Oestrogel: new packaging (yet again)? - Thread 2

[ConfusedEasily]

Carrying on from a previous thread by Cosmetichamster which can be found here:

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/menopause/4696464-oestrogel-new-packaging-yet-again

@ThisOrdinaryLife , I have always managed to get the estradot , even when they say they can’t , after a panicked phone call they manage to find it . That said I’m due a repeat prescription soon so I may not get them this time and my GP said to try the evoral 50 so o guess I will have to do that.
@BlessedMog - I can totally relate to you as I had a similar experience on one week of the new gel.. I was very scared as was my husband who didn’t recognise me from literally the week before . It was an absolutely hideous time and it was definitely a reaction to whatever is or isn’t in the new style gel. Interestingly I thought my GP would humour me but she actually said she wasn’t surprised as she had several other patients who corroborated my claims . I’m glad you are feeling better x

@BlessedMog I recognise myself in your post, and send solidarity. You are not alone. It's frightening how quickly things spiral out of control. Hold your head high, this is a manufacturing issue not a BlessedMog issue. 💐

@Charla20 Fingers crossed you're able to get hold of them this time.
You make a good point, it's as though there is now an ingredient in the new packaging that shouldn't be, as well as the absence of the active ingredient that has worked for so many of us for so long.
I must admit I'm baffled, but that could be a side effect of not being able to think clearly because I'm so tired!

Hello,

My GP has switched me out to Estradot but I haven't collected it from the pharmacy yet

I've been on 2 pumps of gel and she's switched me also to the 50 patch.

What should I expect in terms of using the 'dot'? GP said something about putting it on every two or three days not daily? Is that right? Also I'm keen to know how it works with showers, baths, swimming - any ideas?

I'm in post-surgical menopause and still in recovery from a brutal surgery so can't do any exercise for quite a while yet but am very much looking forwards to regular swimming - is that going to eff up my patch situation I wonder?

@LittleMissSunshiner yes patches aren't applied daily like the gel. You only need to apply twice weekly. Just read the patient information leaflet in the box when you get them. And sure they will be fine for swimming.

@LittleMissSunshiner , if it works for you it is so much more convenient ! I put it just above my bikini line and change it to other side each time I change it . It’s no more than the size of a stamp and providing you put pressure on for a while to make sure it’s sticking, it shouldn’t come off . I shower twice a day , swim , go to the gym, have been on holiday and it’s never come loose. What I tend to do is put it on and then get a towel and just press down hard on it for about 30 secs to make sure it is sticking . Another of my friends has gone from gel to patch and she sleeps better and is happier on it too. It’s twice a week so say Monday and Thursday as an example . Good luck x

Reading this with interest and just checked my stock of gel - I have one of the old kind left then 4 of the new. Terrified to try it and wondering two things.

1. is anyone ok with the new packaged gel - is it just some affected or all.
2. are bessin still making the old kind? Can I ask my pharmacist to try and get the old kind or is this it now?

also wondering if anyone has tried Lenzetto spray? Trying to figure out what to switch to if all the gel is like this.

i had noticed some symptoms returning when i was given Oestrodose so avoiding that like the plague. This new issue is just awful.

And also finding it ridiculous that journalists pick up on every sensational story on here but when there’s something this important affecting this many women so badly and putting their mental and physical health at risk they’re nowhere to be seen! Search for this issue in the news and it’s nowhere!

@MumOfOneAwesomeHuman pharmacists will not be able to obtain a long term supply of the old packaging of Oestrogel. Besins has switched to the new cyclindrical container and this is what will be delivered to pharmacies from now on. I have emailed Besins' medicines information department (as a pharmacist) to ask if there are any plans for the company to change back to the old container but I haven't had a reply yet. I will post here if I find out any more information.

Thank you. Fingers crossed they fix the gel even if they don’t fix the packaging, or that these issues are batch related and not the entire stock but I guess it’s time to search out alternatives.

Thank you so much for checking! I found some people on LinkedIn to ask, but your pharmacy approach is much better.
I really hope they sort out the issues asap with gel quality

Ah well, that's because it only affects us.
And that makes me very angry

I'm convinced the issue is how much the pump dispenses - it's not consistent. The consistency also seems runnier and takes ages to dry.

After suffering with terrible hot flushes at night for the last month or so, I've upped my dose to 5 pumps (4 in the morning and 1 in the evening) and I've been a normal temperature for the last few nights and actually sleeping longer than 2-3 hrs at a time. I can't believe how quickly it worked!

I was fine on the recommended high dose of 4 pumps up until this packaging change.

Didn't someone upthread say that two of the ingredients had been altered?

If so, perhaps they could be more specific and provide detail?

That way, women can notify their GPs, pharmacists, and alert on the yellow card system.

The pump volume must have an issue, else why would the pump nozzle have the stopper gadget? It is a faff plus would be quite expensive to manufacture. It must be there for a reason

It's my first canister of oestrogel as I'm a new user so I didn't see the old packaging.

I assumed that the little stopper is to prevent the gel from drying up inside the nozzle?

Maybe people who are having symptoms it's because the volume they're using is different (ie one pump is giving a lower amount than previously)?

Otherwise it would be a matter of looking at the ingredients and looking for a change in formula. If there's no change then there's no possible way that the gel is different, it's just coming in a new canister.

Someone must be able to ask a pharmacist or chemist or the company themselves to state whether there's a different formula or active ingredients being used? Or whether there's a quality control issue with the active ingredients?

About 15 years ago, the pumps had the 'stopper' on the pump.

I used the gel then when it was a white and gold cylinder pump. I never, ever put the little stopper/cap back onto the pump as it was such a fiddle. I always assumed it was either to prevent the pump being accidentally depressed if you were carrying the gel in luggage and the top came off, OR (more likely) it was a security tag to show the pump had not been opened (and used.)

I think it's a security feature to show it's not been opened or tampered with.

@LittleMissSunshiner Many women have emailed Besins and had replies, going back a long time. They say there is no change in the ingredients and the leaflet inside the box gives the list. You can email their customer services (address on their website) if you want to make a comment or a complaint.

Obviously if there is, that could be serious as some women are using it not so much for symptoms alone, but for treatment for osteoporosis or osteopenia. They are assuming they are getting the dose necessary.

The only thing that has changed are the manufacturing sites between some EU countries. Whether the gel is slightly different in 'tackiness' is subjective but it could be a reason why some women aren't absorbing it in the same way.

@JinglingSpringbells

Thanks for this info and the back story.

I've only just started using the gel and it came in the cannister. I put the little stopper back on religiously LOL because I thought it's to stop it evaporating or drying out, who knows!?

As I'm only four weeks post-surgery and had a brutal extensive surgery that put me into allegedly instant menopause, then I'm a bit all over the place in general (pain, wonkiness, healing, recovering, PTSD from the actual entire experience and shocking state of the NHS, etc).

But of all things I'm suffering, the oestrogel must be 'working' as I've had zero menopause symptoms yet. So I don't have a current dissatisfaction with the product, except I don't like rubbing slimy alcohol on myself twice a day so my GP's switched me out to estradot which the pharmacy has ordered in for me.

I hope people can get resolution to this issue as if you all agree it's changed, then something must have!

I've only just started using the gel and it came in the cannister. I put the little stopper back on religiously LOL because I thought it's to stop it evaporating or drying out, who knows!?

I'm pretty sure the little stopper is a security tab ( the same way that you get a little foil cap under a the outer cap of a tube of cream)

The gel can't evaporate because it's only released once the plunger is pressed down.

I’m just jumping on the end here. I recently started the new packaging and thought nothing of it until I woke up hot the other night, and am having awful sleep again. I’m so angry again.

Can I ask how many pumps people are being given? I’m only getting one at a time now.

@DustyLee123 I used 4 pumps of Oestrogel daily. 1 pump daily is a really low dose. Have you to return to your GP soon for a review? If not and you feel rubbish on 1 pump I would see your GP to review for an increase to your dose.

Sorry no, not how many pumps I’m using, how many packages (cylinders) are you getting?
I got 3 to start, but now it’s one at a time.

Oh sorry I see now. I got 4 packs per month. It was loads and I quickly built up a stockpile!