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Legal matters

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Going abroad- absent father.

58 replies

Beccaishere · 01/09/2019 09:58

Hi! Looking for some advice as panicking a bit! I am also going to book a solicitors just haven’t got the money at the moment.

My son is 9 and has not seen his father for just over 5 years. We split before my son was born, and up until he was 4 he had only seen him a handful of times. He use to make out to want to see him then disappear for months at a time etc then want to visit 6 months later. It was confusing for my son so I said he would need to put proper arrangements in place through a court as I wasn’t prepared to put up with him turning up and threatening me etc. After a lot of threats etc we now haven’t heard from him in just over 5 years and it’s been wonderful so peaceful my son is happier etc.
Sorry just wanted to give some background...anyway I want to take my son abroad to America next year for a big family birthday of a grandparent. The whole family is going for the trip. I am worried about being stopped at boarder control and not being able to go. It would be heartbreaking for my son.
We went to Paris last year and was stopped coming back but all they asked was who was travelling etc and looked at our passports for what seemed like a eternity.
I would like to get some kind of court order or something that says I have full custody of my son? Is this possible without getting his father involved? It would be like opening a can of worms for us all and his father would never agree to it anyway just to get back at me. I heard you can get a letter from the court for a holiday but what about other holidays? Would I need to apply every time I wanted to go abroad?
We were never married. His father is on his birth certificate but my son has my surname, so his father has parental responsibility.
Thank you for any help or advice anyone has.

OP posts:
FAQs · 03/09/2019 21:23

OP I’m a single parent, dd’s father buggered off before she was born, came back for two visits between birth and 3 and disappeared again. Anyway together we have been to America x 3, Dubai, several European countries, Egypt all with no issues. She has my surname. She was asked once when she was 8 on a USA trip who I was.

Only places we can’t travel without Court documents as far as I’m aware is Canada and South Africa.

He is on her birth certificate.

FAQs · 03/09/2019 21:33

She has also been overseas 4 times with school, inc America with only my consent.

prh47bridge · 03/09/2019 23:57

Only places we can’t travel without Court documents as far as I’m aware is Canada and South Africa

As he is on the birth certificate, this is wrong. Unless you have a court order stating that your daughter lives with you, you are committing a criminal offence every time you leave the country with her. You have been lucky that you haven't been refused boarding or refused entry.

Whoseagooddoggiethen · 04/09/2019 00:04

In Ireland u would go to a commisiine

Whoseagooddoggiethen · 04/09/2019 00:05

Try again...

A commisioner of the oaths and swear an affadavitt that you are solely responsible for your child if you can prove father has defected. Can you do that in the uk?

MrsBertBibby · 04/09/2019 00:06

No you cannot.

Beccaishere · 04/09/2019 08:31

@FAQs that’s great you have managed to go to so many places with your daughter, fingers crossed that doesn’t change for you 😊

OP posts:
FAQs · 04/09/2019 11:36

@Beccaishere I hope you also get to travel. We have built so many memories and going away again in October. X

FAQs · 04/09/2019 11:41

OP I’ve also been in holiday with friends who are married and travel without their husbands, forces wives and one who’s husband lives overseas 9 months of the year with his business and they’ve never had any issues or needed to provide any documents.

There are also lots of single parent holiday companies such as Single With Kids who are very helpful it also allows you to go on holiday with other single parents for support and company and kids all tend to play together. I’ve only done that the once but it was very well organised.

prh47bridge · 04/09/2019 13:01

As I said in my first post, these threads regularly produce posts from people saying they haven't had any problems taking their child abroad without the father's consent. The reality is that it is a criminal offence to take a child out of the country unless you have either the consent of everyone with PR or a court order.

I could tell you about all the times I've driven faster than 70mph on the motorway and got away with it. That doesn't mean it is legal and it doesn't mean you'll get away with it if you try it. You have a good chance of doing so - only a minority of those committing speeding offences are caught. But you may end up getting fined.

Similarly, most of those who take their child out of the country without appropriate consent or a court order will not experience any problems. But, every time you do this, you may end up being refused boarding or refused entry at your destination. That is the risk you take.

FAQs · 04/09/2019 13:03

Yep happy to take that risk esp as in our case my dd fathers hasn’t been seen for around 10 years.

Beccaishere · 04/09/2019 17:39

@FAQs thanks for replying. I really hope that you are able to continue making your memories with your daughter.

The only thing that puts me off just taking the risk and booking the holiday and hoping for the best is apart from my son would be heart broken if we were stopped, is that my son is from mixed heritage so he looks nothing like me or my family that we will be travelling with 😩 I think this would also be a big flag as he would stand out from the rest of us. Xx

OP posts:
FAQs · 04/09/2019 19:11

See what your solicitor says, if you haven’t heard from him for over half your sons life maybe they can apply for some sort of Court order, I have no idea on family law. Maybe they can write to him on your behalf. I really hope it works out for you, it’s extremely unfair he can have no interest but still have that potential to hold you both back. X

beatriceprior · 04/09/2019 19:15

Hi op

I am in a similar position. As the residential parent you can take your child out of the country for 28 days without permission from their non residential parent.

I have done every year since my daughters birth.

I take her birth certificate with me. Each time I've been questioned. The last two times they asked my daughter if I was her mummy as we have different surnames.

Only ever on the way into the uk, never on the way out.

beatriceprior · 04/09/2019 19:17

Apologies but I don't know if it's different for the US, however we have travelled to Greece and Cyprus many times

beatriceprior · 04/09/2019 19:21

Forgot to add, last holiday was last month, he is on her birth certificate.

beatriceprior · 04/09/2019 19:26

OP

So sorry I might have it wrong. I e just been trying to find a link for you and I think I am mixing up when there is a residential order in place and when their isn't.

Don't take my advice as true!

Apologies. Seems I may have been wrong.

LochJessMonster · 05/09/2019 14:15

Out of interest, what if the father was dead? Child has her surname and she has BC stating she is the mother. Would she have to bring along proof of death?

And also, up to what age is permission from father needed?

MzHz · 05/09/2019 14:24

The only problem you’ll have is IF his dad finds out you are going and takes you to court to get a prohibitive steps order

If you and your son have the same name I very much doubt you’ be stopped at all, and it will be assumed that dad is working and you’re with your son and your family.

I’ve only ever been asked anything on my return- once by UK border officials, once by Dutch security

Your son is yours, he’s resident with you, you can take him abroad for a holiday

Please don’t worry

MzHz · 05/09/2019 14:27

I do have a signed statement from my ds dad to say that I have full and permanent permission to take him anywhere

Like I said, only shown it once, and not even when I went to the states

morrisdog · 05/09/2019 14:27

A parent can take a child on holiday without the other parents consent, except in some particular countries, ie. South Africa, where a letter is required

Hoopalaa · 05/09/2019 14:40

I have travelled all over the world including US with my 2 DC's whose father has been absent and NC for 7 years. I have never been asked why I'm travelling without there Dad, why would they even ask that? I didn't even occur to me that I would be stopped?! Absolute nonsense of course a mother can take their DC on holiday whether the Father is absent or not! That's not a crime 🙄 your DS's absent father, if he were to find out could try and get an order to stop you but a judge would laugh it out the court! I believe if he did get an order it would only prevent you from going for more that 28 days.

Don't sweat it and enjoy your holiday 😎🌴🍹

ineedaholidaynow · 05/09/2019 14:52

Hoopalaa at least 3 family lawyers on this thread have said it can be a crime taking a child abroad without a parent's consent.

Interestingly the last time we flew as a family DS was taken to one side and asked who were the adults he was travelling with. We all have the same surname and he facially looks like me

morrisdog · 05/09/2019 15:19

I'm sure it can be classed as a crime if the parent absconds, but if the absent parent is dead, disappeared, absent you do not have to have written permission and you might be asked a few basic questions but it will not be an issue getting into a country (exceptions)

prh47bridge · 05/09/2019 19:40

Out of interest, what if the father was dead

If the father is dead then clearly consent is not needed. However, you may be asked to prove he is dead.

The only problem you’ll have is IF his dad finds out you are going and takes you to court to get a prohibitive steps order

Not true. People are refused boarding or refused entry every year without the father getting a Prohibited Steps Order.

A parent can take a child on holiday without the other parents consent, except in some particular countries, ie. South Africa, where a letter is required

Simply not true. The countries that check vary. Indeed, sometimes it depends where you are entering a country or even which immigration officer you get. If you travel without consent or a court order there are no guarantees. You might get away with it, you might not.

of course a mother can take their DC on holiday whether the Father is absent or not! That's not a crime

Yes it is. Child Abduction Act 1984.

I'm sure it can be classed as a crime if the parent absconds, but if the absent parent is dead, disappeared, absent you do not have to have written permission

Not if they are dead, clearly. But, as the law stands, if the parent has disappeared you are still committing an offence by taking your child out of the country, even for a holiday, unless you can show that you have taken all reasonable steps to communicate with the missing parent but have been unable to do so.

Just to repeat, loads of parents break this law every year. But, like it or not, it is the law. On previous threads some parents told of times they had been prevented from boarding or denied entry. That is the risk you take.