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Original poster

AIBU to think I can fight this? Mumsnetters I need your help!

283 replies

FigureItOutNow · 09/09/2017 10:11

Please be gentle with me - I'm very stressed over this!
Sorry it'll be a long post but bear with me.

Last week my divorce from a very abusive husband was finalised. I'm late 20s with 3kids under 7 from this man. As part of the abuse he completely isolated me from my family.
Anyway my younger sister has some friends in a nearby big city - she said if I could find a sitter she'd come to this city and we could go out with some of her friends to celebrate (I have no friends at the moment). My neighbours 20year old daughter offered to babysit overnight as long as I was back by 9 as she had work later that day.

On the night out I drove up to city with intention that if I wasn't in a fit state to drive back home by 8am next morning I would get a taxi back home and then come back with my kids on the train ( they love trains) to pick up my car so I parked it somewhere where I knew I wouldn't be charged if I had to leave it at 8am.

On night out I managed to drink far more than I could handle (easy as I haven't drank in years due to abusive ex being controlling). I started feeling really sick at about midnight (2hours into the night) and somehow got split from my sister and her friends. I was feeling really crap and decided to go sleep in my car. I messaged my sister and told her where I was and she said that's fine they'll get me from the car on the way back to her friends.

I was fast asleep in passenger siding my car but alarm kept going off and someone called the police. They came at about 3am and it took them about 5min to wake me up as I was so gone. Anyway they started trying to say that I was drink driving and I said how could I be drink driving if I'm fast asleep in the passenger side? Lots of yeah but you were planning to weren't you/stop lying/ tell the truth type of statements. I was so upset at this point called my sister and had her confirm our plans, even showed them our messages with our plans to go back to her friends.
There were 4 police officers at this point and I could hear discussing if they could charge me with drink driving to which one of them said no but they could charge with being drunk and in charge of a vehicle. They came and told me that they were arresting me for this charge. They asked me to breathalyser but I refused as I was paranoid they were trying to frame me for drink driving (I know I know but I was really drunk and this was a stupid thought process) and I asked them so many times why they wanted to breathalyser me when I had openly admitted that I was drunk and NO INTENTION at all of driving but was waiting on my sister and her friends.

Anyway they arrested me - so so so distressing for me as I've been driving since I was 18 never had a parking/speeding/any ticket whatsoever as I'm one of those annoying people that follows the law to T as I'm terrified of getting arrested (oh the irony).

In the end I spent the night and most of the day in cells, they dropped all charges except the one of failure to cooperate by refusing to breathalyser so please mumsnetters help me figure out if I can fight this. I'm a lone parent and I work in the healthcare industry so could potentially lose my job over this as my solicitor said it would come up as a criminal record in all my pre-work checks!!!

I don't understand why the officer never said it was a criminal offence to refuse the breathalyser, when he asked me to do it and I said I didn't understand why he was asking me to do it he said that he was asking me to do it and that was all the reason he was giving

OP posts:
Afflictus · 09/09/2017 23:18

I've PMed you op.

Teebird669 · 09/09/2017 23:36

"Think they know it all"
Do YOU need that defining??

Teebird669 · 09/09/2017 23:44

And i presume you are the "grown up" here man

ShellyBoobs · 10/09/2017 00:09

Teebird699 - are you on fucking glue?

They "chose not to" take a sample?Are you out today?

"It's MY breath..."Are you out today?

Advising OP to defend herself in court and get a "slap on the wrist" from the judge??

Shock
Teebird669 · 10/09/2017 00:19

They chose not to give a breath test!
It's my breath..sarcastic comment!
Defend herself due to shit solicitor!
Slap on wrist meaning fine /points/community service as opposed to total ban!
No not on fucking glue..in all day!

clownfaces · 10/09/2017 00:28

Teebird They didn't choose not to give her a breath test. She refused.

Teebird669 · 10/09/2017 00:44

I never said they didnt choose to not give her a breath test..i said she chose not to have it!

Teebird669 · 10/09/2017 00:45

They chose not to give breath test..meaning op

steff13 · 10/09/2017 00:57

They chose not to give breath test..meaning op

The OP chose not to take it. She isn't the one giving it.

Teebird669 · 10/09/2017 02:30

That is what i meant..the op chose not to have/take a breath test

BeatriceBeaudelaire · 10/09/2017 03:18

Fuck! I've done this loads when I can't drive back but don't have somewhere to go .. wtf

DiscoDiva70 · 10/09/2017 10:05

OP
You said that you became separated from your sis/friends about midnight (why didn't you contact her to let her know at the time whereabouts you were in the club or whatever?) and you decided to go and find your car to sleep in/wait for your sis.
Why didn't you go straight for a taxi instead and get yourself home to the babysitter (who needed you back) and your children? This was your original plan any way wasn't it, to get a taxi if you weren't in a 'fit state' to drive?

I don't understand why you'd change your plans and agree to go to your sister's friends house for the night, which would make it more inconvenient for you to get home, rather than finding a taxi.

Also, you say the Police came about 3 am. Therefore, your sister left you alone for three hours, where you were a) paralytic and could've become unwell b) vulnerable to attack from just about anyone passing by your car. Really?

I may be wrong but I would say that you had every intention of driving your car home that night (otherwise you would've got the taxi) and you probably did get in the passenger seat to try and sober up with a little rest (in case the Police caught you resting beforehand behind the wheel) before setting off.
If you were genuinely going to be with your sis I don't think she'd have left you alone that long.
In short, you were caught.

JustanotherJP · 10/09/2017 12:24

There is a lot of crap on this thread indeed.

From a magistrate's point of view (also known as a JP hence my username):

In England, if you are arrested overnight and then charged with an offence you may well end up in court the next morning. In our town we have one court reserved purely for 'overnighters'.

If you are charged with an offence and not brought to court immediately then you may be given a date for your first court hearing in a few weeks time.

At your first court hearing you are expected to enter a plea. If you plead guilty it is hoped you can be sentenced at that time but it may depend on whether probation reports are required. If they are required sometimes they can be done same day, sometimes it may be adjourned for sentencing in a couple of weeks.

If at the first court hearing you plead not guilty then a date for trial is set. This is likely to be a couple of months down the line in our court as there is a fairly long waiting list.

Your first hearing will be at the magistrates court. In 80% of cases that will be in front of three magistrates. Occasionally it will be in front of one district judge.

Only if a crime carries a penalty of more than 6 months in prison does it usually go to Crown Court with a judge and jury.

With regards to credit for guilty pleas, generally if you plead guilty at the first opportunity you get 1/3 off the sentence. This credit reduces the later you leave it, so if you wait until the day of trial it will usually be a 10% reduction.

In terms of prosecution costs, in our court if you plead guilty immediately they are £85. If it goes to trial and you are found guilty after a trial they are usually £620. If you are found not guilty then you do not pay costs.

In OP's case, there are a few things that don't make sense but ignoring those for now...

OP, you admit you refused to give a breath test. Your only defence really would be if you genuinely were unable to or language meant you genuinely didn't understand what you were being asked to do.

So, you are guilty of the offence. Your chances of being found not guilty on what you have said here are pretty much zero.

Your circumstances, that you didn't understand you had to, may be some mitigation.

Plead guilty, get the credit and the lower costs and look at the sentencing guidelines linked below for where you think you fall.

www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/offences/item/fail-to-provide-specimen-for-analysis-in-charge-revised-2017/

Finalmente · 10/09/2017 12:33

It's a fait accompli then Justanother ?

Fuck, I'd hate to be the op.

Finalmente · 10/09/2017 12:39

If I'm ever breathalysed I'll blow like fuck for them. :D

Thanks for the education.

Aintgotnosoapbox · 10/09/2017 13:25

OP I hope you don't have any serious consequences from this.
I'm not judging, but please think about your drinking pattern in the context of being a lone parent etc.

hairymaryquitecontrary · 10/09/2017 13:30

It's a fait accompli then Justanother

Well yes, because she is absolutely guilty of the charge against her. She knows she is, the police know she is, and the magistrate will know she is.

Fairenuff · 10/09/2017 13:41

I was pulled over by police because of a faulty rear light. They breathalysed me in the back of the police car. Even though I hadn't had a drink for several days and knew I was clear it was still a nerve wracking experience. OP must have had some balls to argue with them!

BMW6 · 10/09/2017 13:46

Not balls - just pissed.

BoysofMelody · 10/09/2017 13:52

just I read the sentencing guidelines with interest.

CULPABILITY demonstrated by one or more of the following:

Factors indicating higher culpability

Deliberate refusal/ failure

Factors indicating lower culpability

Honestly held belief but unreasonable excuse

Which would the op's behaviour with the police fall into? She could claim she was

BoysofMelody · 10/09/2017 13:55

not being obstructive and honestly didn't believe she was required to. give a sample, but on the other hand she started to carry on with the police and refused to cooperate.

Fairenuff · 10/09/2017 14:19

I think the audio will show them explaining to her that it is an offence to refuse a breath test so she can't really plead 'honestly held belief'. I mean, she might have believed it before but once they started explaining she has all the facts and she still refused it.

I don't think being too drunk to understand is a reasonable excuse. Maybe if she was physically incapable of blowing because the drink had incapacitated her it might help but she didn't even attempt it did she? She just refused to co-operate with them.

I think it will come up as deliberate refusal so OP is probably looking at a 6 month ban.

ShellyBoobs · 10/09/2017 15:22

Maybe if she was physically incapable of blowing because the drink had incapacitated her it might help but she didn't even attempt it did she?

I don't see how it would help though?

They want a specimen to see how drunk she is. Saying that you were so drunk you couldn't provide a specimen doesn't sound like a good idea.

Fresh8008 · 10/09/2017 15:49

Maybe she could argue that she honestly believed the police where trying to frame her for being 'drunk in charge of a car'?

steff13 · 10/09/2017 16:11

But they wouldn't be framing her; she was drunk in charge of a car.