Making children available for contact - what does this actually mean?

[FoldedBlanket]

When a CAO requires the resident parent to make the children available for contact what does this practically mean?

More specifically if you have a child who doesn't want to go at any point, say, and you have driven all dc to the NRP handover point but that dc refuses to go. Have you made them available by taking them there and trying? Or are you required to literally force them?

Obviously resident parent should do all they can to encourage, help, reassure, be positive about contact but if even with all of that the child is adamant about not wanting to go there must come a point where it's detrimental not to listen to their wishes?

The court cafcass report was very clear that I wasn't alienating the dc as ex had raised it. I always speak positively about contact and the other dc are happy to go.

I have read about PA and I am incredibly careful how I speak about ex to dc.

It means force your child. At any cost.

Get a dash cam
Text or say to your ex - here is DS come and get him
Show yourself gently untangling DS from you and gently propelling him to ex
Exagorate your body language to show you hands outstretched with a "take him" and gesturing to your son to go . It doesn't sound that your ex has a good enough relationship to encourage his son to go to him.

If ex doesn't take him and just stands there with DS upset then you've evidence you made him available but ex was unable to gain co-operation of the child

You could suggest in email to ex that as child won't go - he can't pick him up after school on a Friday where you won't be there. Then ex can turn up or not to take child for contact

How did this happen?

Our 2 year old stays with me 3 nights a week and I speak highly of our daughter mother to our daughter and reassure her. Even though she is vile and I suspect our daughter would end her relationship with her mother if she ever found out what she did to her dad. Her mum is half of her identity.

Is there a valid reason why your son acts like this? Shouldn't this have been explored previously?

I meant to type

You could suggest in email to ex that as child won't go - he CAN pick him up after school on a Friday where you won't be there. Then ex can turn up or not to take child for contact

I think after you saying you had/have the same problems with going to school I would explore this with a child therapist. May actually help with improving hand overs.

Sounds like him picking him up from school would be a good idea

Thanks for all input, lots to think about and stuff to try. Gonna bow out now because I don't want to get drawn into explaining all the ins and outs and it becoming completely identifiable.
Thanks again.

@FoldedBlanket

The same dc has had a similar problem with school Baking - the difference is that school have done everything in their power to help dc to manage to come in once I've got them to the school gates, and now that problem has improved massively. Does your school really do absolutely nothing if your dc is screaming at the gates and completely refusing to be left? I'd be very unhappy if mine did.

I've had the Head & Deputy out at the school gates some mornings persuading/cajoling/frogmarching my reluctant child in, so my school is nothing like @BakingOfTheFoodCats school either.

@Collaborate

Quite often these things happen because the resident parent fails to promote contact - at times can speak negatively of the other parent. Have a read about parental alienation and attachment theory. The standard of care a parent needs to provide to ensure the child has them as one of their primary attachments is simply "good enough." To break that bond is recognised to cause certain emotional harm to a child. That is why the continuation and promotion of relationships with both parents is crucial to the emotional development of all children.

The problem is that those parents who are alienators will never recognise themselves as such because they are blind to their own behaviour. Children are extremely perceptive and can pick up all sorts of signals from their parents.

The orders are worded as they are because how they used to be worded presented problems when orders were being enforced.

This parent made no suggestion whatsoever of failing to promote contact, two of the children go willingly, this particular one does not, and the mother struggles to get him to let go of her, with no help from the father whatsoever in taking the child.

It's unfair to have posted a comment about 'parental alienation', a theory that has been debunked in many countries in the world, and which is being called into question in this country repeatedly as a method of abusive men (and it is usually abusive men) using it as a weapon against their victims.

There are some parents who cause their children to not want to spend time with their other parents out of spite, control or whatever, but there are far fewer of these actual cases than there are of fake PA accusations.

A true alienator knows exactly what they are doing, and definitely recognises it, they just don't care because their sole aim is to alienate. An accused alienator tends to be a parent who has been abused, or knows the children has been abused, who is trying to protect the children. The accusation is designed to shut them up.

I wish lawyers would be careful about how they phrase their PA statements. I do not want to enter into a discussion about this, but felt another view had to be given as the mother in this thread showed no indications whatsoever of PA and raising it seems patently unfair.

Appreciate you are a family law solicitor @Collaborate but this poster made no reference to not promoting contact, it appears from her post she is doing all she can by actually continuing to take the child and not hiding behind the fact the child doesn't want to go.

While there may be some cases of PA, I suspect there are many more of shit NRPs who fail to prioritise their DC's welfare and then protest when the children don't want to spend any time with them. You hear so often about children not being fed, being shouted at, ignored, not having anywhere to sleep and being put in front of screens for hours.

It's a very difficult tightrope for the RP to walk. On the one hand, they should be positive about contact with the NRP and promote a good relationship. On the other hand, it is very difficult to pretend, especially to older children, that a hopeless, unengaged parent is anything but a hopeless, unengaged parent and at some point the kids will twig. At that point, insisting that contact is a positive thing comes perilously close to gaslighting your own children and denying their own experience and perception of contact.

But you have entered a discussion about it...

Cafcass recognise parental alienation: www.cafcass.gov.uk/grown-ups/parents-and-carers/divorce-and-separation/what-to-expect-from-cafcass/parental-alienation/. It is not a debunked theory at all. Try telling that to the judge I'm before in 5 minutes...

Parental alienation requires psychological manipulation by the RP. Not being the other parent's cheerleader isn't exactly 'psychological manipulation' .

I know this thread isn't about parental alienation, but it really is highly controversial and widely used by an abusive parent (usually make) to continue control and abuse of the other parent and children after separation. False accusations of PA are rife.

t.co/WrusOvIEcJ?amp=1

www.highconflicteducationandresources.com/parental-alienation

thecourtsaid.org/2021/05/28/parental-alienation-discredited-unscientific-nazi-theory/

Tell that to your judge @Collaborate. Present the critical research. Just because CAFCASS have been sucked down that rabbit hole doesn't make PA any more widespread than the genuine rare cases that always existed. It's the use of the term in court that's skyrocketed.

Tell that to your judge @Collaborate.

No thanks.

@Collaborate unless you're arguing parental alienation on behalf of a NRP, then I feel deeply sorry for whoever you are representing if you're not willing to make the best arguments and present the best research in favour of the resident parent.

Family law is deeply flawed almost to the point of broken. I'm very glad I work in a different (and public) area after my experience in the closed family courts.

Why would I argue against an accepted phenomenon on behalf of a client? I have witnessed firsthand parental alienation - my sister did a hell of a job in her daughter who now has no relationship with her father.

@Collaborate

But you have entered a discussion about it...

Cafcass recognise parental alienation: www.cafcass.gov.uk/grown-ups/parents-and-carers/divorce-and-separation/what-to-expect-from-cafcass/parental-alienation/. It is not a debunked theory at all. Try telling that to the judge I'm before in 5 minutes...

That did not qualify as 'discussion' in my view. I gave another point of view to counter yours, as yours did not fit the scenario the mother who posed the question put forward.

I am not a family lawyer that believes wholeheartedly in 'CAFCASS good' 'tell truth all time' and 'all parents bad'.

I'm sure you can read the tone I intend with those statements...caveman style just in case anyone is wondering.

@Collaborate

Why would I argue against an accepted phenomenon on behalf of a client? I have witnessed firsthand parental alienation - my sister did a hell of a job in her daughter who now has no relationship with her father.

And you might want to check your bias at the door.

I saw a survey on Twitter earlier today, SUTDA, asking for professionals to respond. It included a question about lawyers own experiences of PA, and was followed by a question as to whether your own experiences affected your bias. If I could find the thing, I'd link it, as I think the more lawyers provide answers, especially when holding diverse opinions, the more relevant information can be gathered about what is really going on in the family courts with these claims of PA.

*Now that might qualify as discussion.

@Collaborate

Why would I argue against an accepted phenomenon on behalf of a client? I have witnessed firsthand parental alienation - my sister did a hell of a job in her daughter who now has no relationship with her father.

A relative of mine has suffered parental alienation, and no longer has any relationship with the children of his first marriage. It started much like the scenario the OP described - the children being reluctant to attend contact. In that case, the mother was doing and saying things in the background which made the children feel they would be disloyal if they enjoyed spending time with their father and his wife. My relative was not, and is not now, an abuser.

I don't doubt that PA is sometimes falsely alleged by abusers, just as false allegations of all kinds are made in the family courts, but it is very much a real phenomenon, and I'm glad that some solicitors and barristers (like @collaborate) are clued into it.

It is like leaving a child with childminder or nursery or school where they do not want to go - you pick them up and make them. It's not hard. We have all done it.

@Xenia

It is like leaving a child with childminder or nursery or school where they do not want to go - you pick them up and make them. It's not hard. We have all done it.

When was the last time you picked up a 10 year old?

Then what do you do once you're holding them aloft? Just hurl them in the general direction of the other parent and run away

@Collaborate you are demonstrating one of the fundamental problems with the UK family courts: professionals with deeply held bias.

Here we have a child who for some reason is resistant to contact with their Father. You jump to PA, which whether you agree or don't is a pseudo-science dismissed across the majority of the world.

I can't comment on whether PA is real or not however I can say with utter certainty that there are many reasons a child may resist contact and assuming resistance can only be the result of the RP having spoken negatively or failed to promote contact is unhelpful in terms of actually understanding that's child's experience and why they are resisting. It's interesting the Father in this context has no responsibility, yet the Mother is responsible not only for her relationship with the child but also for curating the Father's (with no input from him) and furthermore enforcing on a distressed child? You demonstrate an astonishing arrogance, and I am sorry to say ignorance, in suggesting that there is only one reason a child might resist contact. Your myopic view risks leaving a child with no safe attachment and the risk of the child's individual needs being totally disregarded all in the name of prioritizing the Father's ''rights''. As a Family Lawyer you have a responsibility to be better informed regards parental alienation.

Check your bias. It is putting children's lives and mental health at risk. I feel deeply sorry for any children who have the misfortune of being party to a case you are involved in.

[quote Pinkyxx]@Collaborate you are demonstrating one of the fundamental problems with the UK family courts: professionals with deeply held bias.

Here we have a child who for some reason is resistant to contact with their Father. You jump to PA, which whether you agree or don't is a pseudo-science dismissed across the majority of the world.

I can't comment on whether PA is real or not however I can say with utter certainty that there are many reasons a child may resist contact and assuming resistance can only be the result of the RP having spoken negatively or failed to promote contact is unhelpful in terms of actually understanding that's child's experience and why they are resisting. It's interesting the Father in this context has no responsibility, yet the Mother is responsible not only for her relationship with the child but also for curating the Father's (with no input from him) and furthermore enforcing on a distressed child? You demonstrate an astonishing arrogance, and I am sorry to say ignorance, in suggesting that there is only one reason a child might resist contact. Your myopic view risks leaving a child with no safe attachment and the risk of the child's individual needs being totally disregarded all in the name of prioritizing the Father's ''rights''. As a Family Lawyer you have a responsibility to be better informed regards parental alienation.

Check your bias. It is putting children's lives and mental health at risk. I feel deeply sorry for any children who have the misfortune of being party to a case you are involved in.[/quote]
I suggest you read my post. I have not accused OP of being behind the alienation. I know nothing of her case.

To suggest PA does not exist is naive in the extreme. I shall carry on advising my clients in accordance with established case law and medical orthodoxy. If any lawyers want to use their clients as guinea pigs and respond to a claim of PA by saying that it simply doesn’t exist as a phenomenon they are doing their clients a great disservice.