Please can I have your HONEST opinions on Australia

[gem1981]

Hi

Hubbie and I are looking quite seriously into moving abroad

DH lived overseas (mainly the middle east) when he was growing up as his dad travelled alot with his job.

He has alsways had ambitions to move away from the UK and we have looked at the options and decided that Australia is probably our best option.

we want to move for the following reasons:

1)Better quality fo life for our DCs
2)more relaxed way of life
f3)ed up of being fleeced for every penny we earn in taxes by the UK

I suppose what I want to know is how realistic are we being in thinking that moving to Australia is going to give us this type of lifestyle or is it just a pipedream?

I would love to hear all experiences good and bad.

If you have emigrated there do you have any regrets?
Thanks

hi, chipping in here although in NZ like MrsJC rather than OZ. I agree with alot of what has been said. We sold our house and as hard as it was at the time did mean that I had to give it a good go. Friends who moved here last year didn't and are regretting it as they hate renting and have had to take out a huge mortgage here to buy so they feel settled. It took me 4 years to really feel at home but things did start to get better after 2 - it takes a fair while whereever you move, even within the UK, to have friends you feel comfortable with. Missing friends and family shouldn't be underestimated nor should the journey and the cost of getting home for visits. I've just returned from a month back in the UK and know that I am in the best place for us as a family.

As for the likes and dislikes of a new country - of course there will be things you hate (there's alot about NZ I truly dislike) but the pros outweigh the cons and it's familiarity that I miss rather than place, culture etc....

Tax like here is high, cost of living high, property relatively high - you only really benefit money wise if you benefit from a good currency conversion imo.

A very interesting/alarming thread.

We've lived in Singapore for 11 years, have just been granted Oz PR and have about 3 years to make the move (find jobs etc).

We've visited Oz maybe 15-20 times on holiday now. Love it. Friendly, down to earth people.

We're building a house at Burns Beach (north of Perth) so want to settle there.

BUT we have a mixed race (adopted) DS so a bit alarmed at all this "Aussies are racist" stuff. Can't say we've ever noticed it on holidays, or indeed the sexism, but concerned how this might affect him.

Any views from those actually living in Oz/Perth e.g. Suzy Wong? Is this true? Are we talking old-fashioned attitudes and funny looks like you'd see from older people in the UK, or workplace discrimination, violence etc?

(Although there was a AIBU thread a week or so ago which basically implied that in the UK there are white and non-white ghettos, and never the twain shall meet, so maybe it's the same everywhere.......)

oldnewmummy am that you have found what people say on this thread so negative that you would consider changing your plans. I am white so not really at all qualified to talk about how your son would find living here but Australia is a very multi-cultural country. In fact there is currently running an ad on the telly whose jingle goes "from all the lands on earth we come". Australia seems to me to be proud of the fact that many people want to come and live here. The only qualifying fact is that you need to show Australians that you are proud to be here. It is your identity as being AUSTRALIAN that is important not that you are British or Italian or Chinese or whatever that matters.

Saying that, there are very few black Afro/Carribeans here - what race is your DS? Lots of Somalis and other Africans are coming but there isn't really a big black population compared with the UK. But if you have never felt any racism whilst spending time here I would imagine it is the same as anywhere, some people are ignorant bigoted fools but most are not. As far as I can tell most Aussies take most pleasure in abusing the Poms regardless of colour.

oldnewmummy, Perth used to be quite smalltown-ish but it is rapidly becoming more cosmopolitan (to it's huge benefit). I have a friend here in Sydney who is black (she and her DH are from Zimbabwe) and they lived in Perth for 6 years and loved it. She has not mentioned any racism and I don't believe she would have loved it had she encountered all that much. I hope this makes you feel a little better. I can ask her more detailed questions if you'd like?

Thanks guys.

Didn't say I was changing my plans.

We have a choice between staying here, moving to Oz, moving to UK (or EU), or something else (!), but need to factor in (1) jobs (2) money (3) where we'll be happiest.

If this racism is no more than "funny looks" etc then we get that here so he'll be used to it! Was just concerned that there's a more serious undercurrent that I'd been oblivious to for years, as he's only 19 months so not been with us most of the times we've been there.

Will definitely be asking you Oz residents for more info as time goes on. We have 3 years as I said, so there's no rush. The timing should work out well as he'll be about ready to start school.

He's 1/4 white, 1/4 indian, 1/2 don't know but suspect malay/indonesian, 100% gorgeous

Actually, it's the multi-culturism that I enjoy here.

At work, I can sit around a table in a meeting and see people from China, Sri Lanka, India, UK, Canada, Indonesia, Vietnam etc etc. Everybody is equal and it's a pleasure to get to know people and cultures.

We enjoy days where we all bring in a national dish and share them with everybody else.

Of course, there are bigoted old fools. The worst one I met recently was, funnily enough, a German cab driver. I had to warn the next passenger when he got in as I fled in the opposite direction.

Cross-posted with you oldnewmummy - he sounds gorgeous and I think he'll fit in just fine

hello Oldnewmummy

well you are going to be nearer the great metropolis of Joonadalup rather than Perth.

My kids are exquisite oriental mixed raced. ( I am a big English Whitey from London)
There is racism. People you have hitherto had civil doings with will suddenly drop "C**n" in to the conversation, and they ain't talking about the cheese, and that can be alarming to say the least, however while there has been a tremendous amount of attempted wound-healing and bringing together of the indigenous and imported/dominant communities under the Rudd administration there is a lot of white/Asian middle class complacency and a lot of quite frankly negative and antagonistic experienced in the real lives of working class people who have come in to contact with indigenous population. I 'm not going to attempt to go in to the whole many faceted and emotive issue here but I will say that while it is alarming, the attitude to the indigenous community, one has to, as an outsider, appreciate and observe the real experiences of the people who live them. What I mean is we as incomers have to take a back step, while not condoning the use of racist terms, it's not as straightforward as we may be used to. And there are plenty of strategies (NAIDOC etc) in place that the average person can participate in to change the attitudes towards indigenous people. You don't have to spend your time blushing and tutting, you can get off your arse and make a difference.

Anyway.......... your kids will be ten a penny, much like ours. That's one of the reasons we moved back here. There is an element of racism, if you can use such a strong term, towards the successful socially coherent and affluent Asian (and Asian over here means oriental not South Asian or Indian) community which manifests itself as jealousy of that success but as far as I know there are no racially motivated attacks on individuals or property. But that may change with ensuing economic hardship.

When Mr Wong started infant school here he and his brother were the ONLY Asian kids in the school. I would say it's closer to a fifth of the total now. How times change. He never had any crap growing up, but then he is fully Australian while retaining his Asian identity. And he has a VERY Aussie christian name (not Bruce).

Seriously, don't worry about your kids having a hard time, this really is a country where if you pitch in and put yourself behind your new Nationality you won't regret it. We are all Australians.

Good Luck

Thanks guys. Good to hear some genuine experiences.

Yes, Joondalup does seem to be a great metropolis (not!) - my husband said the shopping centre reminded him of Morrisons in Grantham (where my parents live) which was not meant as a compliment. Still the house will be great (just need to worry about paying for it) and it's well situated for easy access to the city and near the beach. (And Joondalup DOES have art galleries - we bought a picture last time )

Visting in October for a few days and looking forward to it. Been feeling oddly homesick for the UK for the fast few months, so hoping visit to Perth will knock it out of me!

I have only ever lived in Sydney, but more than a third of Sydneysiders were born overseas so I don't think your child would attract a second glance.

Am very impressed by your long-term planning - three years! We moved to China after a drunken conversation in the pub one night

It makes sense to hang on here as long as possible as there's low tax and affordable household help. Also, if we adopt another that's easier/quicker here, although we then have to apply for adoption visa.

Not usually this organised. We ended up in Singapore almost by accident 11 years ago.

As for racism - several times now I have overhead people say "oh, the supermarket was full of poms buying their out of season strawberries - oh sorry twentypence I don't mean like you - your more like a kiwi aren't you?"

Oh yes, I agree. I ended up working in Slough as a huge mistake (particularly because I left a contract in Thailand to work there). You know you're working in a shit-tip when:

a) Sir John Betjeman writes a poem exhorting you to:

Come, friendly bombs, and fall on Slough!
It isn't fit for humans now,
There isn't grass to graze a cow.
Swarm over, Death!

b) Ali G takes the piss out of it

c) You are routinely given memorandums at work from the local police about not stopping at traffic lights with your windows open.

I'd like to say I made a sensible decision when I left it for Dusseldorf, but I'm not sure that was much better.

Ah well.

i stopped reading after a while... can't believe everyone thinks that aussies are racist and sexist, if anything i find them HUGELY more switched-on about those issues than here, certainly in Sydney where i spent my time.

perhaps it's easier being a jock than english over there, cos i was practically adopted by friends and would move there in a heartbeat if the country needed more useless hacks. wonderful climate, amazing quality of life, easily accessible cultural/intellectual life, tremendous people...

Not bothered about being called a pom! Is that what you were all on about it? THat's just friendly banter in my book!

I tell you what though, it is very exciting to be living in a country whose athletes actually win gold medals in the Olympics - and smash world records to smithereens ...
Australia is 5th in the Medal table ... 5th I tell you!

Am completely caught up in Stephanie Rice Mania ....

To clarify what I said - I don't think I found Aussies any more racist towards people from other countries/cultures than anywhere else APART from attitudes in rural areas towards the Aboriginal people. In some ways I've found it similar to attitudes in the UK towards gypsies/travellers. People who wouldn't dream of saying anything against a black/asian person not being able to say anything good about gypsies sort of thing... and not seeing that that is actually being racist...

well yes, i'd agree with that tbh. but it's also a reason to move from England...

Gettingserious - my dad says that on occasions the water has been unavailable - but he doesn't live right in the city but in the suburbs. Not often at all, but he says it has happened.

Claudiaschiffer - interesting about the unemployment. My dad said that unemployment was high if you weren't in the construction industry, but maybe he was thinking of relative unemployment. After all if you're used to very low unemployment levels a slight rise could seem quite significant.

My comment about finding that the Aussies can be racist was based on our observations there last year - not that all Aussies are racist, that would be a ridiculous statement. But it did seem to me that there was an acceptability for racism esp towards the Aborigines that is probably less tolerable in the UK. But I agree, there is still plenty of racism, sexism and ageism to be found here too unfortunately.

I think if people emigrate with their eyes wide open and are fully aware of what they are moving too then it can be a fantastic experience. However I have met many people who seem to think that moving to Aussie is a good idea because it will be like being on permanent holiay; you get paid tons, you can get a mansion with a pool for peanuts and you spend all day every day lounging by the pool. Obviously life isn't like that!

we don't have an aboriginal community here, though... but if you asked a muslim woman in a hijab whether or not she encountered casual racism here i bet you'd get a yes.

Sidge, I am sorry but I think your Dad's suggestion that water in Perth has at times run out is ludicrous. If that ever happened there would be widespread panic buying of water and it would be a major news item. I have plenty of friends and family in Perth. This simply never happened (try googling it).

Firstly, I have lived in Perth and Sydney for a combined total of 12 years and not once have I turned the tap on and no water has come out. If the flow is slow, it is normally an indication of a clogged U-bend. Easily fixed.

Secondly, it gets hot. Good news, there are swimming pools, aircon and the beach. Problem solved.

As for sexism, racism etc, I was born in London and have lived all over the world and guess what? The percentage of dickwads around the world is exactly the same.

Winter. Cold. As the name suggests. We are in Sydney at the moment and it's been really chilly. 17 degrees during the day and down to a freezing 8 degrees at night. Worse than a scottish winter?

Great news is people that are in Australia and moaning can always pop down to the local flight centre and buy a one way ticket somewhere else and those that aren't even in the country but have "brothers/sisters/fathers etc" that live here and are moaning on their behalf bore me to tears. Get a life.

LOL to ThePlumber
Top post ...

No need to be quite so rude ThePlumber.

I don't see any 'moaning' on my family's behalf, just sharing my opinions based on their feedback and my own opinion from my visit there.

Gettingserious - he told us that there were occasions when he had no water. So either he's lying (I doubt it) or it was a long time ago (he didn't say exactly when it happened, just that it had). He has been there 25 years so it might not have been that recently and may have been up north when he was working there (I don't remember him saying exactly where he was, we had been enjoying some fine Australian Red!)

On the scale of rudeness on this thread, ThePlumber is not rating. I am surprised it has taken until page five for someone to post the logically perfect fit-in-or-fuck-off argument. It is not North Korea; you don't need an exit permit.

Your dad was probably on tank water, Sidge. Mains water never, ever runs dry in major cities. Water restrictions yes, dry taps, no.