ERA EMMA ALICE testing thread 9

[Gardenlady543]

@2021ivfagain @Enfys23 @clhiu @CailinInUK @Spin101 @Loz2467 @Mybabydream @Janefx40 @ChickenT2b @kerrym87 @Sar1010 @AM08 @thislittlebird @IVF22 @APSR
@Faithhopelove83 @KLM25 @VenusStarr
@BewilderedBee @Dochas12111 @seven201 @StillWishingHoping

We've maxed out the other one so here's thread 9 😊

@2021ivfagain I also wish I did more cycles when younger (40! and 42!) and banked more euploid low risk embryos but I gambled as I’d had enough with some many stim cycles by then. Somehow I’ve found the strength to do more since our late loss, the longing is so strong for a DC2. My DD was a 5BB and my frozen transferable euploid is a 5BB. I’ve never made a higher grade out of 37 blastocysts (just counted them on my s/s). There is a good chance that one of those five in the freezer could become your longed for child. It’s not over so try to keep the faith. Your hormone levels probably aren’t helping at the moment either. Back to you saying you didn’t cry during the hard part of your loss, I didn’t either. I think it was survival mode and auto pilot.

@Gardenlady543 hope you have it mild. Take good care of yourselves.

@Loz2467 what has your consultant/surgeon said about the impact of the area (of adeno?) on implantation?

@Enfys23 have you chosen a new clinic?

@Dochas12111 any results back yet?

@2021ivfagain I’m really sorry to hear things have been tough and you find it difficult not to think in terms of ‘what if’. But honestly, 5 day 5 blasts left is really good odds, definitely all is not lost. As @Gardenlady543 said, age is much less of a factor when it comes to transfers, that why people have kids with egg donors in their late 40s and even early 50s, you can take it slow to ensure you can afford the transfer financially over time. I know that doesn’t change the visceral pain for the loss you just had or make it any better, but I promise you that will somewhat get easier over time.

@Gardenlady543 I’m so sorry to hear you caught Covid causing additional stress and worry to your delicate journey, I’m not sure if you had it before, but both times I had it, I felt really rough for a couple of days, but then got better so hopefully in a couple of days you won’t feel too ill anymore.

@Enfys23 thank you so much for sharing your story and perspective around siblings and friendships, that rings so true and the importance of friends. I’m really sorry to hear about your sibling ❤️

@Loz2467 I wish I had some advice to give, it’s so unfair, but indeed, I think you have done everything possible and you really deserve things to work out for you X

Thank you @clhiu

@2021ivfagain I really hope I didn’t come across harsh. Text on here is blunter than what one means sometimes ❤️. Thinking of you a lot at this horrendously difficult time.

@CailinInUK not yet. I feel I’m going to spend an IVF cycle’s worth of money getting initial consults to get a feel for clinics!! It’s impossible to find good info about what they are like really without trying them out. I’m lining up Dr Gudi at Fertility Plus next. Going to have to just find the money and find some way to do our cycle in London I think. We’ve not had a good gut instinct with our local tries.
Great news though that DH morphology went up to 9% on recent test! We think the change from 3 to 2 days abstinence and fact he’s been better about sugar and taking his vits has helped.

I hope so @clhiu somehow I've dodged Covid until now, there's a lot in the media about this new variant and how the vaccines doesn't work with it, although all 3 of my vaccines were back in 2021. Im just feeling lowsy, I'm a bit of an expert in long Covid which stresses me out as so many people statistically seem to get it and I really don't want that.

@CailinInUK They didn’t say. Last time they said “let’s go ahead with transfer” and then the same this time! They seem to think because it’s not in the cavity it won’t be a huge issue but it’s touching and impinging on my lining so surely it is. The down Reg hasn’t shrunk it - as far as I know it’s only good for diffuse adenomyosis. I just feel negative already going into transfer and thinking what’s the point 🥺

@clhiu thank you I have tried so much I can’t do much more.

@Gardenlady543 The Greek dr replied to my email and said it sounds like an adenomyotic cyst. Just wish I got pictures of the images now to send him. He said there is a new way some specialists will try and drain through a hysterscopy but depending how close to the cavity it is and again a big risk of scar tissue. He also said it’s best when it’s “inactive” but I don’t know how I will know that? It grows with my cycle and doesn’t have colour flow on the Doppler but I’m assuming it’s active if it’s growing!

@Gardenlady543 @CailinInUK @Enfys23 @clhiu @APSR

Thanks for your messages. What’s making it worse is still bleeding a bit which seems like a long time. I had an argument with my husband today and he said I was selfish for being so focused on having a second child. I suppose I want it more than him although he was in tears when we lost our baby at 8w 1d. I have always wanted a second child.

I suppose I had a bad experience with medicated FET at my clinic and felt absolutely ill. I would never have medicated again unless it was last resort. That is why I need to work hard to save for natural modified FET. Problem is finances are bad. I can’t work full time as look after my son most of the time. I will ask mother in law to look after him when I start teaching again later this month but she has raised concerns about me doing another transfer.

My own counsellor said I should ignore my mother in law but her comments cause arguments with my husband. My husband feels that as we have a lot on our plate the IVF process causes stress. My Dad may never come home again. One day after transfer he was rushed into hospital and then brought home and within a day brought into hospital again within internal bleeding. My mum is disabled and has carers. Our life is so stressful but still I long for my son to have a sibling as I remember what is was like for me but also I always wanted two children. I can’t help it.

It’s not that I don’t want to do more egg retrievals: I can’t. Firstly, my fsh is too high even being controlled egg quality is not good. I still produced blastocysts but not good quality. Secondly, I can’t afford it. Thirdly, my husband stopped supplements months ago; it would take 6-8 months to improve his morphology again.

I’m so annoyed at my clinic for cancelling my egg retrieval in September 2021 due to passport not renewed in time. I was getting it renewed but that was not good enough for my clinic. I was told wrong information as well and should have fast tracked it.

I have a follow up appointment tomorrow with consultant and he will be negative.

I have 5 day 5 blastocysts left but not PGS tested. The top b grades have gone.

@Gardenlady543 Hope you feel better soon. I had covid in March 2022 and it was the worst time as I was worried about my son getting it. He had not been exposed to it before. He was absolutely fine; I felt awful and had a bad cough, but my covid tests went normal quicker than my husband’s even though he did not suffer that much. Get rest as much as you can.

@Loz2467 can you contact the places you've had investigations and surgery to ask for images to send across, is it like endo where is estradiol that causes the activity and suppression helps?

@2021ivfagain I hope the bleeding stops soon, I think this will help you to move forward when your body goes back to its usual cycle. And sorry you've got all the family stress :( everyone seems to want to tell people what they should do in this situation, people would say to me I should stop, that it had been years with no implantation and I should accept a child free life, but in the end those people didn't need infertility treatment and had children, they didn't have to walk in my shoes, since I don't have children I didn't want to face a childless life. So how is the decision to stop anyone's decision but my own?

I'm still ill, nights are hard, my nose is blocked so I was mouth breathing and woke up with the sorest throat :(

@Gardenlady543 I'm sorry you’re feeling more poorly today. I hope it improves through the day.

@Loz2467 I am sorry things are no clearer. I’m due to have an MRI pelvis to assess my endo and whether there is adeno complicating things, and I’m freaked out I might find things are really bad.

I didn’t feel positive at all after my Manchester fertility consultation. They appeared dismissive about some things, as one example: saying lining varies from cycle to cycle and viagra doesn’t have good evidence (but given my lining has always struggled to get to 6-7mm and it only got to 8+mm with viagra….). Also didn’t seem to have any new ideas or perspectives on treatment of my DOR. Gut instinct wasn’t great, DH felt same after, and feel I’ll be back on conveyor belt with them as a clinic. Main positive with them would be localish, price, and 7 day procedures.

I'm feeling anxious about going with Dr Gudi as well though, mainly due to cost which would use all the money we got from the 3 cycle package refund, so we probably could only afford 1 cycle, maybe 2 max at a stretch in the future but would need to save again. It seems embryo transfers after the first one in a cycle is £3k a pop as well. It’ll also be a nightmare with work. So might need to take unpaid leave and rent a longer term Airbnb in London to make it work etc which also adds to cost. And actually is it better to just maximise the number of cycles I can do so go with a cheaper option. It’s all so hard.

@2021ivfagain it really is none of your MIL’s business.
This is something for you and your DH to work out. I’m so sorry to hear you had an argument. Is it worth having some counselling together on this?

I hate others sticking their beak in. After my 5th failed transfer now I’ve had people mention adoption and surrogacy to me. DH suggests I should sarcastically reply “goodness me, I’d never heard of this, could you tell me more about adoption”. Why do people think it’s any of their business.

@Enfys23 could you do a combination and bank embryos with Dr Gudi, then courier them to Manchester, my understanding is that Manchester specialises in natural FET?

@Gardenlady543 that’s definitely an option

@Enfys23 I’m sorry you’re going through this. I know that CRGH are expensive and communication is not always good, but their monitoring is excellent and so are the consultants. They use zomacton for hgh which helps follicles grow more and they also can improve lining thickness. They do Access Fertility packages. I think if you are 35 they do a lot of packages.

You did have 10 follicles last time so that is quite good. I think sometimes afc is a better indicator. Good news on your husband’s morphology.

I had quite a positive follow-up consultation. I need to have a 3d sis scan to check for any scarring before I can do another transfer.

@Enfys23 @Gardenlady543 @CailinInUK

I really don’t know what to do. I did ask my husband if he wanted counselling and he said no.

He said he never wanted to have a second child but he did say he was upset when we lost our second baby. Before the follow-up consultation, I said what do you want me to do? He said he doesn’t have a choice as he doesn’t want to waste our 5 blastocysts. We’ve come this far now but he hates the IVF process.

I just keep asking him what he wants me to do and he just says we have to do another transfer.

When I was pregnant, we agreed for my MIL to help out with my son when I am working in September as I teach online but there is a lot of juggling with looking after him and working. When I asked my husband about his Mum looking after my son, he said well that was when you were pregnant. My husband said the only reason you want my mum to look after our son is to earn more money for IVF.

I don’t know. I can’t win. I’ve never asked for help from my MIL before. My mum and dad are both disabled and I’m an only child and so is my husband so we don’t have a lot of people to help out. I have friends but they work.

My Mum’s cousin looks after her grandson every week.

It was only going to be once or twice a week until he can go to nursery. It’s not even long-term.

I’m sorry I’m just having a moan as I feel upset.

Thanks @2021ivfagain
I'm glad your appointment was positive. I’m sorry things sound so tricky with you and DH right now. It really sounds like he needs some counselling preferably with both of you.

@Enfys23 He said he’s fed up with the IVF process. He doesn’t want counselling. I’m having counselling but he’s different to me.

@2021ivfagain your husband is not being helpful with these unclear messages, saying he wants to keep going with the 5 embryos but then criticizing using for earning money to pay for it, uh yeah IVF is expensive, I didn't want to work full time throughout all my treatment but I had no choice if I wanted to keep going. I'm glad your consultation was good and the scan is a good idea, this is what I did after my chemical.

@2021ivfagain I agree with @Gardenlady543 and thats why I think even though he doesn’t want counselling it definitely sounds like he needs it. Wanting to continue because you have 5 embryos to use, but not wanting to and taking it out on you when you’re having to make plans to cover costs etc doesn’t compute. I hope he’ll see sense a bit once the pain from this loss settles a little for him. I don’t understand what he wants you to do and I’m sure you don’t either.

@2021ivfagain I'm so sorry for everything you are going through. I know I don't comment a lot but I did just want to say that my DP sounds very similar to your DH. He hated the IVF process, would have been happy with just one child but also felt trapped into transferring embryos once we had them. He was really angry with me for pushing him through it. It's not always logical but there was a lot of resentment and anger there. I think things are slowly improving now.

Yes it is very very hard being in that relationship - I basically did the whole journey alone, emotionally anyway. But my DP was also going through a tough IVF process and had the right to go through it in his own way. It's just a shame that his own way wasn't supportive!

I suppose I wanted to just say I have been in a similar position and send love.

@Twigg12 tagging you from the other thread in case you have questions to ask here about the micro biome x

@2021ivfagain sorry you’re having this issue with your DH on top of everything else. What your DH has said doesn’t make sense to me either. On the one hand he said you only want MIL to look after your son to earn money for IVF. Yet the previous plan was for MIL to look after him in Sept when you were pregnant and no longer needed IVF. Working is really difficult with a small child in the house. It was so hard for me when I returned to work after maternity leave in the middle of the pandemic when DC had to stay at home from nursery for 10 days every time she had a temperature. It was extremely stressful trying to be a good manager/employee and a good mum at the same time. So whether you would like MIL to look after your son to enable you to do a good job at work without being torn in two being a mum as well, or whether it’s to save money, both are very legitimate reasons and should be supported, not criticised. At the end of the day, it’s a shame that DH and MIL aren’t just supportive, it’s hard enough. Does you DH know that FETs aren’t IVf as such, and shouldn’t be as intensive or stressful, but I appreciate that it is not necessarily straightforward for you if you struggle with medicated and want to do modified natural.

@Gardenlady543 i just don’t think I’d go to that measure and go to Greece for surgery. I think I’d call it a day before that.

Im regretting not starting a lubion late last night. Just to give a touch of a head start especially with me being progesterone resistant and with adeno I’ve read that the window of implantation seems to be off - an extra day needed. But anyway it’s done now.

Does anyone know if being on depot lupron down Reg is meant to reset the ERA and implantation anyway.

Ive increased my pred to 15mg which I’ll do for 2/3 days then increase to 20mg.

Can I still take an oral probiotic daily?

I already feel like this cycle is doomed! Still a huge adenomyotic cyst in my lining / distorting it! Wish I’d started the prog sooner! :( I don’t even know how to keep going! I feel like I’ve done a lot for this cycle but I’m in such a negative head space.

@Loz2467 I really don't believe in the shifted implantation window, mine said I needed an extra 1.5 days and I just ignored it and it worked. I took a daily oral probiotic throughout and still do.

@Gardenlady543 thank you! I’m just so concerned because I don’t know how to move forward with that area :( if this one fails I’m asking to go straight into a modified natural as I believe that works better with endo / adeno patients. Although no endo it’s very similar. Plus if I do that it’s a longer window of implantation too compared to an FET and no artificial estrogen as such flaring the adeno. I guess I’ve tried a lot this cycle so I’ll just have to see what it holds but feeling hopeless already.

So sorry to ask again. What Predisolone can be empirically used? I’m still torn whether to up to 20mg on transfer day (which seems too late but I know some clinics do this) of follow the more experienced Dr about adeno patients and do the 20mg a few days before transfer?

I’ve heard it can be over used. I just don’t know what’s best.

@Loz2467 I think you’d need to ask your specialist as the decision on dose is a medical one. If you decide to up the dose yourself how will you ensure a supply to cover that dose?

For those who live/ have treatment in London, just wondered if you could let me know how you manage things with travel. I’m a real country bumpkin so completely unfamiliar. I’m thinking might need to get Airbnb place as wouldn’t be driving 5-6 hours each way to appt and especially around key times/ egg collection etc. Fertility Plus clinic where Dr Gudi works is on Harley St. I’m taking that might need to use the underground for travel. Have you done this to/from egg collection and felt okay? I try so hard to be scent free etc I’d be worried about being on public transport and someone spraying something or sitting on seat that leaves my clothes smelling (so unlikely but Sod’s Law and all that). Hope these aren’t completely stupid questions. Thanks for any advice you can give. Any advice however big or small on how one might manage things ( as I probably haven’t even though of some stuff) would be amazing.