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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you have any legal concerns we suggest you consult a solicitor.

Legal matters

Can they take my baby away

837 replies

saraheve · 06/01/2017 00:23

HI i really need some advice, my 9 year old son was taken into care due to depression i was unable to keep on top of housework, I was binge drinking on weekends and I was in a unhappy relationship with childs farther, since my son has been taken into care I have attended therapy, hired a cleaner, attended a parent recovery group, relapse prevention group and took parenting courses. I am 8 months pregnant due to give birth very soon, I was given a prebirth assessment that said social services will go to court if they see that babys needs are not being met, unborn baby is on child protection and on the plan it says the same, yet social services say they want to take me to court? I was told their is no present concerns and I have addressed all previous concerns yet they want to still take it to court based on pre historic. I have so much evidence of significant changes yet they want to keep me in hospital once baby is born and have a discharge planning meeting where they may take baby away. Have they got any grounds since I have made significant changes and their is no present concerns. I am very devastated please can somone advise me? Thanks.

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saraheve · 08/01/2017 22:24

They did say to me if he ever gets aggressive with me again I must call the police but if I do that im worried they will use it against me.as they did before. I will do my best for baby and apart of child protection plan it have said I only want him to see his baby set days rather than coming round when he wants.I do need ss help with this as im not strong enough to do it alone. That's why innisally I wanted social services in my life when my son was in my care because I was hoping they could give me some support. I didnt know my son would be taken away as I looked after him very well.

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Gallavich · 08/01/2017 22:25

Oh lovely you're not there at all are you
Social services can't move you, they can't keep him away for you. You need to do it. You can get advice from women's aid and even from the DV liaison at the police.
Please don't make assumptions about what's ok regarding contact with this man. You need to cut him out and you need to do it yourself.

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saraheve · 08/01/2017 22:29

Sorry but I thought social services were their to support you. And I am with it I might be autistic but I thought social services could of moved me. Anyway his moved out now. And i will take freedom program and let social services know I only want him to see baby on arranged days. I didnt know sorry.

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Gallavich · 08/01/2017 22:33

Social services don't move people, that's not in their remit.
And what you're expecting is that social services will do the job of keeping him out of your life. That's not supporting you, that's enabling you. The decision to rid yourself of him comes from you.

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saraheve · 08/01/2017 22:34

When your in a abusive relationship it's very hard to keep that person away from you it's not like a normal relationship were you break up and they accept it. I was going to go refuge but ss told me that will be selfish as my son would have to move school. So I ended up just putting up with things and got very depressed. Not nice to say im not with it. When u feel very low and all your self Essteem is gone and u have a very dominating partner it's not easy. I'm not gonna let that comment get me down i have to much outher things to think about thank you

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saraheve · 08/01/2017 22:36

So say if someone is unable to rid them self's from someone because that person is aggressive possibly violent and won't accept it. As i said a abusive relationship is not like a normal relationship were it's easy to leave. That's why refuges exist. Hello

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saraheve · 08/01/2017 22:38

And enamelling me to do what. Wouldn't that be helping me get out my situation.

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showmetheminstrels · 08/01/2017 22:42

The social worker is not there to support you. They are there to protect your children.

Sometimes the two things are the same. But when they're not, they fall down on that side.

I'm going to say it one more time.
Get away from him.
Stay away from him.
Stay clean.
Do what they say.

Or don't, and lose both your babies. It really is your choice.

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saraheve · 08/01/2017 22:43

How would that be enabling me to help me get out of a bad situation when I was unable to do it myself. I'm glad I'm not in that relationship anymore. I have a lovely home I wouldn't want to move. I really thought social services were their to support and help families. I realise now I have to help myself. It's OK now but I've been though hell and havnt even been back from it yet. So don't judge untill u have walked through my shoes.

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saraheve · 08/01/2017 22:46

And yes your right I need to keep away from him. But he keeps knocking on my door. So fine I'll call police just hope ss don't use that against me

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Gallavich · 08/01/2017 22:49

What I mean when I say you aren't there yet is that you are still totally enmeshed in this relationship with an abusive man. You have lost care of one child very recently due to this relationship and you're still in it, so that is why there is a chance they will try to separate you from your baby.
You are expecting other people to step in and enforce the end of the relationship. That's what I mean by enabling. You need to see for yourself why you need him gone. And you need to use the appropriate support to keep him away (police). Social services don't have police powers nor are they housing workers. They can advise you but you need to see it through yourself.
Going in to a refuge is extremely disruptive. Have you contacted your housing department to see if you can get moved in the normal way?

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Gallavich · 08/01/2017 22:49

Why do you think social services would use it against you if you call the police? That's exactly what you should be doing.

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Gallavich · 08/01/2017 22:51

And please - I'm not judging. If you are reading judgement in my posts then you really need to deal with your persecution/victim mentality because I'm giving you informed, non judgemental advice.

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TimidLividyetagain · 08/01/2017 22:53

They won't tell you not to see your ex, you are supposed to come to that conclusion yourself, this may be why they are concerned. He cannot decide you are still in a relationship. You have to not see him or interact with him at all unless it's regarding the children. When texting should be good enough. Could you ask for contact with your son separately from your ex so that you never see him. You can call the police if he breaks your doors and any time he gets angry and threatens you. If you let him in that is not a good sign. I wish you the best and hope you get where u want to be in life. If he goes to court for contact with the new baby that when he can see the baby. He should be cut out of your life, apart from Texts regarding the children. He could see the baby with his mum maybe supervising or doing the pick ups. But you are meant to think of this yourself. But I realise it is not apparent to you this is maybe the case

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TimidLividyetagain · 08/01/2017 22:57

Never seeing your ex is what a future with your baby should look like. Once he gets contact then u arrange with his mum to let him see the baby whatever the arrangements are.

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Viviennemary · 08/01/2017 23:10

I agree don't have your ex at the birth. Why would you if he is violent and abusive. You need to distance yourself from him and do all you can to protect your children. And if that means no contact then so be it. If social services think your child is in danger then they will take steps to make sure the child is protected. That is what they are there for.

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UnbornMortificado · 08/01/2017 23:21

SS can make poor decisions too. I'm not SS bashing at all I've received a lot of support with DD2 from them.

Are you saying children's services are wanting your ex to have unsupervised visits with the baby Sarah?

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christinarossetti · 08/01/2017 23:24

The major issue here isn't your parenting abilities or your motivation to maintain the positive changes that you've made sarah. No-one on this thread has any reason to doubt on these things.

The issue is that you are continuing to have a relationship with your ex and don't, as yet, have to plan to protect your children from having contact with him.

The primary step that you can make towards not having your baby removed is to cease all contact with your ex. He shouldn't be at your baby's birth (yes, it's his baby, but it's your body and you're the patient). You should be informing ss that you don't want to see your son with him, at the very least.

SS will intervene with your baby if they have cause to believe that you aren't able to protect her. If you're allowing your ex to have contact then you're likely to be viewed as not able to protect your children, I'm afraid.

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christinarossetti · 08/01/2017 23:25

And yes definitely call the police if he comes to your home.

That will show SS that you are serious about keeping him away from you. Letting him in simply won't.

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saraheve · 08/01/2017 23:36

Ok thank you, ss want him to have unsupervised visits. But maybe I should take this in my own hands and get ask housing for transfer or go to unit refuge, their is no present abuse but I have to show theirs no threat of future abuse. I will talk to housing and ss about this thanks.

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ihatebikerides · 08/01/2017 23:52

Even though I'm not with him he still wants to be around. I know u might think why do I let him in but last time I didn't let him in he broke my front door.

I'm sorry, saraheve, but this indicates that there is risk of future violence. I'm afraid I can see why SS are concerned. You are making a good show of saying how much things have changed for the better and how you want things to be in the future, but they are not going to just take your word for it.
I have limited experience with a local family who are struggling in a slightly similar way, by the sounds of it. SS have given every chance/support in the world, as the primary wish is to keep the family together if at all possible, but they're about to arrive at the very sad position of the children being removed. Mum is distraught, but she just cannot keep them safe/cared for.

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YourOtherLeft · 08/01/2017 23:54

Hi saraheve,

On of the hardest parts of ASD is when non-ASD people don't realise we can't read between the lines :( It means we miss stuff that's obvious to them, but not obvious to us. It also means we don't know how to ask for help in the "right" way, and we forget that even well-meaning people can be bad at their jobs.

Have you considered finding an Advocate? An Advocate can be a professional working for a charity, or someone you know. The purpose is to have someone who can do the reading-between-the-lines bit on your behalf, cut through the SS jargon, and make sure you know how to ask for things in the right way.

Mind understand the challenges faced by people with ASD and can talk with you about Advocacy.

www.mind.org.uk/information-support/guides-to-support-and-services/advocacy/#

The pdf (www.mind.org.uk/media/2436106/advocacy_2015.pdf)will give you a digital copy of the information pamphlet.

I suggest you call / text the number on the page linked below to ask for assistance finding an Advocate. Explain the situation with your DC, explain the situation with your ex, and explain that you have ASD.

www.mind.org.uk/information-support/helplines/

Or email [email protected] if it would be easier to write it all down.

Good luck!

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UnbornMortificado · 08/01/2017 23:58

My ex got unsupervised access on one SW's say so. I was against it but wasn't in the right mental state to argue.

The long and short of it was 18 month later he got caught with drugs and committing DV his new girlfriend access was stopped but it has upset DD.

He had a police record for drugs and violence and had served an 18 month prison term.

You have some rights you can insist you don't want him at the birth and want his visits supervised. If I could go back and insist on supervised I would.

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Ineedanewbody · 09/01/2017 00:01

But there is present abuse.

He has coerced you into having him at the birth & he come to your home despite the fact you are worried he may be violent if you ask him not or call the police.

That's abusive.

Moving house is not going to solve the problem for you. The freedom programme can help you unstabd and alter your thinking about him.

You've done some great work getting sober etc but really don't seem to have the insight yet into how damaging this is for you.

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mathanxiety · 09/01/2017 03:37

your right I need to keep away from him. But he keeps knocking on my door.
You sound completely passive here, and while I understand you have been dominated by him for years, you sound as if you really do not understand that he does not have the right to come around and ask to be let in.
....
I know u might think why do I let him in but last time I didn't let him in he broke my front door. I tried to explain to social services but they didn't do anything. I was going to go to a refuge with my son but social worker at the time said I'll be selfish as my son enjoyed going to his school. At least if im monitored or put in a unit he will have to stay away. He doesn't ask me for money or abuse me anymore. But I told ss if his going to be the reason I loose baby can u move me. But they said I have a nice flat and dont need to move, so I assumed having contact with him wasn't a problem.

There are two problems:
One is that he is aggressive and frightening, and therefore abusive.
The other is that you want everyone else to solve the problem of him maintaining contact with you. This all by itself is a red flag for SS.
You have misunderstood what SS have said to you. You do not seem to understand that SS wants you to show determination not to let him into your home or your life (phonecalls, etc). What they have said is that they cannot do this for you. The implication is that you must do it for yourself, where you are now, all by yourself. (They want to be sure you do not end up with someone else just like your ex either, on the rebound, but that is for the future).

They did say to me if he ever gets aggressive with me again I must call the police but if I do that im worried they will use it against me.as they did before. I will do my best for baby and apart of child protection plan it have said I only want him to see his baby set days rather than coming round when he wants.I do need ss help with this as im not strong enough to do it alone. That's why innisally I wanted social services in my life when my son was in my care because I was hoping they could give me some support. I didnt know my son would be taken away as I looked after him very well.

What worried them before (I would bet £££) is that you called police when he was aggressive but then stayed in the relationship. You want SS to act as referee in this relationship that you have no intention of ending. That is not their job.

I would be willing to bet £££ again that your statement that you want him to see the baby only on certain days is ringing loud alarm bells in the SS office - this cannot happen. Can you not see that this constitutes maintaining contact with him? Maintaining contact is the issue.

Since you have already called police (there will be a record of this call) then you can possibly get a non-molestation order. If there has been violence or threats or aggression in the past and you have broken up and he has moved out, and if you have told him to stop coming over (esp since he broke down the door) then you can possible get that non-molestation order as what he is doing sounds like harassment.
Please ask the police domestic violence officer at your local station how you can get one.

You are sounding completely passive when the topic in question is this man. You seem to feel ambivalent and unwilling to make a decision to cut him out of your life and then stick to it, or use tools that are available to you to show that you mean business (the tools are the non-mol order and good communication with SS wrt how YOU are going to go about getting exP out of your life and keeping him out.)

Whether you really want to or not, you have to cut all ties to this man. This means cutting all contact, and it means signalling to SS that you are serious. It also means following through on any order you get against him, so if he knocks on your door after he gets the order you have to call police.

I agree 100% with Gallavich that you do not seem to understand how important it is that this man gets completely erased from your life. If this is clear to people reading your comments on a forum, you can be sure that SS can hear that when you talk to them.