ERA/ALICE/EMMA testing thread 2

[seven201]

Link to the old thread
https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/infertility/4187520-era-testing-after-multiple-implantation-failures-anyone-had-it-done?msgid=110302437&utmsource=mentions&utmmmedium=email&utmcampaign=2020-10-19&utmmterm=You+have+been+mentioned+in+a+post&rei=438192#110302437

Welcome to the new thread. Anyone welcome.

@Gardenlady543 you're having such a rough time. Glad the leg cramps and aches have eased. I've had that before and it's pretty awful. Hope the dizziness passes too! How long do you take the viagra for? X

@Gardenlady543 oh gosh that sounds bad. The aches must be bad enough but the low bp must be a worry. My doctor was worried it would raise my already high bp. I didn't know you could get vaginal ones. Do you think you could just insert it vaginally instead, like the estrogen tablets? Maybe call your clinic on Monday and see if there's anything they can do to help.

@Janefx40 it's just from CD1 for 7 days, so last day is Wednesday. 

@seven201 I'm not sure, the vaginal viagra people use elsewhere is in oil. As far as I can see you can't get vaginal viagra in the UK. I've seen some people mention using r oral one vaginally. I could call my clinic on Monday and ask. I guess they may not know though.

@Gardenlady543 I have to take viagra until the day before transfer. Although in the past when I've run out a bit early my clinic haven't been bothered. Have you had another counselling appt yet? I hope it was better.

@Gardenlady543 I used to take viagra. It’s pretty awful. Would give me chest pain and dizzy feeling after taking it. Sorry ur feeling so rubbish . I don’t think vaginal is available here I looked into it….

@Cream123 and @seven201 did you both use to take it from CD1? I've only got 7 days of it and all it's done so far is extend my period. Normally I get 1 day of full flow and then a bit of spotting, it eased in flow after the first 2 days but I'm still getting some flow and it's CD4 which is so unusual for me.

I'm taking regular paracetamol for the aches and feel nauseated. Argh why are FET meds so horrible, with my 2 mock cycles this is now the 5th time I've taken them. I'm lucky I'm working from home and have a pretty laid back job, because there is no way I'd cope at work otherwise.

I have a 2 week break so due to speak to the counsellor this Friday. I hope it goes better as well!

How is everyone else doing?

@whatcangowrong how are you feeling?

Hey everyone.

@Gardenlady543 sounds like viagra is not the dream, sorry for you. Not too much longer to go and then onwards to transfer. Glad to hear you're able to rest and take things easy. My work is so full on at the moment, it doesn't help if I'm feeling crap but equally I don't get a chance to wallow in misery which is probably good.

@VenusStarr hope that you're sleeping better and not feeling too anxious. Have you had a second hcg draw?

@Dochas121 are you still on track for transferring this week?

I'm feeling fine. Weirdly detached and not upset, probably shows how over it I am! I am now back to weird optimism that my next transfer might work even though all my failures this year would suggest it won't. Will be a double, I don't think there's much risk of twins somehow!!

Had a basic high swab done last week just coz gynae said would I like to, which said no nasties and normal lactobillus now, but I wonder if the canesflor is just sitting there waiting to be swabbed..?

If I don't get anywhere this time I will run into Christmas closures I assume, was it @Janefx40 that that is happening to? Would like to maybe look at switching to Create but wonder if there will be a waiting list. The good thing about my clinic is I can always start when I want. Although I think I'm being told that this next cycle would be too soon after last collection to collect again :( so then with Christmas it'll be late January, ugh. I'm hoping to talk my doctor into doing a collection this next cycle but with much much lower drugs as an experiment to see how I respond, I feel we really need to target quality given these abysmal PGT results and you do read about high doses (450 for me always) don't do the eggs any favours. Any thoughts on this? I've generally been able to run FETs and cycles together pretty much without stopping and I hate feeling like we are not working on anything at any point...

@Gardenlady543 I’ve used it in 4 cycles and it varied each time. But usually started it day 4/5 of period and I think I took it twice a day.

Oh that's interesting @Cream123 it sounds like the last few days I've been taking it has been for nothing then. Oh and to make matters worse I'm now vomiting!

@whatcangowrong I'm glad you're feeling ok. I know it's not the same thing but my abnormal embryo was the one that would have been transferred next and I was glad to know I saved myself a cycle that definitely wouldn't have worked.
That's good about the swab, I thought the same when mine came back with lactobacillus. You could get the pH testing sticks I mentioned, if the pH is ok then you should be fine. It's the lactobacillus that make the pH acidic.
Did you chat with your clinic about a double transfer. Your transfer is planned for a week tomorrow is that right?

@Gardenlady543 sorry the viagra is being such a pain to you. I have to take it from baseline scan (cd2-4) twice a day until day before transfer, so quite a while. For me it's headaches that are the worst but they do settle after a few days usually, although not always (could be the estrogen too though).

@whatcangowrong well done for focusing on your upcoming transfer. You just never know, it could be 'the one'. I'm no expert but finding a clinic that focuses on egg quality does sound like a good idea. Good about your swab result.

Hi @whatcangowrong thanks for asking. Clinic originally did suggest a second beta before we started the FET but they didn't say anything last week and I've not pushed it as I think it will cause me more anxiety. I've had a horrible hungover feeling all day and been alternating between dizzy and sea sickness. Didn't sleep that well again so napped this afternoon and woke up feeling worse. But I'm taking that as a positive sign.

With regards to Create, I found they have fit us in quickly both for my fresh and FET and we've been able to get our reviews in with our doctor quickly (one week after the chemical and one week after out endometrio results). I've only done one cycle with the bemfola, so can't compare to different meds or higher doses. They're open 7 days so I found they waited until I was ready to schedule egg collection and transfers rather than their timetable.

I felt detached from this transfer too ❤️ its hard going x

I'm so sorry that you're having such a rough time @Gardenlady543 I hope the side effects stop as soon as you come off the viagra xx

Hope everyone else is doing OK. X

Hi everyone! @whatcangowrong yes it's me running into Christmas closures although I think maybe I've made my leave with it now. At least I can eat normally at Christmas and not be in 2WW hell. I haven't heard back from the consultant as yet but unless he overrides the nurses decision on timings, there's nothing I can do other than wait.

@Gardenlady543 sorry about the viagra hell. Is there any alternative to take for a similar result?

[quote Gardenlady543]@VenusStarr that user was IVFbeenbusy and then IVFgottwins and now I'm pretty sure she is tigerwhocametotea (not sure of the exact username)!

@whatcangowrong don't worry about hijacking the thread lol, I'm always going off topic, I think this thread has become more of a complicated journey thread over time, which is good because whenever I'm in the monthly treatment thread I seem to be one of the only ones who has no luck each time. There is so much knowledge here on implantation failure and recurrent losses and it's good to have ongoing contact with people having tests etc as the gap between transfers is often very long.

Thanks @Janefx40 I'm really interested to listen and see if anything gets cited that I haven't read yet! [/quote]

Yes that's me 😂

Lol @tiggerwhocamefortea , still disappointed that you're not 3 different people with Create twins.

Can I ask... before you tried lowering the meds etc, had you tried the usual high doses? I've been on 450 and tried various drugs all at this dose, but appear to be producing rubbish eggs.
Weirdly we make good ratio of blasts, every time it's been 50% of the eggs collected. So until now I assumed my egg quality was still holding on.

@Gardenlady543 sorry to hear that medication is so rough. Can you stop taking it or they really think it will help with your lining?

@whatcangowrong yes I’m over in London now. Transfer is tomorrow. I also feel weirdly detached this time! Even on plane over I was like need to get my head in the game and focus on this transfer then I thought but do I really. What good will worrying do. I am taking my vitamins, taking my meds, I went to acupuncture and booked back in on Wednesday, I’m not having any alcohol, I’m having one coffee a day and I’m eating way too much chocolate but it’s too late now to do anything about that. We’re going for a nice Italian tonight and working in the hotel today.

Re Create I would recommend a consultation with them. I did one prior to moving to lister as I was also interested in the success of ivf been busy etc. They actually said for me they would do a protocol of 150 of bemfola and that’s why at they would recommend so if I want to do that I can do that with my own clinic I don’t see any added benefit of being with Create. I know ivf been busy had a protocol of alternate days of Stims and tamoxifen but they said that protocol wouldn’t apply for me. So before moving clinic it would be worth seeing what they recommend for you as the natural ivf with low Stims can technically be done anywhere if your consultant is on board. Mine in lister said we could do it if needed.

I felt the same as you before my transfer @Dochas121 strangely detached. As long as you're doing your meds etc that's the most important thing.

Thanks for popping over @tiggerwhocamefortea 🙂

Have a good day all x

We just added in the viagra to try and help the lining, I did 4 days out of the 7 but I'm going to stop now. The vomiting last night was horrendous, my throat is burning still from the acid. And with the muscular aches, low bp and lack of sleep. I don't think it's worth it. I still have 3 days left so if needed it sounds like I can use them later in the cycle. It doesn't sound like I benefited from having it at the start of the cycle anyway.

Good luck @Dochas121 I think feeling detached is a good thing, in my last FET I was so sure it was going to work, it was a huge come down when it didn't. This time I don't know how I feel.

@VenusStarr ha fingers crossed this could be the one that works for me too!

@Gardenlady543 I think you are right to stop. Sometimes we forget about ourselves in our all consuming quest to get pregnant. When I had that slight cancer scare my husband and I both really took stock of how I’m putting my body through so much as someone who was perfectly fit and healthy with no medical issues four years ago I’m now nearly 2 stone heavier, bloated, stressed and have pumped myself full of hormones and medications and gone under sedation at least 12 times. I don’t even want to Google how bad that probably is for me! If viagra is an add on hopefully it won’t make or break success.

Take care of yourselves ladies!

@Dochas121 I completely agree with that, as I was having a sleepless night last night feeling unwell I realised that I have basically made myself unwell.

In the last year I have been through 6 cycles of treatment (1 fresh cycle, 3 FETS, 2 mock cycles), a hysterosalpinogram, a hysteroscopy where my cervix was operated on and 4 endometrial biopsies.

When I'm on the medications I am so unwell, I'm allergic to one of the medications and the other makes me vomit. If I was doing this because I thought it would work then it would be ok. But i don't know if it ever will. I think I'll see how this cycle goes and then have a think about things.

@Gardenlady543 I am so sorry you've been so unwell, it definitely sounds like the right decision to stop the viagra.
I was chatting to my friend on Saturday about ivf (she didn't know we'd done it and doesn't know that we transferred this one) but talking about everything that is involved, the meds, the trauma, the weight gain etc really hit home just how much its taken over everything. You do balance it eith 'well if it works it's all ok' but is it really? Like you @Dochas121 I'm hugely overweight now, bloated, sick and tired. It's very hard. X

@Dochas121 yes perhaps I will do that re Create. It's a bit annoying they make you have the ultrasound appt as well as I'm not really in the mood for spending a whole load more money just on a scan when I have had so bloody many scans already including 2 in the last week 😒. I have an appointment with another doctor actually just to sense check the approach and because I understand she's more open to immunes and other strategies generally...

I hear you all regarding whether it's really all worth it at the expense of other things or not. Different perspective and more trivial than health factors but I realise I've really lost my mojo socially. Came home to me to see via Instagram 3 friends that I introduced out together for Halloween and not even mentioned to me 😢 they all know I'm massively in the thick of all this at the moment and that I would have said no anyway but I guess it's a new level that I'm not being asked anymore!

@whatcangowrong

I never went as high as 450 - my top dose was 225 Bemfola daily and that got me 14 eggs each time but rubbish quality. With natural modified IVF I dropped to 150 every other day

@Dochas121

My tamoxifen/ Bemfola protocol wasn't initially recommended for me either. I actually wanted to do a straight natural IVF round ie no drugs at all as was running low on money after my previous 2 failed short protocol rounds. The clinic then said if you want to go down that route try natural modified instead x

@Dochas121 good luck for today.

@Gardenlady543 good decision stopping the viagra.

@whatcangowrong sorry about your friends and Halloween. That must hurt.

The crap we put ourselves through!

Yes good luck for today @Dochas121 !

I hate Halloween anyway, over it now :-)