ERA EMMA ALICE testing thread 9

[Gardenlady543]

@2021ivfagain @Enfys23 @clhiu @CailinInUK @Spin101 @Loz2467 @Mybabydream @Janefx40 @ChickenT2b @kerrym87 @Sar1010 @AM08 @thislittlebird @IVF22 @APSR
@Faithhopelove83 @KLM25 @VenusStarr
@BewilderedBee @Dochas12111 @seven201 @StillWishingHoping

We've maxed out the other one so here's thread 9 😊

Thanks for setting this up @Gardenlady543 hopefully thread 9 will bring some good news.

I have continued to have brown spotting. Occ a bit of a heavier spot with reddish tinge and a feeling my uterus is tender, mainly when wiping, other times barely anything at all, and never enough to wear a panty liner. Discussed with DH and we decided to do a HPT yesterday morning. Got a faint positive. Worried this will turn out to be a CP as faint on FRER at 8dp5dt seems ominous? I thought I’d be so much happier to see my first ever positive. Will wait to retest on OTD now (Wednesday) which will be 72h from last test. The spotting seems to have tailed off after 3 days but won’t speak too soon, might come back later. Do you think 40mg inhixa could make implantation bleeding more prolonged? I’m trying to be calm and positive but then I don’t know if the fall will be oh so much harder on Wednesday if it’s all over before it really started. This whole process is so hard and I know you ladies will get it. DH and I are both feeling really scared.

@Enfys23 is this the first test you've done this cycle? It's hard to tell from one test. I had a chemical in December that was my first positive ever and it was seen as a step forward. A lot of people say anecdotally that people seem to be more fertile after. It's so hard though.

@Enfys23 this is potentially exciting! Your first ever positive test. 8dp is still early and a faint positive could be fine at that stage. It is so hard waiting. I guess it's possible that the inhixa could lead to more spotting but spotting doesn't mean anything bad. Bleeding is always worrying in any form but actually is fairly meaningless. When I had my miscarriage I didn't bleed at all. I've had spotting in pregnancies. So it's one of those things that can mean something or nothing. Sorry if that doesn't help!

@Gardenlady543 yes I very unscientifically think that sometimes the body needs a practice run and had a chemical first. But there's no evidence to that.

Thanks for the support @Gardenlady543 @Janefx40
Yes first and only test so far. I didn’t want to test early and get anxious but when the spotting was getting more frequent (though spotting has now tapered off again) and I was worried it was heading into period but still wondering given timing if was implantation, we decided to test as it at least has given me a bit of hope for continuing meds and wait to Wednesday. I really hope it’s okay for 8dp @Janefx40 🤞🏼. It did show up within the 3 mins and definitely pink but needs some good light to see well 😕

Hi @Enfys23 I’m another who had some spotting in pregnancy but not in failed transfers. Are you planning to do a HCG blood test on official test day? This could be worth doing if tests are still positive but you’re worried about the spotting.

im going to join back in properly to this thread. For those who don’t know me I’m a long-standing member! Finally got my BFP and DD after 5 years, 6 rounds of IVF and after addressing the endometrium and a bunch of other stuff.

I’m going for a repeat Emma and Alice in 2 weeks to see what’s happening and then a saline scan/hycosy in September as apparently they need to be done in different cycles and am aiming for a FET in October/November.

For info, my initial ERA/Emma/Alice showed I should do a Day 6 transfer, my good bacteria was 0% and high in bad bacteria of strep and staph. Course of antibiotics and lots of probiotics and a repeat showed good bacteria was up to 75%. I kept taking probiotics and went ahead with transfer a few months later which worked.

Thanks for the tag @Gardenlady543

@Enfys23 ❤️ tentative congratulations. I'm keeping everything crossed for you.

Af arrived for me at 2.30am. I've been in touch with crp to say we're not doing more superovulation. And I've messaged our ivf clinic to get the ball rolling. Part of me wants to just stop now but I also need to see it through.

@Enfys23 a faint positive! This could be really fantastic for you- totally and completely understand your worry. But like others have said even if it is (which let’s pray it isn’t !!) a chemical, it could be a really really great sign that things are moving in the right direction for you. I’m glad to hear the spitting has tapered off for now- I’m sorry this must be such an intense time for you. Everytime you go to the bathroom it’s so scary- I’ve had two Cp so know how the bleeding is but both of mine became deep red blood super quickly. And I just had an instinct that whatever was sticking was not sticking anymore.

how are your other symptoms? Though let’s face it it’s probably too early to really judge by them too.

thank you for setting up a new thread @Gardenlady543 … how’s things for you? It’s just so amazing that after all this time you have finally got there!

hi @Dochas12111 i am newish here! I have had two failed FETS with euploid embryos, era emma and Alice picked up nothing except v low Lactobacillus and previously had two CP naturally over two years. It’s been just over 3 years in total and I’m 33 partner has low morphology and is 37. Just been seen by Bill Smiths from CDS who has confirmed pelvic endo and adenomyosis so I’m looking at doing at hycosy and a lap between now and end of sept.

How is everyone else doing?

@VenusStarr sounds like you have decided on a plan. Will keep everything crossed these rounds are the one for you. When are you planning to start IVF? I just looked back on the last thread. I’m so sorry your DH was so ill- I’m glad he is on the mend now. Hope you are both taking good care of each other as much as you can ❤️

@Sar1010 sorry to hear about your failed transfers. Hopefully your diagnosis means they can figure out what to do for subsequent transfers. Do you have any embryos left?

Thanks for add. @VenusStarr sorry to hear that How's your hubby these days?
Had emma/Alice last Wednesday, how long do results generally take? They did tell me but I've forgotten!😂

Thank you @Dochas12111 @VenusStarr @Sar1010 I am so glad I found all you ladies.

@Dochas12111 your story gives me such hope. Sending lots of luck for this next journey for you. If the positive stays for OTD then I will ask for blood HCG to be done, that’s a good idea.

@VenusStarr I know you were expecting it but I know it’s still hard. But I hope you’re feeling positive now about this next step. Glad you and DH are both on the same track with this. I appreciate so much your words the other day ❤️

@Sar1010 thank you. You’re right it’s a right head every time you go to the loo. I know when I had spotting in my first cycle it started 8dp5dt and progressed to period like bleeding by OTD, I was only on Cyclogest then ( I didn’t have any spotting on the others once Lubion added but they were all BFN too). I have symptoms only from the progesterone - bloating, weeing a lot, lots of pulling and twinges, sore breasts but had all these with my other failed transfers. I’m on a decent dose of pred too so know that’ll mask a lot if I do get any.

@kerrym87 mine took just under 2 weeks. Hope you get them asap

Thanks for tagging me @Gardenlady543

I hope everyone is ok. I’ve not been around much lately, struggling with being one of the minority of a minority who ivf fails for, I’m on another thread and it’s literally just me and one other left now, so I’ve stayed away. Was supposed to be trying again this month and have delayed it because I have a possible lump to get scanned, hopefully nothing, but I’ve had a surprise! fibroadenoma ten years ago so who knows. Also had a diabetes scare after my 40th birthday trip so I’ve lost some weight and will continue that this month leading up to the transfer month.

I’m struggling with job stuff and whether to move and give up my maternity package accrued (because there’s not enough financial penalties for the infertile!) for a new role somewhere else. I have an interview next week, not quite sure where my lines are in terms of job happiness vs money vs maternity benefits I may never use. I feel resentful that I may never get to have a baby or maternity leave, or if I have a baby I’ll not get the leave uplift everyone else in my industry gets. I’m quite bitter, I wanted to have a little family by now and instead I’m still stuck in this shitty limbo.

I know that being able to wfh and be remote has made me more content than I ever have been work/life balance-wise, if not brain-wise, and it’s helped me keep away from people during all this sadness too. I can’t decide if it’s better to move on and not worry about IF the ivf works, or stay put in case it does. It’s a lot of money to lose for average earners, but people cope on statutory all the time so I probably shouldn’t worry so much, especially since the most likely outcome is childlessness at our age.

Hi all,

Cheers for the tag @Gardenlady543 . May this thread bring more BFPs like the last thread.

@Enfys23 totally understand you may be really scared now. I’ve come across several people that have had faint FRERs and went on to a successful pregnancy. It’s just impossible to know right now. Do you get a hCG BT on Weds or another urine test? I had spotting with my successful pregnancy and during my lost pregnancy.

@VenusStarr – so sorry to hear of your mental health issues last year, you’ve been through a lot. Good to hear you and your DH are on the same page about future treatment, it helps. IVF probably gives you your best shot, though I’m conscious I don’t know how you got on in previous IVF cycles so apologies if this irks.

@clhiu – really sorry about the BFN but like you say it was your first superovulation cycle so hopefully one will stick soon.

Splitting my message in two as it’s sooo long!

Welcome back @Dochas12111 . I hope journey to DC2 will be more straightforward. How many embryos have you got frozen? Did you manage to completely eradicate the strep? I don’t know many people on here who also had Strep B. I had high levels of it, plus Prevotella Tim when I tested my vaginal microbiome following my late miscarriage. I was given IV antibiotics at the time of surgery (probably the cause of my high levels) but didn’t know to immediately use vaginal probiotics, and wasn’t advised. The bad aerobic levels have gone down since antibiotics and vag probiotics between first (Nov’22) and second test (Apr ’23) from 46% to 36% (Strep B) and 26 to 0% (Prev Tim). I’m unsure whether to try more antibiotics for the Strep B or just try to reduce pH and increase good bacteria (it’s improved from 0% to 52%, as of Apr 23). It’s difficult to fit in whilst doing back to back IVF, which probably disrupts everything anyway. Conscious that 25-33% of people have Strep B naturally and main issue is to be aware/manage at time of birth.

Bit of background from me (it’s long).
Doing IVF to avoid passing on a genetic condition from DH’s side. Never naturally tried for a baby as found out about the genetic condition shortly after getting married. After 1.5 year frustrating NHS wait, entered this in 2016 with no known fertility issues and all numbers looked good (three NHS funded cycles). Fast forward eight PGT-M cycles to bank some euploids. Sadly we initially had poor cycle management and a lot of bad luck with the 50:50 testing so most euploids were at risk and not transferable. Out of the two transferable, our first euploid FET in 2019 resulted in our DD (Very hands off FET. I did the ERA beforehand, which recommended an extra day of progesterone (only suppositories prescribed in those days at my clinic and I did no progesterone testing). Our second FET in Feb 2021 failed the thaw (5BC). Our first new cycle for DC2 in Apr 21 at age 42 and we got a low risk euploid! Sadly it was a biochemical (wish I took this transfer more seriously and tested/optimised everything endo/uterine in advance). Tried a modified natural stim cycle in Oct 21, which resulted in low numbers and low quality, same for the next antagonist cycle in Jan ’22. Back onto long protocol in March 22and amazingly at age 43, we got a low risk euploid. Heartbroken forever that this ended in a late missed miscarriage of my DS1 at 19.5 weeks in Nov ’22. Cause unknown. I started back (age 44) in March this year and have done three long protocol cycles so far: March ’23 – one euploid out of two tested, unfortunately at risk of condition, May ’23 – three blastocysts sent for testing, all aneuploid, July ’23…tbc. So, I’ve done 15 IVF cycles so far, which I know is bordering on stupidity and obsession. My time is seriously running out so I’ll carry on for a few more cycles and call it quits then, if no success. I’ll also do some cancer screening as although there’s no evidence I’ve come across, the effect of all these hormones on my body is a concern.

@Janefx40 if you have any advice for older ladies in terms of protocol or in general, I’d be very grateful! You are one of my inspirations.

Back to my July cycle, thanks for asking for me ladies.

My last update was that we got 5 mature eggs, which is less than the two previous cycles this year. Out of these, we sent one blastocyst for PGT-M testing on Saturday. It’s a Day 5 ‘hatching 22’ in our clinic terminology, aka a 5BB. Normally I would’ve been disappointed with getting only one to test but given the shocking news I had on Monday, it’s the best outcome we could’ve had. During the fertilisation call on Monday, I was told that only one of the five mature eggs fertilised normally. In all my 14 previous cycles, this step has never been an issue - I’ve always had between 67-100% fertilisation. Even my last two cycles this year at same age had 67% and 100% fertilisation, with slightly larger egg quantities. It seems it’s (unsurprisingly) down to egg quality as there was an attempt at fertilisation but the embryos were 3PN (instead of 2PN). I’m now terrified this will be the case for all future cycles. Another indication my time is seriously running out and my chances are so slim. Still waiting for period following EC but likely next stims is around mid-September.

Hope everyone else is doing ok.

I'm sorry @VenusStarr when do you think you'll be doing IVF? Have you ever see a RI before?

@Sar1010 I am doing ok, I had a lecture yesterday from a technician saying weekly scans are too much, but it's keeping me calm.

@kerrym87 about 3 weeks I think for results.

@thislittlebird yes I definitely feel the being a minority of a minority :( especially as a lot of the fertility world is established on so few people falling into this category. Ah sorry you're waiting on tests for the lump, I ended up having biopsies at the breast clinic twice in this journey :( work wise I've stayed where I am as I have legal protection having been in the role for over 2 years, I'm also mostly working from home and that has helped with all my treatment, I also have private medical insurance and if I started elsewhere I'd need about a year of service to get it, the maternity pay sucks though and is the bare minimum.

@CailinInUK I'm glad something was able to be sent for testing, did you do IVF or ICSI, if IVF maybe you could consider ICSI next time. What sperm processing did they use, I've found the sperm chip seems to work better than centrifuge.

@Gardenlady543 thank you. ICSI is a prerequisite for PGT-M to avoid possible contamination from more than one sperm and hence unreliable results. For my last three cycles, since I’ve been aware it’s been available at my clinic, I’ve added Zymot (sperm chip). No medical reason, it’s just a no-brainer. For £220 you get to improve sperm by significantly reducing the sample’s DNA fragmentation and also selecting the most motile. I’d recommend to all. My poor fertilisation result was just down to poor eggs. Hopefully it’s not the norm going forward for me :-/.

@thislittlebird good to hear from you but sorry it’s been really hard. I’ve put so many things on hold during this journey and isolated myself. Not lived fully at all but I’ve tried to do my best. That’s all we can do. Maybe you go could go to the job interview and see how you feel/what vibe you get. You may end up not liking the job/people or not be offered it. So decision would be easier.
Hoping your lump scan goes ok and all is clear.

@CailinInUK sounds like you're doing everything you can. Erg what bad luck, but let's hope this is a euploid low risk and then it will be good luck!

@Gardenlady543 Thanks for tagging me. Had a stressful morning with medication not arriving on time and having to order emergency medication from another chemist! My Dad is still in hospital so hopefully I will see him tomorrow. Last time, I don’t know if he even recognised me.

I’m starting to get worried about lack of symptoms.

@CailinInUK I’m sorry about the fertilisation. As you know, I had bad luck with egg collections after 40.5, but also we did IMSI to maximise chances which is an advanced form of icsi. BB grade is really good. I’m keeping my fingers crossed for you.

@Enfys23 Cautious congratulations. I think brown spotting can be normal. Can you book your hcg and progesterone blood tests on 12 or 14 days past transfer?

@Dochas12111 Good luck with next steps.

@Spin101
How’s it going? Have you got blood tests booked?

@Gardenlady543 yes, I've been under Dr Shehata for nearly 3 years. I've not conceived naturally since being on immune meds, but had had 2 ivf pregnancies.

Thanks @kerrym87 he's doing a lot better thank you. He does still have liver damage but they're just monitoring his levels now. Hopefully no more surgery.
My results took 8 days. Hope you're not waiting too long.

@thislittlebird good to hear from you. I completely know the feeling of being the last one. We've been ttc 6 years in November and I genuinely couldn't tell you how many threads I've been on and how many people have had their babies (and some even have their second and third now) but it's a lot. It's really difficult ❤️ I'm 40 next month too. Its hard not to feel resentful at this crappy hand we've been dealt. I'm definitely of the mindset of finding things that give you joy, so if moving jobs would facilitate that, you should. Life has been on hold for too long.
You definitely sound in a similar place to me at the moment, were giving it one last go but then it'll be a childfree life for us.

@Enfys23 thank you.

Thanks @CailinInUK I'm giving up with natural ttc now, it's just not going to work for us. Our last ivf round was a disaster though, but I feel like I need to just see if we can even make embryos anymore (we didn't last time). And then I'll know there's no more to try for us.
Keeping everything crossed for this embryo.

How are you @clhiuAre you going straight into another superovulation cycle?

Thank you @Dochas12111 with my mental health and then dh's physical health issues, we'll have pretty much lost a year ttc, not including the 9 months we spent last year trying to get to transfer our last embryo. Not ideal at our ages but there's nothing we can do now.
Good luck with trying for number 2.

Not in a hurry to go back to ivf to be honest, it'll likely be November time I would think. Xx

@VenusStarr that's a shame about hubby's liver; it is the only organ really that can regenerate properly so hopefully monitoring and over time it might improve x

@thislittlebird I was in the same position re work - in the end I decided to do what was easiest to facilitate me doing ivf which was stay in my current job wfh and where I’d already told work i was getting treatment but I promised myself if it didn’t work in the end I would throw myself into my career and do what I wanted. I saw my job as a means to an end to do ivf - money and facilitating treatment and that helped make it easier for me to stay when I wasn’t happy. I’m sorry you have not had success so far. What is your history?

@CailinInUK we actually interacted in rollercoaster back in the day. Don’t worry about the 3PN - I had this with eggs on my 2nd round and we got nothing fertilised and no embryos. It didn’t happen for rounds 3-6. So it was a blip and hopefully same for you. I’m so sorry for the loss of your DS.

I have 3 embryos but not confident about them. 1 is a PGS normal but it was biopsied twice due to no result and so frozen defrosted a lot too. I read a paper saying changes of success go down from 54% to 30% in this scenario for pregnancy no data on live birth as it’s so rare. The double biopsy means it’s missing a lot of cells which worries me. The 2nd is same re multiple biopsies and defrosted/re freezing but is also a low level mosaic for Trisomy 1. The 3rd is an untested day 6 embryo and again success rates are alot lower for day 6. Part of me thinks I should just park them and if my AMH and DH sperm are still ok (we’ve low AMH, low sperm high DNA frag) just do a new round but like you I worry about cancer risk.

yes antibiotics and high dose probiotics got rid of the strep and staph. If you’re taking antibiotics I’d definitely be taking high dose probiotics. I know what you mean re rounds reinfecting. Once we did the repeat and saw 75% we had no more interventions until transfer and that also meant total abstinence for me and DH.

@VenusStarr November sounds like a good plan. Some more time to just recuperate for you and DH but not too far away given your concerns about age. Will be hoping so much for you guys that it works.

@2021ivfagain thank you. I hope you see some improvement with your dad and that you are feeling ok.

I really hope this blast comes back ok for you @CailinInUK 🤞🏼. The clinic don’t do HCG bloods as a norm. So I guess if things pan out that way then I can ask or do medichecks though I don’t fancy a wait either if that happens. I still am hesitant to raise my expectations too much.
@2021ivfagain can you increase dose of progesterone this late if it is low on bloods do you know?

@CailinInUK what a journey you’ve had! I was so sad to read about your loss at 20+ weeks. The physical and mental toll this journey has on on us is beyond comprehensible. I really hope this embryo comes back as a transferable euploid for you!

Much love to everyone else. I’m hoping for good news for all of you in the coming months x

@Gardenlady543 thank you for creating a new thread!

@2021ivfagain I’m sorry to hear about your dad, you’ve got a lot on. I ordered some kits from medichecks. Wish I ordered them sooner as I’m not waiting for them and I won’t get results until end of the week I imagine. My scan is booked for next week 6+2. Feels ages away! Have you done any bloods?