Which passports should children have?

[allegretto]

Hi. My children were all born in Italy and have dual British / Italian nationality (I think!) DS1 has an Italian passport. The youngest two don't have passports and I don't know which to get! Is it a disadvantage for them to get British only? Do they need to get both? Should I be taking Brexit into account? (People keep telling me I should get the UK ones while I can - but surely that won't change?) I am a UK citizen in the process of applying for dual citizenship and DH is Italian btw. Help!

(Just to add that up until now, the youngest two have always travelled within Europe on their ID cards but obviously they can't do that after Brexit, and even now the border control people are a bit sniffy about accepting them so I want to get a proper passport - but due to the expense, not both if there is no real need).

Mine have three - British (me), DH's nationality (EU), and the country we live in ( I have citizenship and they get it through me).

Never know which country will be next to leave the EU, or how hard it will be for non- residents to get a British passport in the future. I'm giving them as many opportunities as possible

Mine only has her Finnish passport as I never registered her birth with the British Embassy (was too expensive). I haven't used my British passport since I got my Finnish one anyway and don't even have one now. But I guess I need to re-think this all now thanks to Brexit but British passports are just so much more expensive and hassly.

I didn't register my children's births with the embassy either - I don't think it's actually necessary, is it? I think I will get Italian ones as it is quicker and cheaper (and I don't have to pay ridiculous courier charges which they won't combine for me for three passports!)

If you were born in the U.K., your children are already British citizens and will be able to get passports at any stage in the future.

So get whatever suits you for now and deal with the others if the need ever arises.

I would have both, if you can afford it, just because it opens up more options

My kids have dual american/British nationality. When we moved back to the UK the kids only had American passports and we used those for travelling, however coming back into the UK after a holiday we were told they should only be using their British passports or else they would be seen as overstaying! Obviously with free movement this doesn't currently make a difference for you but may do after brexit. Personally I'd get them the passport for the country that they're residing in.

Correct TwoBlueFish, if a person has a nationality which allows them free movement in the EU and that is where they are, to have that freedom of movement, they need to have valid passports for a nationality which grants them that right. USA nationals, unless they have gained EU treaty rights through family membership of EU + long stay, cannot have freedom of movement. If you don't have your EU passports at an EU border control, you're in a pickle.

A parent born in the UK does not necessarily bestow GBR nationality on their children born overseas, it depends entirely on how the UK born parent got their GBR nationality - above remarks not accurate.

Once you're understood nationality is not given by having a passport but by law of a country and that a passport or national identity card or nationality or naturalization or declaration of nationality certificate is a means of confirmation of a nationality, you'll be able to assess the usefulness of having 2 or 3 passports. Usefulness will depend upon the practicalities of where you are travelling to and where you reside, the answer will be different for different families.

DD doesn't have any birth certificate come to think of it so not sure how I can even get her a British passport

Natsku, surely you got something to prove birth from wherever your child was born?

Where I live, the country does not offer birth certificates which look like UK ones. It's a simple line from the national register called and extract of the national register, but it's what is needed to get a GBR passport for any qualifying child born in this country.

I suppose the population data extract must work then

If you can afford it, get both. Even if they're entitled to a British passport if you wait until they are older they must attend interviews which may be a pain if they're overseas. Just don't bother renewing when it lapses - perhaps spread the cost and buy one a year until they all have one

All child British citizen passport cost £46 and are valid for 5 years. It does not matter where you live in the world.

The only difference between countries is the courier fee for delivery.

Whilst British passports are not the cheapest in the EU, they are not the most expensive either.

Passports issued for our other nationality cost 35 euro (about £30) for a child for 5 years validity.

Bear in mind that if you have a British passport and passports of other nationalities, you are now obliged to send up scanned pages of every single page of your other passports when renewing a British passport. If you have another EU nationality, if you choose to have a national EU ID card rather than a national EU passport, an ID card has no pages so you don't have to photocopy the pages! It's the current reason why we don't have passports only ID cards for our other EU nationality and only British passports. The other reason we only have British passports is that there is no advantage to either British or other EU for where we want to travel (basically nowhere as we are skint) so only have one set of passports.

Birth certificates are normal for countries which have no internal border controls, eg UK, Ireland, USA, Canada.

Extracts of population registers are normal for countries with internal border controls, eg France and obviously Finland!

the youngest two have always travelled within Europe on their ID cards but obviously they can't do that after Brexit, and even now the border control people are a bit sniffy about accepting them

I don't understand what you mean by this. I have an ID from my EU country and can travel all over Europe with it, including non-EU countries like Switzerland. The last place I used it was coming into UK and they weren't sniffy about it at all.

That's interesting cannot didn't know that

You only need to attend an interview for a first adult passport which you can get from the age of 16 years old. So long as you apply for a British passport before the age of 16 years old, you should not need to go for an interview as an adult. You therefore only need to buy one child passport at £46 to avoid the interview as an adult, you can buy it at 1 day old or 15 years and 364 days old, so long as it is done within that period once at least.

Allegretto, have you been in internal negotiations between the 28 EU, 3 EEA states and Switzerland, ie the 32 freedom of movement travel area states where national ID cards are an acceptable travel document?

In fact, there is no news regarding post possible hard Brexit whether the UK will continue to allow the other 31 countries to travel to and from the UK without passports and only on national IDs. The decision to continue the use of national ID cards will be one of the last decisions made. If I had to predict, I'd say that the ID cards travel will continue.

There should be no problem with anyone using national ID cards to travel between the current 32 member states of freedom of movement. Any sniffiness would not be because of use of ID cards - unless you're using Greek or Italian ones which are a joke when it comes to security features, or unless you're using cards from countries whose ID cards are targeted by non EU nationals as the best ones to use as lookalikes and pretend to be EU.

In brief, do not assume the use of national ID cards will stop for entry into the UK. Obviously as the UK stupidly abandoned national ID cards by voting in Cameron a few years back, it's one of 2 EU countries now with no ID cards so entry into the EU/EEA/Switzerland will continue as before, with a passport!

Birth certificates are normal for countries which have no internal border controls, eg UK, Ireland, USA, Canada.
Hmmm
I was born in one of those and Birth certificates do not exist.
You are allocated your Social Security Number at birth and that is that.

Birth certificates exist in UK, Ireland, USA and Canada.

Cannot
I have passports for two of those countries and one of them most definitely does not issue birth certificates - as I've never seen mine and both my parents confirm it was not issued.

Allegretto
Get Italian ones, as they rather handily have parents' names indicated on them so you don't get the 3rd degree when you go through border control in the UK or elsewhere. I assume being married to an Italian you have different surname to your DC? In that case the parents' names thing is priceless and saves a whole lot of grief.
You also need it for exiting Italy with your DC as only parents or official guardians can accompany Italian children outside the country up to the age of 14. If you want to send them away with someone else you'll need to fill in a form and get it stamped by the police (a total palaver if you live in a big city). Actually that's probably the only time having a British passport might be handy, although you're theoretically supposed to exit the country with the docs if that country if a citizen.

Ha Allegretto, of course, you said you're Italians, no wonder you get sniffiness when using ID cards. The design dates from WW2 I believe. There are something like 45000 issuing offices too (sorry probably gross exaggeration) but just to illustrate how hard it is to be consistent with a simple piece of paper as an identity card.

The new Italian ID cards are coming slowly, certain non EU nationalities will then have to look elsewhere to pretend to be EU to emigrate illegally.

Talkinpeece, the fact you have no birth certificate for your country does not prove your country does not issue birth certificates. A quick google might satisfy your curiosity. I've seen 1000s of them from all those countries. They do exist.