of great information about people's experiences still coming, really interesting to hear them.

I might consider asking my GP for advice, but not the one who prescribed me the horrid antipsychotic that ruined my life - she wrongly told me that it wasn't possible to get harmed and get the movement disorder i have from the week of the drugs... whereas my self diagnosis was proved correct by my neurologist who told me that some poor susceptible souls are injured by just one pill.

I'm going to stick to the specialist gynaecologist advice, and possibly another neurologist. It's just so annoying that mine retired 😒 🙄

I went through the menopause without any HRT and was fine. Had my last period when I was 50. But in my early 60s I had a bone scan and was diagnosed with osteoporosis.
I'm now, at nearly 68, on HRT in an attempt to protect what's left of my bones!

So, my advice would be to get a bone scan now, as a baseline; make sure you do lots of high impact, bone building exercise and strength training from now on; take vitamin K2 (mk7) and vitamin D3 supplements and ensure you have plenty of calcium-rich foods in your diet.

Then get another scan in about 5 years time. If there's been a lot of deterioration despite the exercise and diet and supplements, you may need to consider either bone meds or HRT.

59 and haven't had a period since I was 50 .
Peri menopausal from 38
I did not take HRT but only because I found the whole HRT thing so confusing and felt too stupid to admit that I didn't understand the ins and outs no matter how much I have read .
Menopause was a rollercoaster through hell for me and I wish I had been more pro active about educating myself on the advantages of HRT .

No HRT here. I'm 54. I still take the POP so that may be masking symptoms.

All of which also apply to men. Women have to deal with perimenopause in addition. But mostly, the smug 'i managed, so everyone else should too' of that poster is what provoked my response. As someone who self harmed and came very close to taking my own life because having a hideous set of symptoms while trying to deal with all the issues you note was too much.

I don't think that poster was being smug at all. Everyone's experience is valid. I'm sorry yours was so tough, I hope you are through it now.