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Original poster

AIBU to think I can fight this? Mumsnetters I need your help!

283 replies

FigureItOutNow · 09/09/2017 10:11

Please be gentle with me - I'm very stressed over this!
Sorry it'll be a long post but bear with me.

Last week my divorce from a very abusive husband was finalised. I'm late 20s with 3kids under 7 from this man. As part of the abuse he completely isolated me from my family.
Anyway my younger sister has some friends in a nearby big city - she said if I could find a sitter she'd come to this city and we could go out with some of her friends to celebrate (I have no friends at the moment). My neighbours 20year old daughter offered to babysit overnight as long as I was back by 9 as she had work later that day.

On the night out I drove up to city with intention that if I wasn't in a fit state to drive back home by 8am next morning I would get a taxi back home and then come back with my kids on the train ( they love trains) to pick up my car so I parked it somewhere where I knew I wouldn't be charged if I had to leave it at 8am.

On night out I managed to drink far more than I could handle (easy as I haven't drank in years due to abusive ex being controlling). I started feeling really sick at about midnight (2hours into the night) and somehow got split from my sister and her friends. I was feeling really crap and decided to go sleep in my car. I messaged my sister and told her where I was and she said that's fine they'll get me from the car on the way back to her friends.

I was fast asleep in passenger siding my car but alarm kept going off and someone called the police. They came at about 3am and it took them about 5min to wake me up as I was so gone. Anyway they started trying to say that I was drink driving and I said how could I be drink driving if I'm fast asleep in the passenger side? Lots of yeah but you were planning to weren't you/stop lying/ tell the truth type of statements. I was so upset at this point called my sister and had her confirm our plans, even showed them our messages with our plans to go back to her friends.
There were 4 police officers at this point and I could hear discussing if they could charge me with drink driving to which one of them said no but they could charge with being drunk and in charge of a vehicle. They came and told me that they were arresting me for this charge. They asked me to breathalyser but I refused as I was paranoid they were trying to frame me for drink driving (I know I know but I was really drunk and this was a stupid thought process) and I asked them so many times why they wanted to breathalyser me when I had openly admitted that I was drunk and NO INTENTION at all of driving but was waiting on my sister and her friends.

Anyway they arrested me - so so so distressing for me as I've been driving since I was 18 never had a parking/speeding/any ticket whatsoever as I'm one of those annoying people that follows the law to T as I'm terrified of getting arrested (oh the irony).

In the end I spent the night and most of the day in cells, they dropped all charges except the one of failure to cooperate by refusing to breathalyser so please mumsnetters help me figure out if I can fight this. I'm a lone parent and I work in the healthcare industry so could potentially lose my job over this as my solicitor said it would come up as a criminal record in all my pre-work checks!!!

I don't understand why the officer never said it was a criminal offence to refuse the breathalyser, when he asked me to do it and I said I didn't understand why he was asking me to do it he said that he was asking me to do it and that was all the reason he was giving

OP posts:
BoysofMelody · 09/09/2017 14:22

Yy to "misogynistic bullies". The police were just awful to me that night.

I know, those nasty misogynistic bullies tipping all that booze down your neck and forcing you to drive, not once but twice!

How dare they not tip their caps and say 'i'm sorry I hadn't realised you were a laydeee, that makes all the difference, here's the car key back, just try not to kill to many folks as you weave your way home'

You are clearly a fool or arrogant if you failed to learn after the first time and are still trying to avoid full responsibility for your behaviour.

Pandoraphile · 09/09/2017 14:22

Oh you too expat! What part of being banned means I'm a bully? You don't even know what happened!

jalapenos · 09/09/2017 14:23

I've not read the whole thread, but have seen enough to know that there is plenty of bad advice. Failing to give a specimen is at least as serious as giving a positive specimen; it has to be, otherwise why would anyone ever cooperate?

Someone in charge of a vehicle and slightly over the limit could expect a fine and 10 points. Someone in charge and around 3.5 times the limit or above could expect a community order or custodial sentence and a disqualification of 6-12 months.

You can't be charged with that offence though as it relies upon an evidential reading which you refused to give. Failing to provide a specimen means that the courts will look at the "culpability" and the "harm". From what I've read, both of these are at a higher level; a deliberate refusal to provide a sample while very drunk. The guidance is the same as above; a community order or custody and 6-12 months disqualification.

Don't be concerned about custody. The circumstances in which you ended up in your car are good mitigation and it is vanishingly unlikely that a court will incarcerate a single mother of three. A community order such as unpaid work is the most likely outcome, although a persuasive solicitor might be able to mitigate it down to a hefty fine.

The advice to plead guilty is sound. It will reduce the community order or fine by one-third and will make the mitigation more believable. It will also avoid you paying the cost of a trial, which is over £600 if you were found guilty. And, from everything I've read, you would be.

You should expect to be banned from driving for at least six months, although again a persuasive solicitor might just get you 10 points in all of the circumstances.

Source: Magistrate.

SoPassRemarkable · 09/09/2017 14:23

If you refused a breath test at the police station you may well be banned for a year.

Pandoraphile · 09/09/2017 14:23

I wasn't drink driving HmmDifferent offence.

BoysofMelody · 09/09/2017 14:26

I wasn't drink driving hmmDifferent offence

Don't give a fuck, if you've been banned twice, you clearly aren't safe behind the wheel of a car and are still whining and trying to deflect attention from your own actions.

It's a bloody crying shame people like you ever get your licence back ever.

LairyMcClary · 09/09/2017 14:33

I think I've come across wrongly - I'm not trying to get out of the charge but trying to minimise the impact

Oh come on, OP, would you ever stop it? Even your title is "aibu to think I can fight this"! You absolutely are trying to get out of it.
Which you won't. I would have more sympathy for you if you weren't trying to push blame onto anyone but yourself.

TheHodgeoftheHedge · 09/09/2017 14:33

Hang on, you say this happened on Thursday with you held overnight in the cell and most of the day. You were charged with failing to provide a specimen and bailed to reappear in 2 weeks time but don't seem to
Understand anything about your bail. You took the point that you might not be able
To remember the discussion clearly due to being drunk and now there's full audio.
And now you say then you met your solicitor for only 10 mins before appearing before the judge.

Something about this really doesn't add up.

Fairenuff · 09/09/2017 14:34

Was it speeding then Pandoraphile? Banned twice? Shame on you.

Missingstreetlife · 09/09/2017 14:35

Police have targets, so often charge then change or drop charge.
Your solicitor should fight your corner, magistrate may dismiss case.
Get second opinion, duty solicitor sometimes lazy and too pally with police

Justblockthebitch · 09/09/2017 14:40

OP you were extremely distressed and not thinking straight. Speak to a solicitor. x

LadyinCement · 09/09/2017 14:49

Friend of mine had too much to drink at lunchtime, got in his car and decided to try to sleep it off. The police found him, he was charged and received a driving ban for a year. The police have to assume, I guess, that you may intend to drive the car whilst still under the influence. I agree that refusing a breath test is tantamount to admitting guilt.

I was breathalysed once (for going through red light - accidentally!) and was only too eager to comply as I hadn't been drinking.

lalalalyra · 09/09/2017 14:50

If it shows up in a dbs check it can only be held against you in terms of a job if it's relevant.

I run an after school care and I'm in charge of dealing with the checks - it's absolutely not allowed to discrimine against a member of staff or a volunteer for an irrelevant offence.

Driving offences and old offences (the example used in my training course was someone charged for stealing fish fingers from a shop 18 years ago) would not be an automatic reason to not give a job or remove from a role. The offence has to be relevant to the role or be a serious character issue (so repeated theft of money if they were likely to have access to petty cash etc).

steff13 · 09/09/2017 15:00

OP, I would do what your lawyer tells you. If you were so drunk it took the police five minutes to wake you, it's unlikely your recollection of events is accurate. Talk to your lawyer about taking a plea for the minimum sentence.

LadyinCement · 09/09/2017 15:01

I simply don't understand the posters complaining about the police and bandying about terms like "bullying" etc. Are you happy for people to drink drive? Should women especially be exempt from drink driving rules? What do you want? Back to the old days when you could have a skinful and then drive home?

I know someone whose ds was run over and killed by a woman who had been drinking. She refused to be breathalysed. Should she have been given the benefit of the doubt? She may have had anxiety issues after all. Strewth Angry

Pandoraphile · 09/09/2017 15:03

I'm a very good driver. I was banned for a month because my driving licence had been revoked and I didn't realise. I didn't even know it was a possibility. I can't remember the exact circs, it was something to do with points being added and me not sending in my paper part of the licence (back in the Dark Ages, obvs).

Second time was driving without insurance because my bastard exH (just split up at the time) cancelled my car insurance and then reported me. Court were sympathetic but constrained by sentencing guidelines.

LairyMcClary · 09/09/2017 15:04

You were banned twice. You are not a very good driver.

grannytomine · 09/09/2017 15:04

She wasn't driving LadyinCement.

TheweewitchRoz · 09/09/2017 15:04

Oh Op, I really feel for you - what rotten luck. No advice sadly, but I hope you manage not to get banned.

I'd suggest being honest with your manager & make whatever declarations on any future job references - if it's irrelevant to the job, hopefully it will not count against you.

Flowers for you (& well done on getting free of your abusive ex).

grannytomine · 09/09/2017 15:06

Are we referring to the OP or Pandoraphile. Think I jumped a page!

AwfulSomething · 09/09/2017 15:09

Nitpicking here, but some have suggested these offences aren't publisised....it's in the Highway Code which motorists really should be familiar with, penalty table here

www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/annex-5-penalties

Crispbutty · 09/09/2017 15:09

Op I'm assuming you were just given the duty solicitor.

Go and see a solicitor of your own choice on Monday.

From a link posted earlier, the important bit is..

"However, if they have refused to give a sample, even if they never drove or drank, they could be guilty of the failure offence. A person in this situation may however still keep his or her licence if the right legal argument is made at court."

A decent solicitor will sort this out for you.

LairyMcClary · 09/09/2017 15:10

A decent solicitor will sort this out for you

or not, since she is actually guilty.

Fairenuff · 09/09/2017 15:13

I'm a very good driver. I was banned for a month because my driving licence had been revoked and I didn't realise. I didn't even know it was a possibility. I can't remember the exact circs, it was something to do with points being added...

What were the points for Pandoraphile that caused your licence to be revoked?

Pandoraphile · 09/09/2017 15:26

Doing 25 in a new 20 zone. Totally my fault.