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Original poster

My wife's work deduct a days pay when she has to stay at home with our ill child

312 replies

DabbyBob · 02/02/2016 18:15

Hi All.

Just looking for some advise regarding pay rights for a teacher in full time employment - she is employed by the local council and has been in her permanent position for 12years or more.

So every time that she needs to take a day off because one of our children are ill her bosses at the school will deduct a days pay. This makes things really difficult as it puts all the pressure on me to work from home... Which i will do 2/3rds of the time, but sometimes like now (away on business) i cant take the day off.

My wife tells me that its all leagal and that they are within their rights to do this. But for me it just seems so wrong when you have 12 years working there!

I guess the simple question is: is this leagal or does my wife have some rights here?

Thanks.

OP posts:
SexTrainGlue · 03/02/2016 07:03

You know when you say there are times when you just can't take the time off, you also need to recognise that there are times when your DW just can't take the time off. Every single one of her working days (bar insets) is the same importance as your inflexible client-facing days as those the ones she is seeing her 'clients' ie the pupils.

Now, perhaps it's not being easy for you to realise that you are the one with the flexible employer who permits paid time off in addition to leave allowance, and so emergency childcare needs to fall to you. And client facing days should be split 50/50. Have you actually given up any yet?

There is no reason whatsoever why this needs to be your DW's responsibility, on her client-facing days when has the more 'client'-facing role. Is it easier to blame her employers than for you to take the same number of client-facing days off as she appears to have done to date?

BoneyBackJefferson · 03/02/2016 07:04

P1nkP0ppy

"Of course, the 13 weeks/year don't count?"

In this case they don't count as the holidays are set and cannot be transferred for any situation.

BeaufortBelle · 03/02/2016 07:10

Teachers are paid and receive statutory annual leave of 20 days and 8 bank holidays which is taken in the school holidays. They may get more than this contractually and contractual leave may vary from organisation to organisation, especially if a school is an academy and no longer bound by LA policy.

Family friendly is more difficult for a school than for a corporate taking into account that every child attends to receive an education and children should be at the heart of all a school does - the ones who attend the school.

MackerelOfFact · 03/02/2016 07:31

There are, of course, plenty of non-teaching jobs where your DW can work a bit more flexibly and use her 20 days of annual leave to cover your DCs sickness. Although the 8+ weeks' extra childcare during the holidays may well cancel out any benefit.

FishWithABicycle · 03/02/2016 07:35

I'm astonished that there are any employers who pay people to have a day off for taking care of a sick child. Obviously most allow time off unpaid but some don't even do that - they allow an hour or two for you to make emergency phone calls to arrange for a grandparent or emergency nanny to spring into action then you are expected to be back at your desk. It's tough but not unreasonable - your children are not your employer's responsibility.

PurpleDaisies · 03/02/2016 07:36

I'm surprised that people think that its so obvious that she shouldn't be paid as for me its the opposite, workers should be valued and occasional child sickness that is out of their control should not result in a decrease in their wage.

"Occasional" days off mount up though, and you haven't addressed why you think it's right that you're paid not to be at work or get an extra few days holiday because you have children. If employers are obliged to do this doesn't it mean they'd be less likely to hire people with young children?

I appreciate it's difficult but it is in no way your employers responsibility to pay your childcare.

fastdaytears · 03/02/2016 07:54

OP, do you also think that there should be paid time off to care for elderly relatives or other family members, or is it just children who count? How about step children?

Everyone has to figure out how to fit their job around their responsibilities. In the public sector there's the added pressure for management that they're dealing with public budgets but that doesn't mean they're wrong not to pay people to stay at home with ill kids.

As someone said, your DC seem to have an awful lot of time off ill. How many do you have?

redhat · 03/02/2016 08:00

I'm pretty sure the burgundy book doesn't say you get two days of paid leave per annum for a sick child. I could be wrong sparklycat but if you could point me to where it says that I'd appreciate it.

BeaufortBelle · 03/02/2016 08:14

We allow (education) up to three compassionate days per annum authorised on a case by case basis. We do usually allow a day for a child's sickness. Staff get very irked when I explain it's one day at a time to arrange alternative care for their child. Longer than that it's annual leave or unpaid.

BitOutOfPractice · 03/02/2016 08:40

"there are times when i cant due to client or travel commitments"

I simply don't get that OP. Your DW has "client committments" every day ie the kids. She just has to drop her plans. You don't? Eh? How does that work? Do you simply think your work is more important?

DrSeussRevived · 03/02/2016 08:43

All working parents balance who will take the day off for a sick child -'d will factor in remaining holiday balance, meetings and ability to work from hime -!: who covered the last illness etc.

OP you say your work has a family friendly policy but that's clearly based on your work being able to happen from home sometuines.

StarCat · 03/02/2016 08:44

Every primary teacher I know makes their dh/dp go off with child sickness. You can't let her go off if she's a teacher, she needs to be at work.

DrSeussRevived · 03/02/2016 08:45

So on a day you have travel commitments, as a family, you decide that attending to those is more important than a day's pay for your wife; on a day you don't, you decide that working from home so you both keep pay is the best option. Similar decisions are being made by couples nationwide every day!

BitOutOfPractice · 03/02/2016 08:45

I realise that Dr Seuss, what with being one myself. But it seems that the OP thinks that he should only do it when it causes him no inconvenience - even if that causes his wife trouble at work and she doesn't get paid

BitOutOfPractice · 03/02/2016 08:46

They don't "decide as a family" though. It's simply obvious that he "can't" because he has a meeting.

DrSeussRevived · 03/02/2016 08:46

Star, I think that's wrong too. It's reasonable for parents to share the burden of sick children and people other than teachers have unmissable work commitments.

DrSeussRevived · 03/02/2016 08:49

Bit, my posts were aimed at the OP. I think you and I agree that both sets of work are equally important!

LentilStew · 03/02/2016 09:02

I think it's unfair to suggest that the op should do it all. He's already said he does most but occasionally he cannot miss work and therefore she needs to do it. It's unreasonable to suggest that she shouldn't ever do it just because of the nature of her job. As a teacher I'm well aware out holidays are plentiful. The problem is they they're fixed and therefore cannot be used to cover s child sent home ill from school.

As for half a day to sort out emergency cover then back at your desk...what emergency cover would that be? We have no family and I tried to organise an emergency nanny once when I went into early labour and DH was away. They offered me someone the following day at £500 per day. So not even the same day and not just expensive but prohibitively so. If I needed that fir a week then my entire monthly salary wouldn't even have covered it.

LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett · 03/02/2016 09:02

Think of all the holiday childcare you don't have to pay for OP.

I'm pretty sure that balances out 2 - 3 days unpaid leave per year.

BitOutOfPractice · 03/02/2016 09:14

Nobody has said the OP should do it all Lentil Confused

I see now DrSeuss - I read them differently before. It's early still! More coffee required Thanks

LentilStew · 03/02/2016 09:18

My own personal issue is not that it's upaid, I accept that. Rather it's that I'm expected not to do it and reminded how I'm letting everyone down. DH actually does more than me but that doesn't mean I get away with not doing it. Every single successive HT I have worked for since having children has uttered the line, 'well can't you call your mother' what a ridiculous thing to say.

  1. since graduating I have never lived closer than 50miles from her.
  2. she had her own busy, professional job.
  3. she's dead
fastdaytears · 03/02/2016 09:21

My own personal issue is not that it's upaid, I accept that. Rather it's that I'm expected not to do it and reminded how I'm letting everyone down.

Agreed, that is tough. And the expectation that everyone has a stay at home grandparent within easy reach is ridiculous.

LentilStew · 03/02/2016 09:21

Bit, I was just responding to you pulling him up on not being able to do it when he had to meet clients saying everyday was client facing for her. He had said earlier that he did all the others sport from those few times so I don't think it's unreasonable to expect that she must do those days if he picks up the tab the rest of the time.

Clarella · 03/02/2016 09:51

I haven't read whole thread but my work (teacher) decided to give 2 days per year paid leave for dependants in an emergency eg sick child. This was after careful discussion with governors. It's an Sen school so lots of staff and we have a few colleagues with very disabled children, and actually all these women are TAs so on low wages anyway. This is just out school and our very nice head.

In my experience teachers (mainly the TAs) sometimes call in sick them selves (if work record generally good) in order to avoid this issue. It's just how it is, and more so in a profession where the majority are women, as with very young children it's usually the mother who tends to care for the child.

uglyswan · 03/02/2016 10:06

"I'm astonished that there are any employers who pay people to have a day off for taking care of a sick child." - I'm astonished that this isn't mandatory tbh. You hire people to work for your business - they're going to get ill, their children are going to get ill, life happens. If you want reliable, productive staff, then it's ridiculous and unfair to penalise them. Those are the costs of running a business. You don't want to pay those costs? Then buy the services of self-employed contractors - they'll be more expensive of course, but that's because they're taking on the financial risks that you, the employer, are so keen to avoid.