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Original poster

AIBU to think I can fight this? Mumsnetters I need your help!

283 replies

FigureItOutNow · 09/09/2017 10:11

Please be gentle with me - I'm very stressed over this!
Sorry it'll be a long post but bear with me.

Last week my divorce from a very abusive husband was finalised. I'm late 20s with 3kids under 7 from this man. As part of the abuse he completely isolated me from my family.
Anyway my younger sister has some friends in a nearby big city - she said if I could find a sitter she'd come to this city and we could go out with some of her friends to celebrate (I have no friends at the moment). My neighbours 20year old daughter offered to babysit overnight as long as I was back by 9 as she had work later that day.

On the night out I drove up to city with intention that if I wasn't in a fit state to drive back home by 8am next morning I would get a taxi back home and then come back with my kids on the train ( they love trains) to pick up my car so I parked it somewhere where I knew I wouldn't be charged if I had to leave it at 8am.

On night out I managed to drink far more than I could handle (easy as I haven't drank in years due to abusive ex being controlling). I started feeling really sick at about midnight (2hours into the night) and somehow got split from my sister and her friends. I was feeling really crap and decided to go sleep in my car. I messaged my sister and told her where I was and she said that's fine they'll get me from the car on the way back to her friends.

I was fast asleep in passenger siding my car but alarm kept going off and someone called the police. They came at about 3am and it took them about 5min to wake me up as I was so gone. Anyway they started trying to say that I was drink driving and I said how could I be drink driving if I'm fast asleep in the passenger side? Lots of yeah but you were planning to weren't you/stop lying/ tell the truth type of statements. I was so upset at this point called my sister and had her confirm our plans, even showed them our messages with our plans to go back to her friends.
There were 4 police officers at this point and I could hear discussing if they could charge me with drink driving to which one of them said no but they could charge with being drunk and in charge of a vehicle. They came and told me that they were arresting me for this charge. They asked me to breathalyser but I refused as I was paranoid they were trying to frame me for drink driving (I know I know but I was really drunk and this was a stupid thought process) and I asked them so many times why they wanted to breathalyser me when I had openly admitted that I was drunk and NO INTENTION at all of driving but was waiting on my sister and her friends.

Anyway they arrested me - so so so distressing for me as I've been driving since I was 18 never had a parking/speeding/any ticket whatsoever as I'm one of those annoying people that follows the law to T as I'm terrified of getting arrested (oh the irony).

In the end I spent the night and most of the day in cells, they dropped all charges except the one of failure to cooperate by refusing to breathalyser so please mumsnetters help me figure out if I can fight this. I'm a lone parent and I work in the healthcare industry so could potentially lose my job over this as my solicitor said it would come up as a criminal record in all my pre-work checks!!!

I don't understand why the officer never said it was a criminal offence to refuse the breathalyser, when he asked me to do it and I said I didn't understand why he was asking me to do it he said that he was asking me to do it and that was all the reason he was giving

OP posts:
AnnieAnoniMouse · 09/09/2017 10:50

I'd go back & ask the woman if she would make a statement & be prepared to be a witness.

Bullies like him need removing from the force.

CaptainMarvelDanvers · 09/09/2017 10:51

StaplesCorner I think people, on mumsnet especially, are often so quick to defend the actions of the authorities whether it be police, councils or schools.

I agree with you, I think OP was low hanging fruit.

Original poster
FigureItOutNow · 09/09/2017 10:52

Yes witchend my attitude was an issue apparently.

fairenuff I wasn't allowed to call the sitter as my battery died and I didn't know her number by heart and they said that's not their problem! Luckily my sister managed to find her on Facebook and sending her a message to explain that she didn't know what was going on and I most wouldn't be back in time, etc. Thesitter was brilliant and sorted the kids out for me- but I live in a village where everyone knows everyone's business and I've been asked so many times how I'm going to deal with the drink-driving charge and whether I'm going to lose my job. Has me in tears most times - think moving house is on my cards soon

OP posts:
HolidayTimeAgain · 09/09/2017 10:53

Lots of info on this site - it doesn't look good for you though op, you were found drunk in your car with the keys on you and refused a breath test.
Could you keep your job if you get a driving ban?
www.drinkdrivinglaw.co.uk/offences/failing_to_co-operate_with_a_preliminary_test.htm

MynewnameisKy · 09/09/2017 10:53

Figureitoutnow it might be best to repost this in legal.

Flowers
UnconsideredTrifles · 09/09/2017 10:55

Haven't RTFT but I used to deal with these cases a lot. From the little you've said I'd say that pleading guilty makes sense.

They can't prosecute you for drink driving if they have no breath test, which is why the failure to provide charge exists. Ignorance of the law is not an excuse, and a judge is always going to take the sooner recollection of a police officer over what you remember.

It sucks that you were pulled up on this when you weren't doing anything wrong - your solicitor should use that in mitigation to distinguish you from the people who actually drive and then refuse to give a sample.

UnconsideredTrifles · 09/09/2017 10:56

(caveat not a lawyer, not legal advice*)

Original poster
FigureItOutNow · 09/09/2017 10:58

No holiday if I get a ban I can't keep my job as I live in a village and have an hours drive to work, the bus to get me in for 9am leaves at 715 so means that I can't drop kids off at nursery/ school because nursery and breakfast club start at 745. Just so so so angry with myself as I'm usually a very sensible person

OP posts:
Potnoodleforbrains · 09/09/2017 10:59

Hi , really dont want to upset you more but the reason that the drunk in charge has been dropped is because the failure to provide is a stronger option for the police to proceed with . Failure to provide is up to 3 years driving ban ,because it is looked at the same as drink driving . But drunk in charge is 10 points on license. Please please pay money for good driving offences solicitors. I say this from bitter experience of very similar situation.

LairyMcClary · 09/09/2017 11:00

I think people, on mumsnet especially, are often so quick to defend the actions of the authorities whether it be police, councils or schools

That's a good thing, I think you'll find. Especially in a case like this. OP broke multiple laws, and "other people have got away with it" is hardly a good defence, is it?

Squarerouteofsquirrel · 09/09/2017 11:02

Why will you get a driving ban for refusing breathalyser? Didn't I read earlier that it's 4 points on your licence. Do you already have points on your licence?

Potnoodleforbrains · 09/09/2017 11:06

Square root . Because if that was the case then every drunk driver would just refuse the breathalyser.

HerOtherHalf · 09/09/2017 11:08

It sucks that you were pulled up on this when you weren't doing anything wrong

She was doing something wrong though. She was drunk in charge of a vehicle which, whether you think it should be or not, is a specific criminal offense. It is a criminal offense for very good reason. They have opted to drop that charge and prosecute for failing to provide a blood/breath test which is also a criminal offense for very good reason. The fact that she was apparently ignorant of these offenses is no excuse. All the back story, from her previous abusive relationship to getting seperated from her sister, is irrelevent. All those saying she wasn't doing anything wrong, the law says otherwise and are you really so naive to believe she wasn't going to drive off still half cut if she had been left to wake up naturally?

alltouchedout · 09/09/2017 11:08

Which laws did OP break other than failing to provide a breath sample? I'm confused!

Nancy91 · 09/09/2017 11:09

Ok after your sarcastic response to me trying to comfort you, I hope they do charge you Smile

CaptainMarvelDanvers · 09/09/2017 11:10

LairyMcClary

I think most people in authority positions are nice normal people but sometimes you get arseholes, especially in the police as it does attract people who like to be on a power trip. I don't always think the authorities are correct and I don't think they should be blindly defended.

Police are allowed to use their discretion, I bet it was obvious that OP was in the car sleeping it off - they could have had a word with her and got her to call a taxi to go home.

By the way I don't drink and I think OP should have took better care of herself and surroundings but I don't see how it helps anyone for her to lose her job.

Original poster
FigureItOutNow · 09/09/2017 11:15

nancy no idea what I said to you that I was sarcastic as I haven't replied sarcastically to anything. Sorry

OP posts:
HerOtherHalf · 09/09/2017 11:16

Which laws did OP break other than failing to provide a breath sample? I'm confused!

She was drunk in charge of a motor vehicle. She has admitted that in her OP. The police may not be charging her with that offense but she still committed it.

Vanillaradio · 09/09/2017 11:16

I'm really sorry but legally you are likely to be Guilty of the fail to provide. The police have the right to request you to provide a sample if they had reasonable suspicion you were driving or in charge of a vehicle. If you don't it's an offence unless you had a reasonable excuse (usually this is something like a medical condition preventing you). The fact that you say police told you that you didn't have to provide.....are you sure of what they told you? They will most likely say they followed procedure, it will be who the court believes, They will unfortunately most likely believe the police as you will have to admit you were very drunk. The cPS will most likely not drop it but run the trial, This is an offence that it is very difficult to avoid conviction for.
If you are convicted after trial you will get a bigger fine than if you plead Guilty.
Look into your options v carefully and try more than one solivitor. Some specialist motoring solicitors will take lot of money off you with little chance of success
It's been a while since I was involved with this area but ask your solicitor about the possible sentence. I thought fail to provide when there is no suspicion of driving was not a mandatory ban. If this is still the case you may be better pleading Guilty and putting everything into your mitigation to fight the ban.

BoysofMelody · 09/09/2017 11:17

Obviously you've had a completely crap time of it of late and no one would wish an abusive partner on you, but really op I, really think there's a lot you can do but hold your hands up to this.

By dropping the other charges in favour of failure to provide, it isn't that they've let you off, but by refusing to provide, you've made it impossible to get the evidence for the drunk in charge case, so refusing a specimen is in effect he seems as a failed breath test.

As a previous poster said, you'd have probably been way over the limit when you'd woken up and driven home and it doesn't bare thinking about what the consequences of that are.

Original poster
FigureItOutNow · 09/09/2017 11:19

Thanks all! Some really good advice and words of comfort here. It was stupid of me, I know but ultimately I just want to protect myself and my family from further negative consequences that's why I posted on here as there's usually someone with experience of what you're going through on mumsnet! Appreciate all the responses, even the "negative" ones as that's probably what the prosecution is thinking of me

OP posts:
lilwayneslisp · 09/09/2017 11:20

So OP is anything ever your fault or are you always 'so unlucky?'

StaplesCorner · 09/09/2017 11:21

"OP broke multiple laws" - FFS. Get a grip, she was asleep in her car. Schadenfreude, anyone?

ShellyBoobs · 09/09/2017 11:22

Just thank you lucky stars you weren't charged with being drunk and in charge of a vehicle.

Confused

You clearly don't understand how serious the offence of failing to provide a specimen is.

The sentence for it is very possibly harsher than for outright drink-driving.

OP should have provided the specimen then argued her case (whatever she thinks that may be) afterwards.

As it is, she's refused the test and that's an absolute offence in itself, even if stone cold sober.

It's the another thread where MNers make up all sorts of bollocks about what the law is and post it as if it's fact.

LairyMcClary · 09/09/2017 11:22

Police are allowed to use their discretion, I bet it was obvious that OP was in the car sleeping it off - they could have had a word with her and got her to call a taxi to go home

They would have preferred to do so, the paperwork and extra shit involved with arresting her would not have been their first choice, believe me. Which leads me to think that OP was probably belligerent and fighty and that is why she ended up in the cells.