Can my ex stop me moving abroad with the children?

[ManicPanicAddict]

I'm a teacher and I have the opportunity to take up an amazing job (2 year contract) abroad. It comes with a house, flights for all, medical insurance for all, paid school fees etc. Ex husband has EOW and some holiday contact that adds up to 80 days a year. I haven't broached the idea with him yet but we talked about doing a similar thing when we were married, and agreed it would be an amazing opportunity for DC.

If I said he could still have the same number of days contact (school holidays), can he stop me going? I know he can apply for a prohibitive steps order but surely a judge wouldn't agree it on those terms? We don't have a child arrangement order in place or anything, but it is stated in our financial order that he has EOW.

Any advice welcome

Sounds like a wonderful opportunity for all of you. I would be open and honest with your ex partner and stay calm. I would try and make him see what an experience this be for them. Could he come out and visit you? Would you be willing to help with the cost of his flights etc as additional contact? Best of luck x

I don't see any venom.

Does he have the kind of job/funds where he could come out to that country say 4-6 times a year to see them? With your 2 trips a year that night be workable. Is it a place where he could ge to relatively easily to, say, come out at the weekend to see them if one was ill or in hospital. These are the kind of contextual details needed I think to evaluate whether this is reasonable/works le or not, from his point of view. Also depend on how hands on and involved he is with them to start with I think.

If the dc are old enough to fly alone then they're old enough to have an opinion on the move. If I was the ex id want to listen to my children and not prevent them from having a great opportunity.

Excuse the random keystrokes.

Sounds like DC are teenagers? How do they feel?

You say you hope exDH won't cause grief but you do have to think about how you'd feel if you couldn't see your kids regularly, would you cause grief?

If he's an involved father then personally I think it's really unfair to consider moving abroad

This is not true. I was at boarding school and flew many, many times as a UM, as have my kids

If this was your dream when married, is there any chance that your ex would consider moving to that country too?

If not then I agree with the other posters: this would be very wrong.

I'm someone who was in a similar situation as a child.

I don't have a proper relationship with my dad now and I think this is to do with the fact I lived as you've suggested your children might - only seeing him at the holidays. It's changed how we live our adult lives and how we have a relationship together so I would really really try to consider that for them too.

Whilst it was definitely an "experience" it's one of those things - you grow so quickly as children every time I saw him I was so different. It was hard for both of us, there's only so much letters or calls can do.

So the entire holidays you will send your kids home to their dad? as a teacher your off for the duration - he has to find childcare (assuming he has a "regular" job?)

You are then off for 13 weeks a year child free

Just on that alone its unfair on all parties really

but yes - he can stop you going.

if the kids are high school, I would not even consider it, even late primary for 2 years then they have to find new friends and start over

its just selfish - sorry!

There’s no venom.

But I do find your word choice interesting.

Anyone voicing anything that isn’t fully supportive is ‘venom’. The children’s father not being 100% supportive will be ‘causing grief’.

Have you even considered he wouldn’t be able to take 80 days a year off, so you children could be coming over to go in childcare (or holiday clubs or similar) because he will have to work at least some of the time they are here?

Do you really think they would want to fly back when their Dad will be working?

You do need his consent yes, but that doesn't mean he won't give it when asked. Be prepared to compromise if necessary, to make things more acceptable to him (eg more trips back than you'd ideally choose, perhaps he could have them every Christmas during this period?).

Do you have a good co-parenting relationship?

Hi OP, I had a friend in your shoes. She was fairly amicable with the ex and they were both very good parents, focused on the kids.

They had a calm chat in which she acknowledged his right to prevent it but emphasised how great it would be (a) for the kids schooling, (b) for their wider cultural and social development and (c) for her financial position, allowing her to e.g. save much more for Uni fees, etc.

The compromise they came to was that she paid for 100% of his flights and accommodation when visiting, which allowed him to take longer off work and spend more time with the children during holidays.

My advice would be to have a think about how much cash you are willing to contribute to enable his maximum time with the kids, given the logistics of what you want.

Then maybe you can find a win-win.
Wish you all the best.

I didn't say it was impossible, I said it's the higher priced options usually. You can't pick up cheap flight deals in the same way as you might for an adult.

Hm, good luck to you but I’ll be honest there is simply no way I would entertain this if I was your ex 😬

You really need to have a discussion with him about this because its not as simple as 'he has them for school holidays' as while that is something parents do have to manage its very different to the current setup assuming he works mon-fri.

If its a 2 year contract then maybe he would be open to it as a mid term thing, but he will have very little power to get them back if you decide that you are going to stay out there so it is a tricky position to put him in tbh.

I appreciate it will be disappointing if you can't take the opportunity but unfortunately this is one of the consequences of having kids and may have still been an issue if you were still with their dad, he may not have wanted to go.

So it's a completely different situation if you are as a couple both going to move abroad for the amazing opportunity with your kids than the situation of one of you moving with the kids.

I am v familiar with the different scenarios as I have lived abroad with ec DH, been offered further working abroad placements and have a sibling who has holidays only contact with DS who lives abroad.

Basically it sucks for both the parent and the DC (assuming they have a good relationship) and it also means that the abroad parent "only" has the slog of term time and daily care and all the fun holiday time is with the other parent. So it makes for quite a challenging situation for both sides in fact. As other posters have said, flying solo unaccompanied is now heavily restricted and many airlines won't offer it at all or only offer if you pay for airline staff to accompany. Most cheaper airlines you now need to be 16. So it's a significant cost and the 2 x flyback you have been offered won't be enough. You will need to be offering their Dad every single holiday so that is summer, half term, Christmas, half term, Easter and half term. That's 6 return flights with potentially only a couple accompanied.

The best interests of the children is to have a positive relationship with both parents and even if you feel they are getting on better with you right now, that may change in 2 years but also you may not actually realise the extent of their relationship with their father. I'm divorced and I know I don't always appreciate that myself, not least because he's not my favourite person. Lol!

It is for these reasons I've refused further amazing overseas opportunities, even though it's a shame but family has to come first.

we talked about doing a similar thing when we were married and agreed it would be an amazing opportunity for DC

Surely you can see that the situation is very different now OP, with you two being divorced? It would've been a great opportunity for you AS A FAMILY when you were all together, but I'm not sure he's going to see it as a great opportunity now you're planning to take the DC overseas without him. You certainly can't assume that he'll be favourable. Ask yourself how would you feel, if he proposed doing this to you and taking the kids overseas and leaving you in the UK? I'm guessing you'd be devastated and would be the one issuing a prohibited steps order.

I have a friend who moved with a child. What she did though was make promises of keeping up their relationship and then didn’t follow through. I know this isn’t your case. He then had another child so visiting became basically impossible. I had suggested meeting in Florida so they could have a holiday together but she didn’t want to make things easier for him.

She also went temporarily and is still there 15 years later though. What happens if you are offered the position permanently. Are you happy to come back.

I assume because it’s a teaching role you don’t have to go for a full 2 years as well. Just from the start of one term to the last one of the second year. Which reduces it slightly.

Can you afford to pay for him to come out at least once a year, does he have other children/relationship? Do you want to spend your holidays coming home and not actually seeing the country you’re in? I think there’s a lot to think about.

I certainly wouldn’t agree to this if I was your ex.

You say you wouldn’t let him take the kids to live abroad, but how would you feel if he moved abroad and insisted on having the kids visit him for pretty much every school holiday?

if your ex is a good and interested Dad, then it really saddens me that you would make a move that would jeopardise this relationship. So many of us have shit dads or shit ex’s, it seems so sad that a good one would be cast aside like this.

All the women saying they wouldn't entertain it if they were the ex, would you entertain seeing your children EOW? Because I wouldn't. You can't reverse the sexes and pretend it's the same because it so rarely is.

Having said that, of course he can prevent you from doing it. Going in with, "we've been offered this opportunity, I know you can prevent me going but I want to know if there are any circumstances under which you'd consider it" and see what he says. Also, it it a Hague Convention country? Because no one in their right mind would allow it if not.

What school years are the DC?

Selling it as a great opportunity for your kids is sneaky. It might be great for you, but taking them away from their father is not so great.

Sorry, but I think you need to park this move until the children are both 18+.
I know it sucks, I'm a teacher and & have 50-50 contact of my DC with XH. When we split, all the dreams of long distance travel for weeks also had to be put on hold. The plan to teach abroad has also been indefinitely delayed.
It would be incredibly unfair on your DC and your XH to go through with this, no matter how brilliant the opportunity.

Not wanting your children to live in a different country and barely see them is not ‘causing grief’, it’s ‘being a responsible parent’.