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Original poster

Taken to court by ex landlord for decoration etc of property after 10 yr tenancy

261 replies

AgnesR · 01/12/2023 15:07

Hi
Would love any advice or support or pointers towards help
I am so upset because my ex landlord is taking me to court for £7500 for a load of repairs, new carpets, worktops etc, plus loss of rental income after my 10 year tenancy.(Rent was £750!)
I always paid on time, asked very little of them
All the carpets were old and thin when I moved in
There was of course wear and tear after a family lived somewhere for 10 years
but it was totally clean, totally emptied (of course), and we did lots of painting over scuffs. Several people helped and I honestly thought we left it in a (more than) fair state for them to do the necessary work after a 10 year tenancy (to good, polite tenants!)
I am already under so much stress with severely disabled child, my own health issues, finances etc and this is the last straw!
Thank you

OP posts:
2jacqi · 01/12/2023 21:18

@AgnesR I will tell you that my husband does evictions for councils and private landlords. He had to do an eviction at 11 am one day and client was not quite ready so hubby said we will come back at 1pm and change the locks then if you are ready. hubby then phoned landlord and landlord said that is not good enough because he had a new tenant booked to move in at 12.30pm!!! landlord was not even going to clean the flat or repaint for new tenant!!! I was disgusted! he was obviously a bad landlord. We always get cleaners in to clean our flats and our tenants are never billed for it.

Ohthatsfabulousdarling · 01/12/2023 21:26

AgnesR · 01/12/2023 20:43

I will look into claiming deposit back too minus their new alarm battery etc!

No, including the alarm battery.
It was put in your contract, doesn't mean its a legal request that they have made.

As your landlord they need to legally provide you with a working fire detector, and they cannot bill you for it.

SkySecret · 01/12/2023 21:29

No, no, no! Don’t just give up on your deposit!! They will absolutely side with a genuine tenant who is being screwed over by a landlord - I’ve been through the process. They’re very good, very supportive, and they adjudicate for free on this. DON’T let them keep your deposit without good reason!

And don’t panic. Contact TDS if you haven’t already and have a chat with them. Pull together as much evidence as you can - was there an inventory taken with photos at the start of the tenancy ti price before and after condition? And to show LL had never updated the property in 10 years?

Honestly, if what you’re saying is true, he just doesn’t have a leg to stand on and you should be getting most (if not all) of your deposit back.

Original poster
AgnesR · 01/12/2023 21:49

@WilmaWonka thank you so much. Your understanding and good advice made me cry, in a good way!

They have charged for repairs, for things they have replaced in any case as they were knackered and shabby, before hiking the rent for next tenant.

Charging for ‘loss of rental income’ when they needed to do it anyway… piss take! 🙄

Will fight back. Thank you!!

OP posts:
Winter2020 · 01/12/2023 21:50

Hi OP,
Just another message of support.
I don’t think you should have to pay for representation in court - I think you can represent yourself.

Fill in the forms/seek advice and if you are able to counter sue for 1) taking your deposit without just cause and 2) refusing an assistance dog (which I presume and from taking a quick google appears to be protected under the disability legislation).

I believe you have to demonstrate financial losses so I’m thinking help/support/transport/care that you had to pay for that would have been avoided if the assistance dog was in place maybe?

Good luck
Your landlord is greedy and shouldn’t get away with it. I would love to hear that you are awarded money and that taking you to court comes back to bite them - and I am not anti-landlord just anti selfish greed.

Saz12 · 01/12/2023 21:57

Your landlord is an utter bastard and is trying it on.

After 10 years the place will need redecorated and various stuff replaced - its all fair wear and tear, and loss of rental income is ludicrous guven that in TEN years they never spent on the property.

ThePeachIsSoUnusual · 01/12/2023 22:13

Absolutely this: Go for the LL's jugular. People like them deserve it. There is help on MoneySaving Expert's House Buying Renting and Selling forum from experienced landlords who hate people like your ex-LL as it gives good ones a bad name. and all the other great advice on here, especially that about filling in the forms, and make sure you can prove you sent them back, by the right date.

underneaththeash · 01/12/2023 22:37

@AgnesR I'm going to report this. There were a few posters at the same time who were not genuine and yours is in the same vein.

Your landlord has to legally have your deposit in a scheme which will cover most repairs, but given that you've been in there several years, unless you've trashed the place it won't be an issue.

You also have to take someone to court FOR something and you haven't said yet what.

StephanieLampshade · 01/12/2023 22:51

What on earth do you mean @underneaththeash ?

OP is being taken to court for damage to property and associated costs....could not be clearer.

What is your issue?

Original poster
AgnesR · 01/12/2023 22:53

I don’t know what you mean or are insinuating re being taken to court.
It’s the small claims court, it’s for a sum of money. Redecoration costs, worktop, lots of small items which I feel are wear and tear, loss of rental income. They are saying I owe way above the deposit amount. I think it’s crazy as I left it clean neat and tidy after a good tenancy.

I would actually quite like this removed as I feel vulnerable as the thread has got so big, just thought I would get a few replies. Plus all the referencing to trashing the place which is not the case and insulting.

No idea why anyone would make it up.

OP posts:
marthalovescheese · 01/12/2023 23:03

AgnesR · 01/12/2023 15:21

Tenancy ended as I found a better place
We had always been on okay terms
They are known locally for being bastards!

I don't suppose this is in Bristol?

Original poster
AgnesR · 01/12/2023 23:06

Not Bristol.
i have just noticed they are charging 2 months rent, 2 months!! To redecorate - and at the new increased rent!!**

OP posts:
Ocani · 01/12/2023 23:12

He's trying to get you to pay for his own decision to refurbish the property. He will be laughed out of court. He's done you a favour really because when you counterclaim you will get your deposit back.

Original poster
AgnesR · 01/12/2023 23:27

Yay, Ocani! That would be so great...

OP posts:
CandyLeBonBon · 01/12/2023 23:29

Ocani · 01/12/2023 23:12

He's trying to get you to pay for his own decision to refurbish the property. He will be laughed out of court. He's done you a favour really because when you counterclaim you will get your deposit back.

I'd have thought that's what he was up to as well - I can't imagine he'll get very far!

Winter2020 · 02/12/2023 08:46

AgnesR · 01/12/2023 20:43

I will look into claiming deposit back too minus their new alarm battery etc!

As already mentioned by a previous poster there is no need to agree to pay for an alarm service etc (even if it is in the tenancy agreement). Adding random things to the tenancy agreement doesn't over-ride the law of the land which is that the landlord must provide working smoke alarms (not the tenant).

The landlord could add anything to the tenancy agreement - that you should get the Landlord gas check done as another example. But no if the property were found to be without a landlord gas certificate that would be the landlords legal issue as the law says it is for the landlord to ensure, not the tenant, and a tenancy agreement wouldn't circumvent the law.

Just dispute everything. If anything point out that providing working smoke alarms is a landlords job in law (not the tenants).

Ohthatsfabulousdarling · 02/12/2023 09:21

I've been thinking about this OP,
Have you contacted shelter for advice?

I think in this situation, you need to see where the best support you can get is, and I think that shelter will guide you on that.

I'd also come out swinging to teach them a lesson. This isn't fair.
Have a look to see where your deposit has been held- they legally need to hold it in a protected scheme...and can face large fines paid to you if they haven't complied.
Look up their responsibilities, have they complied? If not I'd be seeing how you can get compensation- you should have annual gas and electrical safety certificates.

And do make sure you are absolutely clear on what the expected lifespan is on all the areas they've listed damage or repair, because that will translate directly to their claims from you.

Also, what inventory did they provide you with when you moved in? Without an inventory, preferably with photos they can't provide any sort of proof that you didn't move into a house that was in the exact same state as you moved out.

Malbecfan · 02/12/2023 09:48

OP, the alarm issue is an unenforceable term in the contract and you don't have to pay it.

The way it was explained on MSE was that the landlord could write into the contract that you have to wear purple on a Tuesday and eat cold baked beans every Thursday. They are completely unenforceable, just like your alarm one. Crack on with demanding your deposit back from My Deposits (I think) and your counter-claim for court. Can anyone confirm if she can claim her time and expenses in defending this?

SWSO · 02/12/2023 10:14

I let them take you to court . If you haven't got this money then don't worry. They can't have what you haven't got . I would get some legal advice . Just think what shits they are going to look in the local press if they do take you to court .

PropertyManager · 02/12/2023 12:58

Winter2020 · 02/12/2023 08:46

As already mentioned by a previous poster there is no need to agree to pay for an alarm service etc (even if it is in the tenancy agreement). Adding random things to the tenancy agreement doesn't over-ride the law of the land which is that the landlord must provide working smoke alarms (not the tenant).

The landlord could add anything to the tenancy agreement - that you should get the Landlord gas check done as another example. But no if the property were found to be without a landlord gas certificate that would be the landlords legal issue as the law says it is for the landlord to ensure, not the tenant, and a tenancy agreement wouldn't circumvent the law.

Just dispute everything. If anything point out that providing working smoke alarms is a landlords job in law (not the tenants).

Show quote history

From the cost the OP quoted, I'm guessing this is a burglar alarm rather than a smoke alarm.

If the tenant signed to agree to replace the battery and service the burglar alarm on leaving a court may find for the landlord (noting that a courts decisions may well be different from a deposit scheme case)

I think its ridiculous to expect a tenant to pay to service anything on leaving.

When my last tenants left after 12 years, we took the out to dinner to celebrate them getting their own place, I helped them move with my van and the husband helped me rip up the carpets ready for replacement and full re-decorating. thats the kind of convivial working relationship I want with my tenants, which in turn equals no hassle for me, win win, some landlords just don't get it!

Original poster
AgnesR · 02/12/2023 13:13

Although I called the Shelter advice line and it’s just for emergencies, it looks like you can still get non-emergency advice in other ways so I will definitely do that when they open on Monday.

I’m sorry that I have confused things again re the alarm as I meant a burglar alarm not fire that they want me to pay for a servicing and new battery(that I did not use).

They do have all their paperwork in good order and do things ‘properly’, on the face of it.

What they haven’t done is any maintenance in 10 years and then passing the cost on to me for redecorating the house for their new tenancy, not taking account that things have expected lifespans etc. And just being as harsh as possible.

Hopefully things like the fact that they have charged me for a new worktop and the cost of removing and replacing the hob, to fit a new worktop, when they actually replaced the whole crappy kitchen and charging for 2 months loss of rental income, will count against them.

All the fixtures and fittings were cheap and not new when I moved in 10 years ago, so expecting everything that didn’t look perfect to be replaced for new paid for by me is not right (plus all the labour costed).

They said repainting the whole house is 4,600 (!) but view of my 10 year tenancy they will pass on £2,300 to us!

I feel so depressed and upset by it today. I always treat people well and am considerate in everything I do, and I really felt that the house was left fairly and reasonably, morally and legally after a 10 year tenancy.

I am absolutely going to fight them hard though. I think I need to try to shut it out of my mind for the weekend though as it’s got me so down, and I don’t want this to affect my kids more than necessary, who already have a Mum with long-covid operating on v little energy etc. And my husband has possible flu and totally out of action. Need to have a break from it and then hopefully on Monday I can face it with renewed strength (?!)

I really appreciate the kind words and helpful suggestions and ideas. Thank you so much.

OP posts:
Original poster
AgnesR · 02/12/2023 13:22

@PropertyManager ahhh. I wish you had been my landlord!

Yes it was burglar alarm and it was buried in the contract at the beginning so I accept that and was thinking that the £180 would be covered by £750 deposit, and I couldn’t be bothered to argue the rest seeing how aggressive they seemed, and I wanted to save my energy for more important things and move forward and forget them!

OP posts:
MrsSunshine2b · 02/12/2023 14:24

I think that would probably be an illegal clause and it's a legal responsibility for the landlord to cover costs to make the property safe, including the alarm.

notfeeblebutPhoebe · 02/12/2023 15:08

As LL we had to buy and fit new Smoke alarm and a new Carbon monoxide alarm. We have to pay for annual Gas safety checks as well. We had to replace lock for patio doors.
This is all maintenance that is the landlord's responsibility.

ScribblingPixie · 02/12/2023 15:57

Good luck, OP. Try not to take it personally - they probably do this to everyone. I already posted that, as a landlord, I think this behaviour is outrageous and I'm still fuming on your behalf today. The tide has turned on this type of exploitation though so I'd fully expect 'the system' to be on your side.