Anyone doing IVF at 40+ pt 2

[lucymills1234]

Setting up a new thread as the old one was nearly at the limit.

@Anxiousbuthopeful
@Islandstars
@Woodcottage1
@Unicorn9
@SerenditySunshine

@lucymills1234 wow what a great result! 10 out of 12 is such a high fertilisation, really hope you'll get some good blast from this.

My scan was a bit mixed today, not sure what to think. Dr has suggested cycle may have to be cancelled as 1 follicle is way ahead and the main group is behind. All depends on my day 8 scan. Am just a bit confused as i've had this in most cycles, always 1 or 2 follicles racing away, but i've never been told i may have to cancel before. Hoping the Dr was just being a bit negative/cautious and that things look better on Saturday. I think only around 7/8 follicles were seen. Feels like my body is giving up on IVF. My last round in January i got 7 eggs, compared to 11 both times previously.

As we didn't ever intend to consider IVF, I don't know a huge amount about how the process works.

What happens once eggs have been collected? They are fertilised and then what? How do they tell if it is a good quality egg?

@lucymills1234 that is really fantastic numbers. Wishing this is the one for you.

@IslandStars hoping you don't get cancelled and they are just being cautious.

I am still very new to this forum and new to ivf. I am getting some comfort from reading this board as was feeling very isolated. Does anyone else have any tips to staying calm? My poor husband is upset but I think me being so anxious is not good for anything.

So far we have paid for lots of tests urologist consultation for hubby and had the consultation with Care where I found out they could only see 2 follicles, my right ovary was small with no follicles and Ahm pmol was 1.3. I know they only have a job to do but I felt absolutely devastated. I think as my NHS test for FSH and LH were good and my GP was super positive I am in shock. I wish I knew more about Amh and looked into private tests at the time.

I am looking at other clinics now. I know a few people mentioning Create they are about 2 hours drive from me so I am investigating Nurture as well who are more local. I know people travel abroad for ivf aswell. My fear is as I don't have the follicles I will get cancelled straight away and will be wasting my money. I am trying to be positive on the things I can control. Taking COQ10 and tomorrow I start accupuncture.

@lucymills1234 wow sounds positive. Praying for you.
@IslandStars we've just had Creates marketing team contact with big discounts off initial consultation and scan. Didn't feel right. It's put my partner off them unfortunately. We shall see

Thank you, and sorry to hear about your scan as that must be really frustrating @IslandStars. Your follicles obviously respond to meds but I really don't know what they can do (if anything) about the pacing... Did they suggest anything which might help redress the balance? I read somewhere on here that a protein-rich diet might help follicle growth but I've no idea whether that's got basis in science or just a suggestion... Hopefully, as you say, things will look better on Saturday. A growth spurt is definitely possible!

@kirinm there are lots of guides online that can give you a proper, full overview of the process far better than I can and I always think it's worth saying that as useful and informative as these forums can be, there are probably few if any actual Drs on here so remember they give as much (probably more!) opinion than fact. But, as a quick rundown: the day eggs are collected, they are put with the sperm. The next day (which is called day 1) the embryologist will look for signs of fertilisation and usually give you a call to say how many fertilised. By day 2, they will be looking to see whether cells have started to divide. By day 3, embryos should have a certain number of cells (I won't say what the ideal range is because I can't remember for sure!). That process continues on day 4, basically more and more cells are seen. On day 5, they are looking to see if the embryo is becoming a blastocyst - it's hard to describe a blastocyst but there are loads of images online. Basically the individual cells are no longer distinguishable, there's one big sort of 'fizzing' blob of them! Your blastocyst might start 'hatching' which means breaking out of the outer shell that's been containing all those cells, but that doesn't always happen before transfer. The embryologist will be looking at the embryos during those 5 days of development and checking for certain things such as whether there are any signs of fragmentation, and based on their observations they'll give the blastocyst a grade which consists of two letters - e.g. BC, AB etc with A the best. It's always worth checking your own clinic's grading system as it can vary.

@Scrumpy10 thank you! As for trying to stay calm, it depends what works for you but some people like the Mindful IVF app, if you are into meditation or willing to try it. You do have to pay, I think. Generally I find the suggestions are the same for any kind of anxiety - exercise, distractions etc. IVF can feel really tough and really lonely, but there are definitely places like this forum where you see there are more people struggling than you encounter in your day to day life. Take care.

@Lulu106 i am looking into natural modified / mild ivf having done 2 rounds of normal ivf mostly because in my first and second rounds they have given me a very high dosage of medication (probably because i have low amh, 2.7), and although in the first round i had 4 eggs and they managed to increase that to 11 in the second round, in both rounds the embryos (4 and 9 eggs fertilised) developed a high degree of fragmentation by day 3, which means that only 2 in the first round and 1 in the second made it to blastocyst. So although my egg recovery rates are not bad at all based on my amh levels, i'm not sure if the high levels of stimulation could be partly to cause for the high levels of fragmentation - of course it could always just be down to shonky egg quality.....my partner's sperm quality is apparently gold star (i wish they wouldn't be quite so effusive!) so unfortunately i can't blame him. i really like my current clinic and i signed up for 3 cycles with them, so i think i'll have a talk with the consultant about focusing on quality for the final round and see what they say. if they want to maintain the same approach, then i might get a refund on my final round and give it a go with either create or the lister also seems to do a mild / natural ivf as well.

my single blastocyst from my second round is currently going through pgt testing so all fingers crossed that it beats the 1 in 5 odds and comes back ok to transfer!

@99pctpractice thanks for sharing. I had a call this evening from Create's marketing team with heavy discounts for initial consultation. Made us very suspicious. Our issue was 6 embryos not growing to blastocyst on day 5. My partners sperm is poor quality so we went with ICSI. However, although they collected 18 eggs they may not have been good quality I suppose. We are just trying to work out what we would do next. Whether Mild IVF is right for us is still difficult to determine.

Thanks @lucymills1234 I will definitely read up but that is a helpful summary. I didn't know what the grading meant.

@lucymills1234 glad to hear the egg collection and fertilisation went really well. That's such a good number and an amazing fertilisation rate. Is it day 3 you get your next update? Fingers crossed x

@Lulu106 gosh, 18 eggs! I can see why you want to look at other alternatives - I think I found the period between egg collection and transfer a lot more stressful than the 2ww because of all the uncertainty around whether there’s be anything to transfer at all.

i totally get that an immediate offer of a discount is quite off putting. If you’re near the lister, maybe worth speaking with them because they do both ”normal” and mild / natural ivf. So perhaps they might be a bit more impartial about what would work best for you? They also have quite a lot of information on their website, comparing success rates etc, which you might find useful (I’m still always a bit sceptical of the numbers because you don’t know how they have calculated them…..)

@IslandStars Thanks, this it's just one of those things. I've heard of cycles being cancelled for poor response, but wouldn't have put myself in that category. Seems i have a weird, uneven response! Dr said there's nothing i can do about it. I do follow a high protein/lower carb diet in general, even outside of IVF.

I did ask if an increase in stims would help, but he just said that would make the fast growing follicle grow even more, which makes sense. Just hoping the rest catch up.

@Lulu106 I didn't even know they had a marketing team as such who did that, i never got the call after my initial webinar. Wish they would ring me now with a discount given the amount i've spent on them lol.
In all seriousness though, you can only go with a clinic who feel 'right' for you.

@lucymills1234 WOW, so happy for you, fingers crossed for your next update. Thank you for your reassuring words....

Just a quick update, I have finally had my period after nearly 5 weeks of Buserilin injections to down regulate, my scan is booked for Tuesday so I'm hoping my lining will be thin enough for me start Stims, this process seems so long I just want to move onto the next stage.

What a great result @lucymills1234! I actually had my egg collection on Thursday, so one day behind you. 60% of my eggs were immature though, which has really annoyed me to be honest!

Fingers crossed your blasts continue to develop.

Morning ladies, scan today showed improvement, so I am responding, just a bit slower. Dr doesn’t recommend cancelling, as I’ll hopefully have 7 follicles. The big one will be lost though sadly. On my last cycle in January, I had 7 eggs, 6 fertilised and I got 4 blasts, so Dr is leaning towards quality rather than lots of eggs. 3 follicles are already mature enough, I just need 4 to grow more until Monday.

Dr did say this growth pattern could be random or age, but as I got 7 eggs in January, down from 11 twice in the previous year, I think more age. Think I do need to be realistic that at nearly 43, the aim needs to be 1 or 2 blasts as I’ve seen many women younger than me on here not get that many.

@Longgame21 just see your update on the other thread. Hopefully you get better news throughout the week and have some top quality blasts from this round.

@IslandStars great news. This could be it. Did they transfer after each cycle or are they looking at the best blasts after 3 collections?
Keeping positive for you. My aunt told me I was clinically depressed today. I think she's right. This has flawed me.

Thank you @LouScot @TB1976 !

@Longgame21 sorry to hear that you had quite a few immature eggs, but you still have some in the running so everything crossed for your updates, keep us posted.

@IslandStars that's great that things have moved on and you're still set for collection - when is that set for? I had 12 eggs first time, 18 eggs second and now back to 12 again but my highest fertilisation rate, so I have given up trying to predict IVF!

If you get good quality though, and it seems you do as you've had good numbers of blasts before, I think you have every reason to hope for a couple of blasts this time. Though I know the fear hangs over you until you have the actual result.

I had a day 3 call today. Of my 10 which fertilised, 1 showed abnormal signs so is out of the running. The remaining 8 are all doing well apparently, they're more than 6 cells and the embryologist said they are looking top tier. But, they stressed that the riskiest bit comes next because the embryo starts driving development rather than the egg.

I hope I'll end up with something to transfer on Monday (day 5) but I know it's still a long way from certain.

Thanks ladies, I feel a bit more positive today. Think I was basing a lot on my first 2 cycles when I responded better, but they were a year ago now and whilst I’ve always responded better than my average for my age, I obviously shouldn’t keep taking that as a given.

@Lulu106 Hope yo can get some support & help. Once you’re with a clinic there will be counselling available, but you could always reach put to GP. Some people have workplace healthcare schemes too where you can access helplines confidentially.

This round is a fresh transfer for me. On my previous 3 cycle package it had to be freeze all for PGS.

@lucymills1234 Great that 8 are doing well, I was thinking your day 3 is tomorrow. Presuming some drop off according to the stats, you could end up with a really good number of blasts.

Do they give a provisional time for ET? Never done one before so was wondering how that works, am hoping they don’t just give you a time on the day!

@IslandStars that sounds really positive. Sending good vibes your way.

@lucymills1234 hi, does it mean you would not be testing your embryos as you are about to have a fresh transfer, if you don't mind me asking, why? Sorry if you have already said, it's a really long thread and I find it difficult keeping up.

Hi @IslandStars I'm not sure if it's the same everywhere, but my clinic don't give a provisional time for transfer. They call in the morning to confirm if there's anything suitable for transfer and then give you a time. It would obviously be a nice problem to have but logistically it's a bit of a nightmare, I have a day stacked with meetings tomorrow and trying to explain at the last minute that I can do some but not others is going to be difficult...

@Keyu My financial circumstances are looking uncertain, and I don't know what I'm going to be able to afford to do and when (the original plan was freeze this lot, do another EC then test everything). I might not be able to do another EC at all but don't know yet. So on that basis I thought a fresh transfer would at least be progress of some sort...

I got a day 4 update this morning and all 8 have moved to morula stage. 3 are looking poorer quality so may or may not improve. They said the other 5 are all looking top tier at the moment.

I hoped for a healthy, chilled weekend leading up to transfer and instead I've been full on with a work project so stressed, inactive and I've not eaten really badly but not as healthy as normal. Really not ideal.

@lucymills1234 fantastic that 5 are looking top tier! Also good luck with the work project.

@lucymills1234 Thanks for the info, I’ll have to ask tomorrow what my clinic do. Sounds like a nightmare to not have a time planned, that will just make me more anxious not knowing if and when I’ll be called in, plus factoring in time to get to the clinic.

Great news you have 5 top quality looking good though. Hopefully they keep growing well overnight. Best of luck for tomorrow, don’t worry about not eating so healthily today, between EC and ET it’s not that bad, plus you’ve done all you can at this stage really and it’s looking promising.

@IslandStars yes, I have meetings all morning so when they call to say whether there'll be a transfer or not I'll have to somehow instantly drop out.... and make sure I mute myself so I don't out myself to colleagues!!

My diet's not been horrendous, I'm sure it'll be ok. I find it really odd that my clinic doesn't check your progesterone at any point and they've not checked whether my estrogen has dropped since the heights of last week either. Seems very hands-off!

Is it another scan for you tomorrow or is this EC already? Lots of luck if it is!!

Thanks @Scrumpy10 ! How did you find your acupuncture? I've never done it but a lot of people swear by it.

@lucymills1234 hope they call early so you can plan your day as quickly as possible. My clinic do bloods after each scan, but post EC I don’t think there are any further bloods, so does worry me too. Apparently we should produce enough progesterone naturally for a fresh and pessaries should maintain that. I guess you could ask for bloods tomorrow to see if you can convince them to check, I may try that too.

Just a scan for me tomorrow, thanks. Hoping enough follicles to trigger.

Good luck today @lucymills1234! Try not to worry too much about diet etc, it will have minimal impact at this stage.