Is 50/50 really the go to in family courts

[Dunkindoughnutty]

I read a lot of threads where relationships have broken down and parents go to court for 50/50 access. Whilst a lot of replies consist of '50/50 should be given.' I'm interested to know if this is actually the norm in family courts?

I'd love to hear from those who work in family law or family courts about what contact agreements are most likely given. (Obviously very circumstantial).

Exactly this, true 50-50 would be more expensive than paying maintenance and that’s what ppl don’t see

My ex has never been awarded overnights, let alone 50/50. However, he'd proved he couldn't follow a court order, regularly abandoned for two years at a time and wrote hideous statements to the court that said more about him than it did about me. There is now a "letterbox" contact order in place and guess what? Not heard from him since. I have been fortunate with family court and excellent Cafcass officers who listened and did their jobs properly. However, this isn't always the case.

I didn't realise AndyPandy was talking about in a 50/50 situation. Though even in a 50/50 situation it might be sometimes appropriate for one parent to pay some level of maintenance, for instance if one earns significantly more, or if one pays the greater portion of the costs of raising the child.

@YetMoreNewBeginnings god this is horrible.

The thing is, who is 50:50 for? If you live close to each other and it doesn't disturb routine that much, great! But I have read cases where children are forced to squeeze into a tiny one bedroom flat, or drive an hour to school each morning just so one parent can have 50/50! To me this is not in the best interest of the child, whatever age they are. Research shows 50:50 isn't great for a lot of children. I doubt many adults would like such arrangements so I don't understand why we inflict it on young children. They need stability and routine. Have a structured arrangement order for holidays and weekends.

Also, I find it crazy that contact and finances aren't looked at together!

It’s honestly incredibly infuriating that you don’t have both DJ’s coming to an agreement together after looking at the family circumstances holistically.

So you then have a ridiculous situation where one DJ has ordered RP to deliver the children hours away, at great cost, in our case at a time when most people would ordinarily be at work. In a location convenient for NRP due to their “high powered career”. Whilst the other DJ fails to make adequate financial provision for all the above. Leaving you at the mercy of CMS and a NRP who games the system to pay zero maintenance. Yet as the RP, you continue to be legally bound to meet these costs whilst providing for the child single handedly. It’s completely illogical.

I spent the first 18 months absolutely terrified as I was being threatened with all sorts, until I realised;

a) he’d never ever want them full time or more than EOW he barely manages the contact arrangements on the CAO as it is—this is still the case now, dc 11 & 8!

b) the court are highly unlikely to take action for minor infractions, against a parent who is meeting all the needs of the child single handedly, unless there were other grave concerns.

So told him to Foxtrot Oscar. I’ve had no threats since, just the stuff he parrots from MRA sites.

@greyfox82 This is what I'm terrified of. I know for a fact my kids would hate 50/50. If I was a kid I would hate it too, having to go between two houses all the time and never having a settled home. I am absolutely miserable in my marriage, but if I had to inflict this arrangement on my boys, I'd give up what I want and just put up with dh indefinitely. In fact, I think he knows this, and therefore he's safe in his cosy lifestyle where I run everything and he does a bit of washing up here and there and thinks that's a fair contribution. What a shit situation 😞

@greyfox82 don't think you're doing them any favours staying with the twat. And the chances of a lazy shit like that following through their 50 are non existent

Unless there are safeguarding issues 50/50 is usually the starting point/ put on the table first but it isn't actually the most common outcome.

The most common outcome is every other weekend and one overnight (or visit) during the week plus half of all school holidays.

@Showersugar yes, I actually called up and spoke with a lawyer and this is exactly what she said. Especially for younger children. I asked the question as I am shocked at the amount of misinformation and 'scare' tactics used on forums like this. I use the word scare tactics as a lot of men use custody and children as a form of control.

Don't get me wrong, I have also heard many stories of women doing the same but essentially my ex even admitted my idea for contact is what's best for child but it's not fair on him. And he continues and continues to push the point.

@yukkamumma exactly! They have a great relationship and I facilitate that, and make sure regular contact is upheld and overnight stays, but for routine and stability I have stood my ground. It's because he isn't in control.

I appreciate there are poor partners…

But kids shouldn’t be punished with the removal of their father by default. Neither should their father be punished too.

The starting point should be 50/50 provided the kids will not suffer and equal arrangements for two homes in place.

I don’t wish to get into whattaboutery, but there are many many cases of fathers been given no access, indeed historically children have been placed with mothers who are violent, drug taking, offenders. Yes a far smaller proportion, but that’s what happens when there is a default bias to one side, any side, so yes the starting point should be equal.

The leanings towards one side or another how we should include evidence of:
illegal activities
violence
accomodation
transportation
safeguarding
and so on.

I suspect that the fact that it’s in the confines of a court system to work out what’s best for the kids, demonstrates the inability of two ex partners to put their differences aside, and work that out for themselves. I know that’s not always possible. eg. when 1 partner is being unreasonable, either because they are just ashos or they unessessarily prohibit the other parent from having a meaningfull relationship, then any third party should start from the starting point of 50/50.

I’m actually kind of heartened to see this thread.. i know many guys in the past who had no relationship with their kids because of the mothers not permitting access. The impact on them was different - some just shrugged their shoulders and sent the money, gifts, cards, and hoped with their kid was16 there would be independant and reach out. Others - couldn’t have cared less and you know they were shit dads. One took his life - at his funeral his sister told me - he just couldn’t live without his kids.

i know men can be assholes.

im ashamed to be one sometimes with some of the threads i read on here.

Tgat doesn’t mean the starting point should be 1 day a week.

I lived 50/50 as a child age 7-18. I hated it and neither house ever properly felt like home.

I feel that the legal system in this country needs to look at having some proper research on what truly is best for the child.

@Bard6817 no offence, this is where lies the problem. Whenever anyone on Mumsnet post anything other than '50:50 shared custody is the best' it gets over taken by men saying exactly what you have said. Nowhere have I said I want to stop contact, or stop my ex have a relationship with his daughter. I want her to have stability and routine.

However, the facts are he essentially lives in a studio flat, can't afford to get better accommodation because of his own debt problems (not my fault) and the decision he chose to move 45 minutes away. Yet, he constantly makes me feel guilty.

1. I have got him car seat and pram.
2. She doesn't have a bed at his. Apparently she never settled in the cot (or was that he couldn't be arsed to persevere with it)
3. I regularly drop my child at his house.
4. I have put up with him letting me (and our child down) time and time again.

Yet I am the bad person because I don't want my child moved from pillar to post for one night a week (child is two). None of what he wants is in the child's best interest it is in his best interest.

Some women are unreasonable but most are not. Many, many men use kids to control. I have to FaceTime my ex every night. It is draining when I work two jobs to provide for my child and he makes me feel guilty ALL the time. Maybe if he spent his free time working more he could provide a better place for his daughter, but he will always be the victim.

Everything I do regarding contact is wrong. I offered to share Christmas Day this year, he didn't want that because he wanted her the whole day. 50:50 only really works if parents live close by and are both equal financially. I told my ex if he has her more he has to pay for the childcare the days he has her. According to him it became all about money. But it's fine to let me pay nearly £2k a month for childcare. Sorry to rant, but we know men have rights! But I get annoyed when they want to pick and choose what they want to be responsible for. Parenting is more than the good parts.

My kids are 16 and 14. Have been involved in 50/50 setup with ex hubby since 2017. My youngest did not want to go to him. Court did not take their wishes into consideration. He was abusive but was still awarded 50/50. I feel it was to avoid maintenance and solicitor advised me not to chase from him as he could potentially try to claim it from me. My kids are constantly living out of bags. They tell me that they are sick of it. They are afraid to speak up and say this to their father as they fear his reaction. I still have to make all their arrangements for sports, after schools activities, appointments.....the list is never ending as you know. My eldest socialises in his time with me because his father gives him grief when he tries to organise time with him.
Court doesn't see the effects the "fair" and 50/50 split causes. I pay mobile phone contracts for my kids to contact me. My son doesn't ring me unless his father is not around and my daughter rings me from.under her duvet cover and whispers when she gets into bed at night.
I know this might not answer your question but this is how the scenario has panned out for us. Wish you luck.

@nats2010 I am so sorry to hear this. The family court is, like the rest of the system, is a predominantly misogynistic system. All down to the judge you have on the day! Crazy!

As the child of divorced parents, I'm glad my otherwise-total-cheapskate father had the decency not to push for 50/50 to get out of maintenance. I really think I would have hated it. I had a close school friend going through her parents divorce at the same time as mine, her dad wanted 50/50 and she hated it. She never felt like she was at home anywhere, especially when both her parents got new parents.

@BubziOwl thank you for sharing your experience. I have family that live all over the country and visiting them is exhausting. I can't imagine living half my time out of a bag and moving. I do think fathers push for this, when it isn't always in the best interest. There are always exceptions. I know a couple who divorced and the mum moved her two young children in with her new partners' four children straight away. The two young children had to share rooms with older children who were essentially strangers and it caused them massive anxiety. The dad pushed for shared care because he believed this wasn't good for his children and I agree.

Essentially, there are selfish mums and dads who push for arrangements because it suits them even if it's not best for the children.

Totally agree @greyfox82 , these things should always be decided based on what is best for the children involved, but too often it isn't judging by the experiences in this thread

My experience is yes, dad could still get 50/50.

ExH had 1 night per week for tea and EOWend until DC was 6. Then went back to court and we ended up with 50/50. He doesn't actually have DC 50/50 because he doesn't want to, it was about control but the courts felt it was in DCs best interests.

And that was with proven abuse against both me and DC.

@MugsAllOverTheLibrary system is fucked! Let's controlling men get away with what they want. Can you imagine how long women would have to fight to get this same treatment in court, it would take decades!

It's been 50/50 since the end of the 80s since I got divorced. I was horrified as my ex had never looked after DS or done anything with him and was very abusive.
I had to fight in the courts for 2 years to get contact stopped which it eventually was when evidence of neglect was presented. He was sent to school dirty, not even in uniform, wasn't fed, was shouted at all the time, homework wasn't done. I had a hell of a job convincing the court despite presenting loads of evidence from the school, childminder etc. The courts didn't want to know.
Eventually it was ruled no contact at all. Ex only did it so he didn't have to pay CMA, which he never did anyway. He fled abroad to avoid it.
DS told the court time and again that he didn't want to see his father and was afraid of him.
It totally disrupted our Iives and ruined my career because you can't work Nd fight for your child. You need to be there.
The day he came home for good was the best day of our lives. Nobody especially not a child should ever have to go through that.
The courts have an agenda they insist on following.

A weekend every fortnight and half school holidays ends up being a default because if a man works Monday to Friday 9-6 plus commute , they can only really see their child at the weekend. Young children are in bed by 7 so a quick dinner could be possible but school drop off the next day might not.
Mum also needs to hang out with the child at the weekend. Weekends are good for seeing extended family too.
An every other weekend routine means that each parent can do hobbies, chores like DIY, date or see friends at night when the child is with the other parent.
Anecdotally I don't know any men who changed their working hours after their kids were born where as I know plenty of women who reduced their hours around the needs of the children. The dads that I know with 50/50 and don't have a new partner or female family taking up the slack are self employed so can organize their work around the school run which is great for the kids.