Schenk ein den Wein - as autumn comes to Germany and Austria

[LinzerTorte]

Der Nebel steigt, es fällt das Laub;
schenk ein den Wein, den holden!
Wir wollen uns den grauen Tag
vergolden, ja vergolden!

A thread for all those living in Germany and Austria, and anyone else who would like to chat.

Always good to have an excuse to open some , and this poem seemed quite appropriate!

Oh jenny - happy birthday but sorry it was so quiet. Hope you all feel better soon.

Just need to have a moan already about my MIL - rooooooaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrr!!!! She is driving me nuts! If it was up to me, I'd leave for Munich now but dh is still in bed.
She is in full critical mode which I have learned to let wash over me but this morning she had stepped it up to a new level for her.
"shocking and unhealthy in the winter that ds1 was drinking orange juice. No-one drinks cold drinks in the winter!" huh?????

"disgraceful that ds1 can organise his own breakfast. Why did I not do everything for him" huh?

"Why do" you let the dc get dressed before breakfast??" because thats how we do it!!!!!!

This all seems like nothing now I've typed it but this was all before 6.45 this morn on top of an evening of it yesterday.

And breathe ........

Oh no Canella, that would drive me round the bend too. At least you shouldn't have to put up with it for too much longer (and go and get your DH up now if he's still in bed!), but I know how you feel - my MIL drives me mad after just a few hours, although she does mean well and never criticises.

I do hope you're not giving your DC drinks straight from the fridge though; just think of their poor delicate stomachs. They'll probably catch a cold too. And when they inevitably catch the cold caused by all those cold drinks, please remember not to give them ice cream. Ice cream is cold so must not be given to children with colds.

Belated happy birthday Jenny, but sorry to hear that you weren't able to appreciate the brunch and birthday cake - hope you're feeling better today.

My weekend was mainly taken up with work (am ignoring the formatting issues for now and hoping that the agency will be able to get hold of the original Word document), but we did have a nice meal out on Sunday - my belated birthday meal postponed from last weekend. We went to the same Greek restaurant as the one I went to with a couple of friends on Friday, but there was considerably less alcohol involved. DH was rather concerned that at least two of the waiters remembered me and he asked what I'd been up to.

Enjoy Munich, Canella! I'd love to go - never quite got around to it - the friend I had living there emigrated to Australia this year!
It would drive me mad if my in-laws did that with the cleaning. Even if they are just trying to help I imagine it still feels like a comment on your house.
Oh I've just read your update - how rude of her! What's this no cold drinks in winter nonsense?! Surely orange juice is great in winter because of the vitamin content?
Aren't some Germans and Austrians sometimes funny with their obsession with cold. I can't get their head around it.

Admylin Have a lovely time on holiday! (I realise you're probably on your way by now.) I'm v. jealous of the temperature, although I've started getting excited about all the lovely winter food like stews and casseroles (which I will neither have time to cook nor eat :) )

Linzer How did the formatting go? Did the coffee help? What did you do with your DD when she had her cot issues? Did you just let her sleep on you?
Am laughing out loud at the drinks straight from the fridge and the ice cream business.

5more Thanks for the tip about the bed for daytime naps - I'll try it today. At the moment I stretch out on the sofa, propped up with a load of cushions and he naps on my chest. I managed to get him in his cot for a whole 20 mins in the night, but he was wide awake and gurgling away (very cute!) yet as soon as he was on me again he was out like a light.

Aww Jenny - so sorry you were ill on your birthday. I hope you feel better soon and that the brunch lifted your spirits a little.

Canella argh yours sounds worse than mine now you've updated! I have never heard the no cold drinks in winter one! Not even water???

Admylin hope you are having a nice holiday

Linzer hope the work is all done and you can have a few hours while the kids are at school, work free?

Later I used to sit up all night with my dd too, 6 years ago (wow that's a long time) - I used to read novel after novel to keep myself awake (could never remember a thing I'd read) until I thought she was deeply enough a sleep to put down, and then when I did put her down 9 times out of 10 she pinged awake... I don't know whether I never realised orjust never really believed I could lie down with her and snooze even if not sleep deeply - it is actually more dangerous if you fall asleep holding baby on the sofa because you are beyond exhausted, and safer to lie on top of the duvet with no pillows etc. near baby, and allow him to feed and snuggle. I have been lucky with the boys sleep by comparison, but H was unsettled between me going to bed and about 3am last night, but I just brought him into bed with me and let him feed and snuggle - it's not as good quality sleep as when baby is sound asleep in his cot, but it is enough to function. I got him back in his cot at 3am. He is not normally like that but I assume there is a reason - teeth finally on the way perhaps, or a cold starting, or about to start proper crawling maybe, as new development steps seem to affect sleep... He's happy atm belly squirming around the tiled floor after a HappyLand car...

My car is in the workshop again, just peeling paint being fixed under warranty, but the problems we've had with it cause inconvenience and tarnish the experience of buying a car new for the first time!

It's 2 degrees here this morning and very foggy - glad we finally got the winter boots and coats/ snowsuits in time, though ds1 is resistant to wearing a big bulky coat, as he was last winter - he likes the coat in theory but argues every time it comes to putting it on! H looks very cute packed up in his little all in one snowsuit :)

hmmm smelly nappy calls I think ...

Hello everyone,

Sorry for the radio-silence. Hope everyone is ok - As DH had to go to Hannover for the week, I de-camped to the ILs in Carinthia and just back last night. Had a good time - its so beautiful there, all mountains and slower paced rural life. Did lots of walking to take in the views and try to shift these extra kilos I'm carrying around! All the hearty food probably didn't help though - hmmm kase nudl...

Happy bday Jenny - I hope the bug hasn't developed and you're feeling better.

How's the feeding going, Later? hope you're managing to get some sleep!

Admylin have a great holiday!

Linzer, Canella - I'm going to have to join into the MIL vent - although I had a good week, I almost came to blows with my MIL. Apparently I am not feeding DS enough (although he is gaining loads of weight and is healthy) and every movement or squeak he makes means he is hungry - apparently. Oh, and he's cold. We went for a walk and she got him ready with so many clothes on he was sweating! It wasn't that cold either. So almost an argument which would have been interesting seeing as she doesn't speak English and my German isn't great - DH arrived from Hannover on Friday and wondered what on earth was going on! I'm going to try like you and let it wash over me as my SIL said she was the same when her kids were young. Just not what I'm used to - my mother is totally the opposite!

Right - little one is calling - have a great rest of day, all

Oh, that all sounds very familiar coco. I couldn't hand over any of my DC to my MIL when they were babies without her announcing after a max. of five minutes "Er/Sie sucht!", i.e. is wanting a feed. This was even if I'd only just fed them, and she just seemed to ignore me if I tried to tell her that the last feed was only half an hour ago.

The cold thing really gets to me as well; Austrians seem petrified of their children going out into the fresh air if it's below 20° unless they're bundled up in several dozen layers, yet think nothing of letting the same poor DC get hot and sweaty indoors in their warm clothes while they're waiting to go out or at the supermarket etc. Do not, under any circumstances, allow Austrians to see a bare bit of leg between socks and trousers (if your DC is in a pushchair, for example), unless you want them to have a heart attack.

Later I basically used to do the same as 5more did, i.e. sat up with DD1 all night. I did try lying down with her in bed sometimes, but neither of us got much rest/sleep that way either - at least if I put her in her bassinet (and by some miracle she stayed asleep), I would get an hour or so of decent sleep. My average night (I can still remember it, 10 years later!) was one block of two hours' sleep and two blocks of one hour. I remember managing to sleep for five whole hours one evening while DH looked after her (I think he must have given her a bottle); I felt so refreshed that I was virtually ready to start the day at 1 am!

Luckily the other two were much better sleepers and, although they obviously woke up for feeds several times a night, would go back to sleep straight afterwards. Another big difference is that they would only feed for 5-10 minutes compared with up to an hour for DD1, which gave me a lot more time to sleep too.

I'm still ignoring the formatting issues at the moment and just concentrating on the transation in the hope that the client will manage to track down the original Word document. Must e-mail the agency about it, as it's going to be a bit of a nightmare if they don't.

5more It was 0° here this morning, but has warmed up quite a bit here now that the sun has come out. The neighbours' DC have all got their thick winter coats on but I'm refusing to get ours out yet on the grounds that we won't "feel the benefit" when winter arrives properly. I think I'm turning into my mother.

Sadly I won't be able to enjoy any work-free time until November at the earliest, as the job I'm working on at the moment is going to keep me busy until the end of the month. I can't complain really though, as work has generally been very quiet this year and it would take me about six months of teaching English to earn the same amount as I'll get from these 2-3 weeks.

Ha ha Linzer - the bare leg between trousers and socks was what triggered the near argument! 'Keine Strumpfe?!' (sic - excuse the crap German from me) was the cry that went up. I tried to explain that I hadn't thought of tights - not something you'd put a boy in in England, but good idea for the cold, but it didn't go down that well...!

But boys must wear tights until they are at least, ooh, 16 coco. Otherwise that bare bit of leg might get in a draught and he will catch a chill in his leg. You can verkühl any part of your body, you know. My MIL went out in a thin blouse once and caught mastitis.

DS only really wears tights if he's going skiing, but I have already been stopped by total strangers shocked at the gap. People will helpfully do up the DC's zips and DD2 is frequently sent home from her best friend's wearing extra clothes as I have obviously not dressed her warmly enough, Rabenmutter that I am. A friend of mine recently mentioned how shocked she had been to see a bit of DS's bare leg last winter - a whole year later, she still remembered it! She was obviously traumatised, poor misguided soul.

Oh glad its not just me having the MIL probs! We have escaped to Munich.

But my SIL is very definitely german - her 5 week old baby has been inside all day but still has a vest, t-shirt, trousers and soft dungarees over the top. And of course thick socks! No bare legs to be seen here of course. No wonder she was sleepy! I'd be sleepy if I was that warm. And the flat is so heated i've had to take my socks off and have been sweating! Crazy german ways.

(moan over - will try to moan less tomorrow)

I feel very un-British now as my DC are all in winter coats - the older 2 have 2 part snow suits and are wearing the coats, not the trouser part, and baby is wearing snow suit (well not literally now, but outdoors). We do spend a lot of time outdoors though - dd is only 6 and walks to the bus stop at 7am, when it is really close to freezing, and Ds1 (4) spends literally the whole afternoon after KiGa in the playground and our garden with his mates, DD is out a lot of the afternoon too, though she and her friends pop in and out of the house... Baby Ds does wear tights :) He wears a short sleeved vest and tights most of the day and snow suit goes on top of that to go out, it is mighty handy doing that rahter than faffing with trousers and socks (which he takes off constantly) and faffing with fleeces and light coats as layers... The tights are good for his tiled floor belly squirming antics too, as we don't have under floor heating, and don't have the heating on at all yet (we do have the wood burner lit once DH gets in though now).

Oooh I feel all defensive about wrapping my kids up lol! Ds doesn't have the removable fleece inside his new coat atm in my defence lol! I am rubbish at wrapping myself up and don't wear house shoes (I like having bare feet)and am always dashing out of the house without a coat, partly because it is impossible to put one on with a baby in your arms lol but mainly because I am rushing out to sort a kid related issue or see dd across the road before she misses the bus... and dh tuts at me and MIL tells me I will get ill, but it appears that on the surface my kids are usually suitably "gut verpackt" - I even got a compliment worded that way about baby ds when I went to buy dd's Ethik heft this morning lol ...

DS1 had bronchitis as a baby and was very wheezy in autumn and winter right until this year, maybe that is why I have come over all German on the winter clothing!

You've been here too long, 5more. No, actually what you said sounds very sensible. I just get annoyed by a) people (often complete strangers) telling me, or at least insinuating, that my DC aren't warmly dressed enough, and b) the belief that if you're not warmly dressed enough, you'll catch a cold/flu/pneumonia. I usually bite my tongue, however, as apparently the fact that the DC are rarely ill doesn't prove anything since they're abgehärtet (but surely they should at least have been ill a lot as babies?).

Must admit, however, that I can't wait to be able to turn the heating on. I was sitting upstairs (the coldest part of the house atm, but it's where my computer is) all morning freezing and have had to have a bath the last three or four evenings just to warm myself up. It's quite amazing that I don't yet have a cold. Oh well, only two more days until we get our boiler checked and thermostat replaced, and then the heating should be working again (by which time it will no doubt have warmed up).

LOL at all this dress stress!

I'm staying with my parents this week (flew over yesterday with DD, leaving DH at home to do a lot of work) and DD has a fresh bout of the runny nose and cough that seems to be permanent since starting kiga. She hasn't seemed bothered by the cold really, but had some discharge from her eyes this evening, which has had me got me paranoid that I am somehow to blame.

I can't help thinking that she might be doch more susceptible to getting ill at low temperatures simply for having been partially treated like a German child and therefore packing her coat in my suitcase yesterday, taking her to the park without a hat yesterday, giving her ice cream for tea, taking her to the park without a winter coat today (it wasn't that cold, but very windy - she was, however, the only child in the whole park wearing a hat!) has contributed to her getting an eye infection .

I'm sure I read somewhere that Scottish people get fewer colds, simply because they tend to maintain a lower temperature in their houses than Brits living further south. Maybe Canella knows if that's true!

Beaming good holiday vibes to admylin, who I've obviously missed.

I've heard that too silken - well, not about Scottish people getting fewer colds but that overheating your home can make you more susceptible to colds. Apparently it dries out your nasal passages, which means that it's more likely you'll catch any viruses that are around.

I read on another thread that Tesco are now doing international delivery for non-food products (although it turned out to be just for clothes), so I'll have to have a browse when I have a bit more time. DD2 loves Peppa Pig so I might get a few bits and pieces for her before she's too big for the range - and the clothes are generally quite a bit cheaper than anything I can buy here. I'm a bit about why postage to Austria should be £2 more expensive than to Germany, though.

This evening I taught my evening class for the third time since baby H was born, leaving baby (and the older dc of course) with dh - I could hear baby H full on screaming as soon as I opened the car door (at 9.20pm), and dh said he had screamed since 7.45 - he screamed for a solid hour the first 2 eves too and seems to be getting worse by the week! I feed him just before I leave, but he starts screaming an hour or so after I go and doesn't stop til I get in -he stops the moment I take him when I get in and is now asleep on my lap... :(

Not sure why I'm sharing this, it's just so not worth it but I'm committed to 7 more lessons... :(

That must be very difficult 5more, but babies can change a lot in seven weeks (I'm assuming you teach once a week) so hopefully it will get easier. And at least you're keeping your hand in with the teaching.

DH went to DD2's first communion parents' evening last night, but left when everyone got into groups to decide about the Tischmütter "before anyone got any ideas"! Actually, a friend of mine had already had a few - she thought that DH could be a Tischvater as she'd never heard of one before (I told her that DD1 had one) and that it would be interesting for the children if I talked to them about the differences between Anglicans and Catholics. I said no on both counts. I feel that my English teaching at school lets me off any other kind of volunteering!

Only another few hours until we have our boiler checked and thermostat replaced, and then I'll finally be able to turn the heating on (although typically, it seems slightly warmer this morning).

For those of you not on my FB, this made me laugh.

Linzer It took me a good minute of looking a that map to figure out what it was
Did you get your heating sorted? I've had the heating on for a good week or two now - after a certain point an extra jumper just isn't enough.

5more What do you think you will do about the classes - coming back to hear your baby has been screaming for you non-stop sounds heartbreaking.
Thanks for the tip about daytime naps on the bed - it has turned into a lifesaver! I can feed him lying down, then when he drops off I can have a snooze too, and there's no transferring him to his cot and the movement & temperature change waking him. He still ends up on me for half of the night, but he feeds every 2-3 hours for about an hour at a time (like Linzer's DD) so we don't spend too much time asleep anyway. He's snoozing peacefully on me now :)

Silken Enjoy your time at your parents'. Hope your DD feels better soon.

Coco Glad you had a nice time in the mountains - hope the MIL issue didn't get too heated!

Canella How was Munich? All this talk of clothing is making me a little worried! Little one seems warm enough though so I shall leave him be for now. I think DH spent too long in th UK as he doesn't seem to have the tights obsession!

Best dash, the hunger alarm is going off at full volume :)

Ha ha - I love the London tube translation Linzer - funny to see where I used to live be translated. Definitely one to send to my BIL who struggles when he's visited us in London before!

Hope you got your heating sorted too. We woke up this morning to no hot water - well I heard the scream from the shower when DH was trying to use it and got Kniepped instead! They've started building directly opposite our flat which I'm annoyed about as its ruined the view from our balcony and I'm just glad its cold so I don't want the windows open - but I think their drilling may have affected our heating/water . Will make me get out of the house more I guess.

Hope you're getting some more day-time snoozes in Later - my DS is having a little nap on the bed at the moment (so I can have 10mins on MN!)

Hope your little one settles ok for your next evening course 5more - must be tough.

Joined an English speaking mother/baby group here yesterday (I know - not great for improving my German, but I needed some talk time in English!). Nice group of all different nationalities in Vienna for various reasons - mostly like me, following a DH's job. All with babies similar age - really interesting to see how other people do things with their babies! Have to say their babies were a lot more wrapped up than DH (and I even had put him in his Strumpfe!) so getting paranoid now. Unpacked the fleecy arctic sleeping bag that goes in his buggy for today's outing!!

Love the mistake coco - you didnt put DH in strumpfe did you???
Altho its not helping your German going to the English club, it'll definitely help your morale. Its def good to get out!

Linzer - did you get your heating sorted?

Later - enjoy those cuddles! They grow up too fast. But no advice about how to get him to sleep off you - dc3 was the same in the night. But it gets better.

We had a fab time in Munich - was just great to have time as husband and wife - we very rarely get that time. Even the car journey was fun - we were laughing at how uncool we were singing along to Kylie. And we had time to mooch about Munich as well - felt we were there longer than 24 hours. My niece was very cute but unsettled a lot so helped to keep me unbroody! The only trouble was my SIL was really uncomfortable about BF in front of anyone so kept going away in another room to do it. When I came down in the morning she was in the middle of feeding and cause there, she quickly unlatched the baby and covered up. Cue 1 crying baby wondering what had happened. I tried to say it was fine with us (obviously) but I felt uncomfortable that she felt uncomfortable.

The heating is finally sorted, thank goodness. We have a new all-singing, all-dancing thermostat (I particularly like the button with on it - unfortunately, it doesn't actually give you any...), so I'm no longer spending all day shivering.

It was DS's Schuleinschreibung today, which was a lot of hassle for two or three minutes with the Direktorin. Tracked down the dozens of documents required (everything from his Staatsbürgerschaftsnachweis to a Nachweis des Religionsbekenntnisses) and drove to the Containerschule on the other side of the town, which I couldn't find despite using my sat nav (the house number didn't exist). Had to phone DH in the end as I was too embarrassed to approach a big group of Gymnasium students; luckily he has a far better sense of direction than I do. Queued up, asked the headteacher if we could apply for a Sprengelversetzung, filled in said form while she and her secretary inspected our dozens of documents, and that was about it. She seemed fairly positive about DS getting a place at DD2's school, although I didn't like the way she said at the end that we would get an invitation to the school open day from the headteacher next spring "oder auch nicht". Hopefully she was just covering her back.

Glad you had a good time in Munich, Canella. It must have been great to have a break together away from the DC - I've almost forgotten what it's like to spend time with DH on our own (apart from in the evenings when the DC in bed, but that doesn't count as we're too tired to talk to each other!).

coco The mother and baby group sounds great - it's always good to meet people in the same boat. I find that talking to other adults in English helps keep me sane; I probably need to do more of it, though! Love the thought of your DH in his Strümpfe; I know boys here wear them for years longer than they would in the UK, but I think your DH wins the record.

Later Glad to hear you're getting more rest in the daytime now. I used to really enjoy the hour-long feeds (once I was slightly less sleep-deprived!) as it gave me so much time to read - I missed them with DD2 and DS, although they're obv. not quite as practical when you also have older children to look after.

Have just finished work for the day, so off to bed now. The formatting problems are more or less solved as the agency finally sent me the original document, although I had to sign up to Skype so that they could send it to me. I'd always thought it was just for phone calls. Man lernt nie aus.

Wohne leider nicht in Deutschland. Bin doch Deutschlehrerin, geht das?

Our somewhat bonkers neighbour here in North East England comes from a large city in Northern Germany and was very surprised to receive the standard "nits in the school, check your kid isn't infested" letter from our local primary today. Most of the other parents just said, "Oh God, not again," but she was adamant that this does not happen in Germany, that she has never heard of a German child having lice, that no one she has ever known in her country has had lice, that lice have not been a problem in Germany since WW2 and that you just can't buy nit shampoo or combs there. Are German kids dunked in nit shampoo at birth, so strong that they never get them or are English kids just filthy?! Or is she just, as I suspect, eine totale verrueckte Frau?!

Hi DrSeuss, all welcome here.

I don't know about Germany, but here in Austria we do get letters about nits (just a general letter telling you what to do if your child gets them; have never had one informing parents of an outbreak) but nits don't seem to be as common here. This may be because the schools and kindergartens have a strict policy that any child with them has to stay at home until he/she has been declared nit-free by a doctor, and you have to take the certificate into school. I've heard of the occasional child having nits but we don't seem to get outbreaks and my three (5, 7 and 9) have never had them. I've never seen nit shampoo here but I'm sure you can get it - it's probably one of those things you have to ask for at the chemist's.

I am moving to Baden Linzer - Vienna is full of nits! We have got about four warnings that someone in the class or kindergarten group has them, to check our children etc. But you are right that they are stricter about letting children back into school...have to go to some disinfection centre to get a certificate the child is nit free :-)

Dr Seuss- your neighbour must have grown up with my DH! He says there were never lice in his school, never had them, never heard of them among his friends etc. When I ask him to check me for nits he claims he does not even know what they look like....tbh I was not born with that knowledge embedded in my genes - I googled it, or rather I think I askedjeeved it because it was pre google when my dc got nits.

coco- that group sounds great for you. You'll have plenty of chances to improve your german!

Must go, dc3 is shouting from the toilet- at 4 yrs 3 months he should really be wiping his own bottom, oder?

have a good weekend all!

DH in his Strumpfe !! Ha ha! I'm going to have to tell him about this later when he gets home! Spot the tired new mum here! And yes, I think at 37 that must be a record for an Austrian boy in tights....You'll all be pleased that it was actually DS that I put in his Strumpfe...!

Glad you had a good break Canella - and nothing wrong with singing along to Kylie. When I drove down to the ILs last week I was singing along to the radio non stop. Had to keep changing stations as there seemed to be a lot of dodgy soft rock going on.

Talk of these breaks, we're planning our holidays this weekend - DH's job here insists that they take all their holiday entitlement which is fantastic - our jobs back in England were for a US firm where taking holiday was frowned on. So, planning xmas and a few nice breaks for us. Hurrah.

Glad I'm not at the nit stage yet DrSeuss- DS hardly has any hair yet. I have loads of hair so it brings back nasty memories from when I was little and the dreaded nit comb.

Heating and hot water back on which is a relief so I can keep DS cosy today. Linzer - what does the drink symbol mean on your thermostat??! That's a new one for me.

Happy Friday, all

No nits allowed out in the suburbs, platanos! I'm hoping that the likelihood of the DC getting them is decreasing as they get older, as the thought of keeping them off school and having them under my feet when they're not ill doesn't exactly fill me with joy.

Do you listen to Ö3, coco? My heart sinks when I hear that gravelly voice announcing a "Rock-Klassiker". And don't get me started on those singers who they get to say, "This is [name of famous-ish sleb] and you're listening to Ö3" - the mangled pronunciation! Occasionally there's one who has obviously decided to rebel and just says "oh three".

Good news on the holiday btw. Make sure you make the most of it before your DS starts school (a while to go yet, I know!), esp. if you want to go away for Christmas as the school holidays generally don't start until 24th December.

The drinks symbol means party mode, i.e. you can programme the heating to stay on for a few hours longer in the evening even when it's in automatic mode. We also have holiday mode and "day off" (in English) mode, when you can have weekend programming (heating comes on and goes off later) during the week. It's all too high-tech for me - I just used to switch the heating on when I needed it before, but it's on automatic atm as it's just easier! (DH has reprogrammed it, though.) I also thought it was quite funny that the engineer explained the "Off" switch to me ("und damit schaltet man aus" - does having everything in English make it look more upmarket, I wonder?).

Must ask DH whether he ever had/heard of nits when he was a child. No doubt my MIL has some theory about it. It probably involves not verkühling your head.