AIBU to think I can fight this? Mumsnetters I need your help!

[FigureItOutNow]

Please be gentle with me - I'm very stressed over this!
Sorry it'll be a long post but bear with me.

Last week my divorce from a very abusive husband was finalised. I'm late 20s with 3kids under 7 from this man. As part of the abuse he completely isolated me from my family.
Anyway my younger sister has some friends in a nearby big city - she said if I could find a sitter she'd come to this city and we could go out with some of her friends to celebrate (I have no friends at the moment). My neighbours 20year old daughter offered to babysit overnight as long as I was back by 9 as she had work later that day.

On the night out I drove up to city with intention that if I wasn't in a fit state to drive back home by 8am next morning I would get a taxi back home and then come back with my kids on the train ( they love trains) to pick up my car so I parked it somewhere where I knew I wouldn't be charged if I had to leave it at 8am.

On night out I managed to drink far more than I could handle (easy as I haven't drank in years due to abusive ex being controlling). I started feeling really sick at about midnight (2hours into the night) and somehow got split from my sister and her friends. I was feeling really crap and decided to go sleep in my car. I messaged my sister and told her where I was and she said that's fine they'll get me from the car on the way back to her friends.

I was fast asleep in passenger siding my car but alarm kept going off and someone called the police. They came at about 3am and it took them about 5min to wake me up as I was so gone. Anyway they started trying to say that I was drink driving and I said how could I be drink driving if I'm fast asleep in the passenger side? Lots of yeah but you were planning to weren't you/stop lying/ tell the truth type of statements. I was so upset at this point called my sister and had her confirm our plans, even showed them our messages with our plans to go back to her friends.
There were 4 police officers at this point and I could hear discussing if they could charge me with drink driving to which one of them said no but they could charge with being drunk and in charge of a vehicle. They came and told me that they were arresting me for this charge. They asked me to breathalyser but I refused as I was paranoid they were trying to frame me for drink driving (I know I know but I was really drunk and this was a stupid thought process) and I asked them so many times why they wanted to breathalyser me when I had openly admitted that I was drunk and NO INTENTION at all of driving but was waiting on my sister and her friends.

Anyway they arrested me - so so so distressing for me as I've been driving since I was 18 never had a parking/speeding/any ticket whatsoever as I'm one of those annoying people that follows the law to T as I'm terrified of getting arrested (oh the irony).

In the end I spent the night and most of the day in cells, they dropped all charges except the one of failure to cooperate by refusing to breathalyser so please mumsnetters help me figure out if I can fight this. I'm a lone parent and I work in the healthcare industry so could potentially lose my job over this as my solicitor said it would come up as a criminal record in all my pre-work checks!!!

I don't understand why the officer never said it was a criminal offence to refuse the breathalyser, when he asked me to do it and I said I didn't understand why he was asking me to do it he said that he was asking me to do it and that was all the reason he was giving

This sounds really awful OP. Probably the last thing you need.
I would try a different solicitor to be honest.

I agree with this though "The fact that it is an offence to provide a breathalyser test and that you may be prosecuted is part of the learnt script officers are taught when requesting a breath test." I've seen them do it on some police programme.

So I have rtft and from what I can tell this isn't about the OP fighting the offence, she knows its happened, its about her fighting the consequences of it.

setting aside the rights and wrongs of what you did and as I have no idea how you spoke to the police (and if you were so drunk the car alarm didn't wake you and neither could the police then you don't really know either) what the OP needs help with is mitigation.

The police and the law is by public consent. is it really in the public interest to deprive this woman of her livelihood. if she lives in a village and cant drive to work and there are no other viable options that fit in with child care, then finding her guilty and her losing her licence means she becomes "a burden on the tax payer".

I don't excuse what she did. but neither do I want to see someone unable to work and have to claim all sorts of benefits and support.

get your ducks in a row OP. explain all the reasons why you were out. apologise for what has been a temporary lapse in an other wise crime free life. start thinking about people who will give you a character witness statement. set out clearly to your solicitor what the implications of a ban are and similarly look at how much more it will cost in insurance etc.

I think the police were absolutely right to do what they did. they aren't mind readers they have no idea whether you are Ms law abider or an a habitual drink driver. they have to assume that you are in a car with keys therefore you are going to drive.

what I don't agree with is punishing you to the point where it alters your ability to work and provide for your family.

.

Also - on whatever programme I was watching, the police officer repeated this twice and asked the guy in question whether he understood. Guy refused both times and I think received a ban for three years. Can't remember the name of the programme, but it was something like Police UK or something.

Tbh until OP is actually charged, a lot of this is speculation I guess.
IF she is charged with failure to provide (in charge) , then she has a small chance to keep her licence. IF she's charged with the failure to provide (drive/attempt to drive), then it's a mandatory ban if convicted.

It won't matter if you 'only' got the duty solicitor - most criminal defence solicitors are part of the duty scheme anyway. Don't waste your money on one of these loophole guys - they can charge £5-10,000 for pretty much the same job. You may get legal aid, depending on your means and the merits of the case, but your solicitor will advise you on that. If you don't, you shouldn't be charged more than £300 for a guilty plea

'You don't even know what happened!'

Whatever it was, it was enough for a magistrate to ban you twice.

Skyrabbit - surely she has already been charged? Otherwise she wouldn't have appeared in court?

yes, I thought she had been charged as well as she seemed to be up in front of someone very quickly.

As far as I know, depending on means, if there is a chance of a custodial sentence, you would be entitled to legal aid. I don't know whether there is a chance of a custodial sentence here, nor do I know your means.

Did they give you a charge sheet OP? It would be a document you had to sign at the police station where they listed the charges.

Finalmente I'm really not sure if she's been charged or not - in one sentence she says she is on bail (don't know where to) and in another, talks about being in front of a judge. If she's been before a judge, I'm confused why the case wasn't finalised on the day - a straightforward G plea should be. Imma bit confused!

That's my point exactly @Skyrabbit
The story doesn't quite add up.

KityGlitr Sat 09-Sep-17 16:40:47
I know Shelley, I was replying to a previous poster who seemed to think the police were probably arresting her to prevent a DUI accident.
Hairy: that's evidence that she was sleeping drunk in a car she owned. Not evidence she was going to drive it. she needed the keys to get into it. They weren't in the ignition. She has texts saying she said she would sleep it off in the car (though if the texts said 'until I can drive in the morning' then yes, she's screwed). Maybe I'm missing something but I can think of several reasons I might go sit or sleep in my car without planning to drive it!

So taking into consideration the amount OP had to drink, how long do you think she needed to sit in the car before being able to drive safely home? She would likely to have been over the limit by, say, 9am the next morning and so the police assuming they may have prevented a DUI accident would seem to be quite reasonable.

Things are in for 'mention' first. A date is then set for a 'plea' hearing. Then, depending on plea, a date would be set for trial. If she pleads guilty, it won't go to trial. If she pleads 'not guilty', then the trial date is set.

The first court appearance is really just to cover whether she's entitled to bail or not. It's not a plea hearing.

I know someone who got done for this when parked in a motor home in a lay by overnight. They were actually in bed in the back in sleeping bags when the police turned up. No idea why on earth they decided that drinking a bottle of wine was a good idea. They'd put their keys in the cutlery drawer thinking that proved they weren't going to drive. They were banned for a year.

Also, the first court appearance, you may just have a duty solicitor, so she has the two weeks now to get legal representation. I'm guessing she was overnight in the cells and was brought to court and kept in a holding cell at the court until her case came up in the afternoon.
All in all pretty fucking traumatic to someone who just got drunk on a night out.

Finalmente - not in England - the first mags court hearing is expected to be one where a plea is taken, be that G or NG. Very few adjournments allowed these days.
I confess I have assumed the OP was talking about English law, she may be in another country I guess which may explain a few things?

I think the advice is to lock out the keys in the boot so that is quite clear you had no intention to drive

How would you do that? My keys need to be in my hand in order to lock the car. So how would I lock them into the boot?

Ok Skyrabbit. I thought first hearing was really a bail hearing.

OP hasn't mentioned entering a plea though.

People with intentions to just have a 'sleep' in the car do sometimes wake up still in a drunken stupor and drive the car. You just don't know what would happen as op was drunk. Hence why its illegal to be drunk and in a car with the keys.

Op had planned to get a taxi home and yet didn't. Op got separated from sister, yet they both had phones and could have met up again easily. Sister was supposed to 'pick' her up on their way home and yet it was 3 am so she clearly didn't. Car alarm kept going off but it didn't wake op or she wasn't in a fit enough state to switch it off. Police took 5 minutes to wake op from drunken sleep. Op was clearly drunk, admitted she was drunk, became paranoid, argumentative and refused a breathalyzer.

She is guilty and is very lucky they dropped the drunk in charge part. Take the plea, accept the points and beg the judge for as small a fine as possible. Otherwise you open it up for the prosecution to argue the above points and you face a much worse penalty because from an impartiall perspective it doesn't look good.

I can't be certain but i think if you refuse a breathalyzer test you should have been offered another one at the station..if you refuse that one i believe they can take a blood sample if they really wanted to quite legally. However they chose not to...sooo nobody can say how drunk or over the limit you actually were.! Although you have admitted verbally that you were drunk there is no actual proof of how drunk..i think on these grounds you may stand a good chance, with very careful wording in court, of receiving a slap on the wrists and a good telling off by the judge..
Maybe you should defend yourself in court?!..good luck.

Silver:

"

So taking into consideration the amount OP had to drink, how long do you think she needed to sit in the car before being able to drive safely home? She would likely to have been over the limit by, say, 9am the next morning and so the police assuming they may have prevented a DUI accident would seem to be quite reasonable."

Oh if she was that hammered I imagine she'd have been over the limit for at least a day, definitely wouldn't have been safe to drive in the morning. The OP said she was going to sleep then get a taxi back in the morning didn't she, not drive back? I still am surprised sleeping in your own car drunk without driving it is illegal and I'd never have guessed people to this thread. The police had way of knowing OP was going to wake up still drunk and try to drive. I get your point though that it's fair to presume the driver may do that, but the police don't usually arrest people because they think someone 'might' go on to commit a crime. Look how many awful stories we read of people who can't get abusers arrested until they actually commit an assault.

Hairy: 😂😂 bless your socks thinking I'm arguing. Think you need to step away from the phone or PC for a bit if you can't handle civil discussion without trying to make it into an argument. Unless you're just trying to live up to your username, in which case rock on!