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Confusion after death of dad - funeral and money related

95 replies

chestnutmare · 12/12/2014 22:06

I need some advice please. I'll try to include all the details below, as much as I know anyway. This might be long, sorry in advance :)

My dad died a few months ago. We're in Scotland in case it makes a difference. He had no will.

Three kids, me, my brother and sister, all adults. I don't think it's relevant, but my brother and I were adopted by him after he married our mum, they then had my younger sister.

None of us had any contact with him for quite a few years before he died, due to his behaviour before he and my mum split up and divorced. There wasn't much money when they divorced (house was repossessed), they each came away with £7.5k.

When he died (think he was only 62) he had been living in various care homes for several years, due to being unable to care for himself. He had a condition similar to Alzheimer's. He was already in the care home when the divorce was finalised so as far as we know he was never well enough to spend the money.

My siblings and I only found out he had died through word of mouth locally. We weren't even sure which care home he was in when he died, although we believe he had been in a few different ones around the area over the past few years.

His sister (my aunt) contacted my sister after he died to say she'd organise the funeral and did my sister have any requests? My sister said no and so the funeral was organised by my aunt. She originally said it would be a crematorium service but ended up being at the local church. My brother and sister attended the funeral but I did not, as I was abroad at the time.

My sister received a letter from my aunt today, saying that, as my siblings and I are legal next of kin, we are liable for the funeral costs.

What we want to know is, could this be correct? We had no say in any of his care leading up to his death, wasn't even notified when he died, so it seems strange that all of sudden we are next of kin when a bill needs to be paid?

My aunt has been dealing with everything up to now, including the Department of Work and Pensions and the funeral directors. The Department of W&P paid out £2.5k directly to the funeral directors for part payment of the funeral costs, saying that was all the money they held in his name. There was also a small pension payment of £140 paid directly into my aunts account, which she has forwarded onto my sister in the form of a cheque.

I spoke informally to a solicitor today and he said we need to find out if there was anything in his estate. I doubt there'd be much, but his own mother died last year and apparently he was left money by her.

If anyone can shed any light on our situation I'd be really grateful.

OP posts:
Viviennemary · 13/12/2014 16:42

I agree. Your aunt directed the funeral directors to make the arrangements and therefore she is liable for the costs. She must have signed something. She can't just say you'll pay without your agreement.

LadySybilLikesSloeGin · 13/12/2014 17:09

Please do try to find out what's happened to his money and his belongings. If she's done this about his funeral bill I dread to think what else she's done.

Fish is right. Don't agree to anything, do ask them to see the contract and where you or your siblings have agreed to pay though. This is not enforceable as it's not your debt, your aunt signed the forms so she's legally liable.

chestnutmare · 13/12/2014 17:20

We will try. It's knowing who to ask/where to start! We're pretty sure there must be money somewhere, as his own mother died about a year ago, and we believe he was left money by her. Plus she owned a house which my aunt is now renting out. Although it's possible the house was put into my aunts name so I'm not sure this will have anything to do with my dad.

Belonging wise, I doubt he had much, due to the house repossession prior to his time in care homes.

OP posts:
Viviennemary · 13/12/2014 17:24

I think under Scottish law by rights children are entitled to one third of money but not property even if a will says otherwise. The children can claim it in court. You need a solictor on this one. Presumably this aunt is your Dad's sister.

LadySybilLikesSloeGin · 13/12/2014 17:33

This is useful www.scotcourts.gov.uk/taking-action/frequently-asked-questions/your-questions-on-dealing-with-a-deceased's-estate Start off here, it should let you know if there's a will or not. If you have a copy of his death certificate, you could try his bank. I have a copy of my father's and there was a problem with the bank (we were querying payments going from his account). They would speak to me, even though my sister was his 'official next of kin' as I was his child too and had a copy of his death certificate. I was given access to his bank statements so I think this is your next step. You can also find out the details of your granny's will using the link too, so you'll be able to find out if she had left the house to your aunt and how much your father was left (do bear in mind that he may have spent all of it, you'll be able to check his bank statements for this once you've got in touch with the bank). If his house was repossessed he may not have had much, especially if he was in a home as they are expensive, but you should check.

chestnutmare · 13/12/2014 17:33

Yes she is Viviennemary

OP posts:
MsAdorabelleDearheartVonLipwig · 13/12/2014 17:34

Do you even want anything from your dads estate?

chestnutmare · 13/12/2014 17:47

No MsAdorabelle. That's what I was going to ask. If we don't want anything, is there any need for us to try and find out what he had? Our (my siblings and I) main issue was that we didn't want to pay for the funeral of someone we've had no contact with for 8+ years, and that we didn't organise.

OP posts:
LadySybilLikesSloeGin · 13/12/2014 17:50

Oh, forget that then. Sorry, I should have asked.

chestnutmare · 13/12/2014 17:52

It's ok LadySybil, I really appreciate all the advice :)

OP posts:
LadySybilLikesSloeGin · 13/12/2014 17:53

I'm sorry that she's done this. The funeral director should have told her that's not how things work Thanks

SunnaClausIsComingToTown · 13/12/2014 17:56

It doesn't seem fair that your aunt should have to pay, though. The children are his next of kin, surely?

There's no way I'd let my aunt pick up the bill for my dad's funeral.

DoesntLeftoverTurkeySoupDragOn · 13/12/2014 17:59

If we don't want anything, is there any need for us to try and find out what he had?

The only reason would be so you could tell the aunt to take any costs from the estate if she continues to try and get the money from you.

MsAdorabelleDearheartVonLipwig · 13/12/2014 18:08

Well to all intents and purposes the aunt really is his next of kin. She's arranged everything so let her continue with it and settle her bills herself.

LadySybilLikesSloeGin · 13/12/2014 18:22

The Aunt could have had a basic funeral which would have been covered by his estate. I don't think it's down to the OP or the siblings to cover these costs when she chose not to go for basic, especially as they have had no contact from him for the past 8 years.

chestnutmare · 13/12/2014 18:35

Yes that's how we feel LadySybil. We went NC for good reasons, this was before he got ill and ended up in a care home. We had no relationship with him for many years before he died.

OP posts:
FishWithABicycle · 13/12/2014 19:21

If the bill is for £780 and we assume this is the difference between the value of the estate and the cost of the funeral, and as we know your aunt decided on burial rather than cremation then the outstanding amount is very clearly of her own choosing and her responsibility.

SunnaClausIsComingToTown either you are the aunt in question or you haven't understood quite how distant the relationship was between the OP and the person who happened to contribute some chromosomes to her some years ago. Possibly both.

Gatheringthoughtstothink · 13/12/2014 19:44

It used to be the case of a death the NOK got forms to fill in not means tested, think they pay 2,000, has your aunt claimed this?

chestnutmare · 13/12/2014 20:02

No idea to be honest Gathering. We've had no contact with that side of the family for even longer than we've had no contact with my dad. They were all pretty vile to my mum and us when she and my dad got together, don't think they approved of the fact that my mum already had kids (me and my brother).

OP posts:
FishWithABicycle · 13/12/2014 20:31

when she and my dad got together, don't think they approved of the fact that my mum already had kids (me and my brother).

Do you mean this man wasn't even your biological father just the man your mum was with? Or have I misunderstood?

chestnutmare · 13/12/2014 20:33

No he wasn't Fish but he adopted my brother and I after he married my mum, so as I understand it, all three of us are 'equal' if you see what I mean

OP posts:
FishWithABicycle · 13/12/2014 20:40

Sorry you mentioned that in the op and I forgot. As you were - you said back then it's not relevant info so no more to be said.

Anyway good luck in this. I'd advise you (and siblings) to do everything in writing, no phone calls or face to face convo so you can keep records and copies and double check everything you are about to send to ensure no accidental words slip through that could be misconstrued as agreement to pay.

chestnutmare · 13/12/2014 20:42

Thank you Fish :)

OP posts:
SunnaClausIsComingToTown · 13/12/2014 20:48

SunnaClausIsComingToTown either you are the aunt in question or you haven't understood quite how distant the relationship was between the OP and the person who happened to contribute some chromosomes to her some years ago. Possibly both.

I understand better than you, Fish. There is no genetic relationship, as established in the first post. I am not the aunt, what a stupid thing to suggest.

An adopted daughter is closer kin than an aunt. If there were money to inherit the OP would be entitled to one third, and the aunt entitled to nothing. It just seems to me that the aunt will be out of pocket and it isn't technically her responsibility and that doesn't seem fair.

If the OP's father turned out to have thousands to leave I doubt she'd give it all to the aunt because she had gone NC with her dad.

SunnaClausIsComingToTown · 13/12/2014 21:05

Posted too soon.

I just don't think it's fair for the aunt to have to pay - that's all. I do understand the OP's position and the aunt should have explained she was only going to arrange it but maybe couldn't afford to pay for it. Perhaps she thought she was doing the closer family a favour.