DH fired abroad - WWYD?

[decisionsdecisionsagain]

Hello wise people. I've NCed for this, as the details are very outing to anyone who knows me.

Earlier this year, we (me, DH and two small, barely school-aged children) moved to a European country for a great job opportunity for him. He speaks the language, I don't, and I gave up my job to come. (It's relevant that wild horses couldn't force me back into that job. I'm in the process of retraining, but my current earning potential is pretty much zero, regardless of which country we're in.)

8 months in, he was fired (a whole other thread in itself! He isn't totally blameless, but certainly no gross misconduct or anything like that - a combination of naivete on his part, toxic corporate politics, and an utter disregard for the disruption caused to us.) Financially, we are ok (no thanks to them!) but professionally and geographically, we are up shit creek.

Initially, we made the decision that he would search for another job here. The reasons for this are many, but here are some:

• our home is London, and Brexit is looming. It seems to me that the worst case scenario is that he is unemployed in London at Brexit. Theoretically, there are more opportunities here, although it's obviously a terrible time of year for job seeking.
• I actually quite like it here, although I didn't want to come, and so does DH.
• The children are at local schools, and picking up another language. This would disappear pretty much the moment we went home.
• We could get our house in London back from our tenants, but getting the children back into their old school would probably be difficult. This would be very disruptive for them, just 8 months after we made the first disruptive move.
• The children have found settling in quite hard, but they are just starting to make friends and feel more at home.

The thing is, we had always planned to go home eventually, and in 18 months or so, I will need to continue my retraining with hands-on experience, which would probably need to be in the UK. So now I am questioning our decision to stay - part of me thinks, why compound our error by staying here, when the original reason for coming (the job) has now disappeared? But the other part of me thinks, if we hold our nerve, this is a way better place to be than London at the moment.

I know you are not me, and I think I feel very differently in this situation to how many would feel, but I want to canvass some opinions. What do you think you'd do? We certainly did not think this move would be a mistake, but it has turned out to be, and my main fear is making another one. So I want to make sure I've considered all the angles and thought properly about what the best thing for everyone would be.

Thank you for reading, and sorry it's so long! I could talk about this shitty situation all day, as my poor friends know only too well!

I am struggling to understand what you think is happening or will happen in London. Life goes on as normal.

Anyway, I would job hunt in both locations and make decision based on the outcome.

Would he qualify for any financial support where you are? Does he/you need a permit which is dependant on his employment? Tbh it might be time to cut your losses and return, at least when you can get the tenants out of the house. Children will adapt to education systems especially if young.

Hmmm..
You say moving the DCs will be very disruptive after only 8 months. But surely it'll be even more disruptive moving them in 18 months' time when they've well and truly settled in and have proper friends
The flip side of that is that young children are very adaptable and flexible.
What will you do if DH gets another job where you are? Are you happy not working for 18 months?
If DH gets a good job and settles in, will he really want to return to the UK in 18 months so that you can continue your training? What will he do then?
It's hardly a 'shitty' situation. You say you're OK financially. You've got a house in London. You've got options. Stop moaning about it and embrace it. (tough love OP)

On balance I think I would return to the UK.....

"struggling to understand"? It's a time of huge uncertainty - not ideal conditions for hiring.

LIZS He may qualify for financial assistance - he is looking into that at the moment. And he doesn't currently need a permit, although if he remains unemployed after Brexit, it's possible that we could be kicked out (which would conveniently make the decision for us!) Thank you for those thoughts, I appreciate it.

I think your H should apply for jobs both where you are and in the UK and then decide based on where his employment is.

There are still jobs and business goes on. Really the "uncertainty" and unrest is overhyped by media.

Job hunt in both locations, consider any job offers on their merits.

If you weren't set on returning to the UK to finish retraining I'd say try to stay where you are. If your kids are barely school age they'll lise their new language anyway if you return to a monolingual English speaking environment in 18 months time. Children who lose everyday exposure before age 10 pretty much always lose the second language. You'd need to e very proactive on your return to London to keep it, though if your DH has a reasonable work/ life balance and can commit to strict one parent one language speaking the language your children are learning you'd have a fighting chance...

The brain development advantage of bilingualism wont be lost, but the active language ability probably will unless you stay longer.

People who say they are "struggling to understand" or "genuinely dont understand" a poster's dilemma are always being deliberately obtuse...

I think you need to give it a time limit to get yourself sorted in your new country before you call it quits, or look further afield in the new country or others

TwitterQueen wow, that IS tough love! Of course, I don't moan about it at home, because DH feels so gutted and responsible for moving us all and letting us down. So I need to support him and make sure he doesn't crack. Which takes its toll on me, really. So I'm moaning and worrying on here... But, yes, you're right - there are millions of people in much more precarious situations.

I'm happy not working for now - I am studying and volunteering, and the children only have school in the mornings, so I'm ridiculously busy most of the time. If he gets another job here, we can postpone our return if it seems the sensible thing to do - 18 months is not a fixed time for a return, and we had originally planned to be here 3 years.

Your point about disruption for the DCs is a good one. Would it maybe be better to move them now while they're not SO ensconsed? However, everyone says children are SO adaptable. I have found this to be a complete fallacy. My DCs (4 and 5, so very small) have found it very hard, in various ways - they've missed their friends and their own home and have really struggled to settle in at their new settings. I just can't bear to tell them it's all been for nothing, but maybe that's a short-term pain for a long-term gain.

If you are potentially considering staying indefinitely, then I would look at what the options are to stay. There are undoubtedly benefits that you have mentioned.

If your plan is definitely to return to London in the foreseeable future (especially within a short timeframe such as 18 months), I would just return now and get on with it. I don’t see the upside in postponing the inevitable for a year or two if his job has gone.

blueskies true, that

Presumably school is relatively informal. It will be harder to move them in a few years time as their learning will be out of sync. They will not keep the language (even expats whose children stay longer find this unless they actively keep it up). We found the move back easier than the move out, apart from academically.

blueskies it's an interesting point about the language being lost, but not the enhanced cognitive abilities. At least this experience will have had SOME longer term benefits for the DCs!
branleuse we were talking last night about putting a time limit on it - perhaps being back in the UK at the end of the school year, if it doesn't come together. That way, I MAY be able to get the children back into their old school too.

I just feel that I dismantled our old life to make a new one here, and now it's impossible to put it back together. Am I overthinking it? I mean, people do it all the time, right?

I think you are exaggerating the effects of Brexit on London!

What comes across to me OP is that you feel this is a failure. I'd see it more as just not working out for you. I would not keep my children there for another 18 months and then disrupt their lives again just to make it feel more successful.

Yes, LISZ, academics are definitely a consideration. School is incredibly informal here, and the younger one, who should be in reception, is still charging about screaming in kindergarten, which is lovely, but a worry if we are going home. The older one is a very reluctant reader, and has definitely fallen behind her peers at home, despite my best efforts.

Yes you are overthinking it. Are you more worried about what family and friends may make of an early return?

That gap gets larger in the short term.

If you're in Germany, depending on which state you're in, 1 Klasse can be an absolute ground rocking shock after Kindergarten (to parents as much as kids). If you're not planning on staying that might be worth bearing in mind.

I'm a big fan of my children's Kindergarten experience - I had 9 consecutive years with at least one child at Kindergarten - but having now had 8 years of the actual school system I am far more ambivalent about actual school in Germany. Does vary unrecognisably by state though as I understand.

Ignore if elsewhere in Europe, I'm going on the half days :o

Ah sorry, cross post - if you have a 5 year old at "actual" school not Kindergarten you're not in my bit of Germany at any rate!

The thing is, sassitude, that I DON'T see this as a failure. I think it would be much easier if I did, actually. It's been (is being) an amazing experience, and one I would like to continue, IF it's the right decision! It's a lovely place, the air is clean, people are nice, life is orderly, the children have loads more freedom than they did in London, they seem to stay children for longer, there isn't the pressure on them to perform academically - it's very wholesome and fun, and I personally am way happier than I thought I would be. If it wasn't for the job situation, we'd definitely be staying 3 years and probably longer. But now this has happened, which has thrown everything into doubt...

P.S. This is all so helpful in clarifying my thoughts - thank you all very much for taking the time to respond.

I don't know what kind of agreement/settlement your DH has made with his previous employer in terms of references, reason for leaving etc. But I would have thought that finding any new job is the priority to close that gap on his CV asap?

LISZ I'm not worried about family and friends (in fact they wonder why we weren't on the first plane home) but DH is.

blueskies well deduced! We are in Germany, and the half days are such a pain! In this very small part of the state we live in, they start school a year early, so they do the 1 Klasse work in 2 years instead of 1. It's nice, actually - sort of a halfway house, they call it Vorschule. What you say about school further up is really interesting - something we hadn't considered because we were only thinking medium-term, but now I guess we are looking at either pretty short- or quite long-term. Confusing.

reallybadidea oddly enough, they gave him an almost sarcastically glowing reference, so weird. But no, he can freelance if necessary - "any job" is not the first priority.