Trustee has cleared account

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Hi I was wondering if anyone could help, my ex husband and I are joint trustees on a Halifax save4it account set up for our daughter when she was born in 2008. The account had nearly £10,000 in it. Yesterday by chance we learned that over the space of a year her father has transferred nearly all of the money to himself. Would this be considered fraud? He has not been spending the money on our daughter.

My account wasn’t opened when I was seven, no idea where you got that from either. It was opened in 1999 when I was four.

How exactly is it a police matter???

even OP has admitted in her replies it was a savings account which BOTH parents had access to, together or separately.

yes, he’s taken money without telling the daughter or other parent, which id constitute as theft however the police will not as legally he- and OP- are able to put in and withdraw money as they see fit until daughter turned sixteen.

if OP wanted a non accessible account she should’ve chose an ISA

i do not blam op for this as her husband is obviously a complete dickhead

OP it’s possible this man still has the money and only removed it so you wouldn’t have access to it. I would implore your daughter to go to her father and ask about it if she is still in contact with him. She may make him feel enough shame that he agrees to hand it back.

Hi all. Firstly can I thank each and every one of you for taking the time to help. I have read every single post (twice in fact). I am truly grateful to you all.

Communications with Halifax
• 2/7 Phoned fraud. After going through security the rep said he couldn't see the account and to go into branch to raise a 'cash over the counter' case.
• 2/7 Went to branch, rep said 'it's 20 minute until closing', then to phone police, then to phone fraud. I said I had been sent by fraud to raise the 'cash over the counter case'. She reluctantly phoned fraud, eventually saying there has been no fraud.
3/7 Phoned fraud again. This time they said to go into branch and raise a 'joint party dispute'.
4/7 Went to branch. Rep said she has no way of raising a 'joint party dispute' that fraud have to do it. I took a list of questions which I had taken from this thread to which I noted the answers. She looked at the attached 'New Account Form' to answer all of the below, I have no idea whether she is correct or not.

• Is it a trust account? - yes
• Is it a bare trust? - no
• Was it due to revert to her at 16? - no
• How was he able to change the address? - 1 person is allowed to change
• Did they require passbook for withdrawals? - no
• Should withdrawals be made in person - no
• How was he able to transfer the money? - all methods permitted
• Re FCA Vulnerable customer guidance, why did they not challenge the unusual pattern of withdrawals by a single signatory that substantially depleted the account? - Account holders are permitted to withdraw money so it would not have been flagged (paraphrasing)
• Can I see the signed copy of the new account form - no

She gave me a new fraud number to call, said to get a reference number from them and to give that to the police.

To answer some of the questions that have been asked
• It looks like he changed the address on the account to a flat where he was living, around 6 years ago when we separated. Daughter has always resided with me.
• Other than a few birthday/xmas cheques, my mother and I paid in all the money.
• There were no withdrawals and only transactions paying into the account for 14 years.
• There were 60 transfers from £10 - £1500 made to his own account in the space of the last 17 months
• On the day this was discovered, he knew she was going to the bank, they had a brief call where he said he'd had to 'borrow some money'. Daughter then discovered in the bank what he had done and has not spoken to him since, he is repeatedly calling but she is ignoring his calls.
• Daughter turned 16 last October.

I'd make a complaint to the bank for their unclear process and delays. FCA if their complaints process doesn't get you anywhere.

Wow that’s awful what he’s done. If I was your daughter I’d be answering a call and asking for it back.

while he’s been an a-hole after reading all that I’m not sure he’s done anything illegal that the police would be interested in though

Nothing helpful to add but I actually feel more for your dd knowing what her own father did to her than the loss of the money. Mind blowing.

Have you tried formal letter to your ex advising that the money was saved with the intention that this was for your child at 16 and if he doesn’t return it you are seeking legal advice? Obviously he might ignore you but it might prompt him to return it.

It's a breach of a Trustees fidiciary duty. Your ex needs to account for the money, so start with sending a formal letter to him asking him to account for the monies. If there is no response send a letter before action giving him 14 days to replace it. If he doesn't, issue proceedings using the small claims track. You don't need a solicitor to do this.

If you get stuck post on here quoting @princessofwells and I can help you further.

Look up Katherine Hill and Gerald Hill a very similar case - found guilty of Fraud by abuse of power. A very recent case, ordered to pay back £50,000 to her daughter.

I would go to the police and be forthright and insist they investigate and prosecute.

You cannot insist the police prosecute.

because the police do not prosecute cases.

they will investigate, and present the case to the CPS.

it is entirely the CPS decision as to whether the suspect will face prosecution, and generally they won’t unless guaranteed a conviction.

I found the details of the account
<a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20081016051616/www.halifax.co.uk/savings/ImportantInfo/ImpInfo_Save4it.asp" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Save4it - Important Information

Unfortunately OP i dont think theres much you can do.
As a trustee on the account he was allowed to withdraw money. There's nothing that says what it has to be used for as it's not a "trust" per se, just a bank account for savings. So the bank wont do anything here, he's had the right to withdraw it and he did so.
So he's basically taken the money. I suggest your daughter guilt trips him into paying her back. That's probsbly about the best you can do

Well, either the money belonged solely to your DD, in which case it's theft.

Alternatively, if the two account holders were allowed to access the funds then it should have been considered an asset of the marriage (so he should not have been entitled to all of it).

I'd check whether your home insurance includes legal cover to get some advice.

Have a look at this - it says that the maximum amount allowed in the account is £5000 so surely the Halifax should have closed the account when it reached that and they should be liable for anything over £5k in the account?

The full terms and conditions stated that the limit did not apply to funds transferred from a Halifax Children's Regular Saver account or if the account was transferred from a former Bank of Scotland account that had more than £5,000 in it.

This is wrong. If a bank account is held in trust, there is indeed a trust. The adults are the trustees, the child is the beneficiary. The money in the account must be used for the child's benefit.

It's not held in an actual trust, the OP confirmed this. I had the exact same account for my DS and you are called a trustee but you basically have the right to operate the account.
The money should be used for the benefit of the child of course but in reality it's almost impossible to prove or monitor. And so OP will have no levers here with the bank. The ex had legitimate access and the bank had no way or obligation to know what the funds were to be used for.

So all OP can do is try to petition ex to get money paid back.

Thank you for this info, I can confirm no funds were transferred from a Halifax Children's Regular Saver account or transferred from a former Bank of Scotland account.

OP has said it is a children's savings account, not a trust fund. However, she may be confused, as are some posters on here (and possibly also the bank staff who answered OP's questions). Most children's savings accounts are held in trust, which is why the adults who operate the account are referred to as trustees. A trustee does indeed have the right to operate the account, but they most do so for the benefit of the child. This means that any money they withdraw must be used for the child's benefit.

You are correct that no-one has a claim against the bank. They have done nothing wrong. However, if OP's ex has borrowed the money or spent it on himself, as seems likely, OP's daughter has a claim against him for return of her money. Given her age, OP will have to take legal action on her daughter's behalf.

As there is nearly £10k involved, OP should see a solicitor rather than taking advice on an internet forum.

In which case they should not have allowed the balance to go over £5k.

It is a trust. The money was placed into the account for her daughter. That constitutes a trust.

People are confusing "trust accounts" with the legal concept of a trust. Start with requesting he repay it within 21 days. If he doesn't, then please seek legal advice - as co-trustee you have to get this money back from him for your daughter.

Not legally. Not if it’s placed in a children’s savings account, in trust, which is what the poster did. Unfortunately doing it her way means you can appoint people to be allowed to to withdraw and have access. Those people being her and her daughters father.

OP, your save4it account would come under children’s regular now, so the regular saver rules apply.