Rumples IVF/ICSI thread continued

[lildottie]

Our thread was originally started by Rumples who now has her bfp, as have a few other ladies along the way. Here's hoping the next thread holds a few more bfps!

Shell Saw consultant yesterday which went relatively well. Gutted that my antral follicle count is 9 (the AMH level I forgot to write down!) which he said was on the lower side of average for being 35. Gave us odds of 45-50% success rate with IVF. On cd 13 today, will ring clinic on first day on AF, start down regulation on cd21 of that cycle. Estimated ET week starting 20th July. So, like you just trying to be healthy, upping protein more and keep taking supplements. Think I'll join one of the other IVF threads when I get going so best of luck for your next round. Will keep popping in to see how you're going :)

non just remember it only takes 1! and its all pot luck anyway. I have a really high amh and still only ended up with 2 embryos of good enough quality to put back.

shell I can't believe how quickly your next round has come around. I don't suppose its been quick for you of course! any sign of the witch yet?

Oh Non, i remember how gutted I was when I discovered my low ovary reserve. But even if you only produce 4 mature eggs at 35, you really do have a better chance at success than an older woman who produces more.

If it's any reassurance, I read a study on women who did not produce many eggs. The eggs were tested and a certain number were found to be genetically normal. The women then repeated IVF with a higher dose of drugs and even though the made more eggs, the genetic testing showed that their was still only the same number of normal ones. They said the top quality eggs are the first eggs to mature that your body is naturally trying to produce. So it doesn't matter if women produce 4 eggs or 10, they are still likely to end up with 1-2 top quality eggs. And that's what happened here with lildottie and her high AMH yet still 2 good embryos and me and my shockingly low 2.5 AMH and only 3 eggs, yet still 2 top quality embryos.

Yes lil, not so quick for me! The witch has shown up but I'm a bit confused as to what is day one. Normally I just wake up to bright red blood so it's very clear, but of course the cycle I start IVF and need to know exactly when day 1 is, it goes funny. I had a day of darker blood yesterday which I never normally have, but it was no lighter than my usual period, then in the evening it turned more red with more red blood today. So who knows. I am supposed to start Puregon on day 2 which I have decided to make tomorrow.

Thanks for the reassurance, it does make me feel better and more confident :) I've opted for the additional endo scratch and embryo glue to pay for as nhs funding does not cover these. Might as well throw everything in! Any advice/tips for endo scratch would be gratefully received.

I've had the endo scratch. It was absolutely fine. I mean, I could feel the tubing as it passed through my cervix but it was very mild. Then again, before I went for my HSG, I told myself that 'I want a baby to come out and that pain is going to be much worse, so I can do this'. Afterwards, the nurse told me that I handled the procedure better than any patient she's ever seen. So perhaps this attitude helps with my scratch as well. But the scratch truly was no where near as uncomfortable as the HSG, and I hope you find it fine also.

Wish we were cycling at the same time as it would be nice to have you with your ovaries also 'on the lower side of normal' cycle along side me so I don't feel so abnormal for the few eggs I produce while women on the IVF threads on here make more. Quantity over quality eh. Okay IVF cycle... here I go...

I found with my HSG that it was the waiting for the brief pain that was worse as it made me jump! I think if we we've been through that, smears plus IUIs I can cope with anything!

I will be rooting for you Shell cheering on every quality precious egg you produce!

Yes, I also think the physical pain of some of these procedures pales into insignificance in comparison to the emotional pain of infertility! Thanks so much for your words of kindness and support.

hiya. just checking in to keep you in my actives! had a nice weekend away with family and AF has finally buggered off so will be giving it my all this cycle in hope of a miracle bfp!

shell how's things going? you've started your cycle now yes?

Glad you had a nice weekend lovely lil. My day 2 scan revealed only 7 follicles instead of the usual 15-19 that I have had the previous 4 day 2 scans. So as upsetting as it was to postpone, I did not go ahead with IVF. I changed brands of DHEA as I just buy whatever I find cheap online when I need more, so I am not sure if the current one is not as effective and that's the reason for the sudden follicle decline, or if the decline is age related. I got a script from my Dr for prescription DHEA so I will collect that this Friday which will be cycle day 8 and start taking it. But I am not sure if 3 weeks of it will be enough time for it to kick in so I can start IVF next cycle with more follicles. On the other hand, I don't want to wait as I am about to turn 38 in 6 weeks and I just feel more depressed as that gets closer. So I don't know what to do!

oh shell what a nightmare! hopefully the new dhea will work magic for you in the next three weeks, god you deserve a bloody miracle about now after all you've been through. what has dh said? any improvement on his side with making changes?

Lil I too am waiting for a natural miracle before starting IVF next cycle, we can always hope! AF due 4th June which is taking forever. Knowing we have IVF as a back did take the pressure off dtd this month (moreso for DH performance issues). Will you be doing IVF same time as me then if no success this month?

Shell Absolutely gutted for you about your eggs. Fingers crossed the new DHEA will get into your system in 3 weeks to have a significant impact. You couldn't write what you've been through so as Lil says you are well overdue a break from all this crap!

I think if I only have 7 follicles (which is looking more likely) I'm just going to go ahead and see what happens. Time is not on my side and also I have no comparative IVF cycles to look at. If my eggs are not quality enough, DH and I have discussed the option of going to Spain for egg donation but will cross that bridge when we come to it.

In all my dramas Nonconformist, you will have to refresh my memory with your saga. What indicates that only 7 follicles is looking more than likely? And is it rude to ask how old you are? I am about to turn 38 and I too am really feeling the pressure of time so I understand what you're saying.

By the way, I would be happy with 7 mature follicles. But I had 7 antral follicles on day 2 of which they say about half respond so that would give me 3 mature eggs. If money were no issue, I would do this cycle after cycle and be preggers by now. But when it costs $7,000 a pop, I just want one cycle where I have a decent chance.

lil, DH's sperm test did show significant improvement. Kinda good, but in another way more depressing as it does make me feel like now the issue is more me and my low follicle count confirms my low fertility.

Still, despite this, I'm having one more crack. Like you Non, I am thinking I'll have to go ahead next cycle regardless. My eggs are only getting worse as I age.

I think between us guys on this thread, we could make a fortune with an infertility survival guide book. We could write a couple of chapters each to fund all this crap.

think I'll be a bit behind you non as I'm long protocol and start bcp in July, with ec around 7/9. have taken soy this month to try and get ovulation going a bit earlier as my next cycle is due to end on last possible date to get AF to start bcp. and as I'm not regular late ov on either this or next cycle could bugger it all up. I think I'd just go on bcp next cycle instead but would like to get that last go in naturally if I can. of course the soy could fuck everything up and send AF packing for longer but I don't feel too bad about delaying the ivf a month or so if I have to as I'm only 30 and it did work last time from an ivf point of view. its all so bloody frustrating isn't it. its good you and your dh are on same page about donated eggs. dh was completely against donor sperm when we discussed it (thankfully the vit c seems to have made this a non issue now) and he's not keen on adoption either. it shouldn't be this hard!

x posted shell )got interrupted when I was posting!) that's good that there is an improvement for dh. it doesn't mean its your low fertility being the only issue, it means this last go has a better chance because he has improved his side. stay positive.

as for the book. I'm planning to create a website!

Sorry Shell think I've got myself in a muddle over follicles. My cd5 antral follicle count was 9, so maybe only 4 mature eggs are likely?? I'm 35 so aware of getting rounds of IVF in before nearing to 40. How old we're you when you started your first round? Obviously I'm concerned that my antral follicle count will drop even more over time therefore reducing the odds even more, aaaarrrgggggg!!!

Lil Funny how DH and I are ok about donated eggs but have said no to adoption. My best friend has recently adopted on her own and has put me right off! I wonder why I was never offered bcp?

Close family and friends are starting to ask about what the treatment involves and I can't be arsed going into detail about it. I want to tell them to google it but instead show them the complex timeline flow chart the clinic gave me and that just shuts them up. I know I should be grateful they're taking an interest but have enough details to get my head round.

Book and website sound great, sign me up!

A website truly is a great idea lil. I seriously thought about that in times past, but I tried to look into how to set one up and as that is not up my ally, it seemed difficult.

I think I've become a glass half empty person after so many IVF disasters. But you are right about hubbys sperm. I shouldn't view it that this means I must be at fault. It means my last IVF has an improved chance. Now I just need one good egg. I hope the same applies to you. Your husbands sperm has improved and you are only 30 so you have even better odds.

Non, I had just turned 34 when I started trying for this baby and was 35 and a 1/2 when I started first IVF round. Okay, so our follicle counts are about the same. Makes me feel like a poor egg producer when I see others on here get 10-15 eggs while the max I ever got was 5. Will be nice if we go through IVF around the same time being in similar situation. It does sound nice that your friends and family are interested and asking questions, but I can imagine it being frustrating having to explain different medications and what each one does to people who have no idea about them. I've chosen not to tell anyone about my upcoming IVF. I wouldn't even tell hubby if he didn't have to provide his sample! Knowing this is the last I can afford, I feel enough pressure on myself for it to work. I just don't need any extra pressure of having to report back to people about how things are progressing.

my hubby is a web developer shell so I have in house expertise!
try not to focus on the bad stuff, focus on what you can do, not what you can't. how's the eating plan going?

The eating is going very very well lil. At first, I was weighing everything and entering every calorie into a website to know my percentages. It gave me an idea of what I need to eat and now I just wing it. But perhaps I'll record things again tomorrow now you mention it just to make sure I am still on track. At least I can remember the study that says this diet gives me an 80% success and feel some positivity towards my next cycle. I'm also reading a book about the power of the mind through IVF and listening to my IVF hypnotherapy CD on my way to work. It's no magic cure but it really does help me be more positive.

I need to get my ivf CD out again too. its funding the time though. diet not been good here but trying to get back on track now. not 100% successful but its a start. turned down scones with jam and cream in favour of meringue with fruit and Greek yoghurt tonight! have started swimming again once a week though so at least that's an improvement!

Mmm,I have some cream left over from a cake I made for a party and I was just thinking of scones last night too! I managed to resist but the cream is still sitting in the fridge waiting to tempt me when I have another weak moment...

Yes, time is difficult! My CD says to lie down and close your eyes and relax while listening to the CD, but doing that regularly is difficult. So I just listen on my way to work. Would that work for you? I find it's still helpful and calming. Instead of focusing on the traffic and getting to work on time, it makes me enjoy the trees and morning sunlight and the words still make me more positive.

Can I ask which IVF CD you have and if you find it helpful? Mine is good but but I tend to tune out at times because I've heard it so much so a change might be good.

I wfh shell so the commute is quite short! lol. I have the Zita west one but I'm not sure it would be any good in the car. you're supposed to close your eyes and make a heart shape with tour hands under your belly button and I always go into some sort of trance like state with it. its about 25mins long, and there are 3 different ones for pre ec, just after ec and tww.

Mmm - the drive to work suggestion definitely won't work for you then lil!

Sounds like you're quite easily able to get into that hypnotic state for the CD to do it's relaxing thing. I don't seem to go into a trance and find my mind wanders. The CD says not to listen while operating machinery, but as I fail at hypnotherapy, it seems fine for me. I paid just a few dollars to download a five minute one that I'd forgotten all about until now. Will have to find that in amongst my emails as I found it really good and it's easier to find 5 minutes. Can email it to you too if time is an issue and you think that might be helpful for your next IVF (or the miracle natural conception you are going to get before your next IVF cycle!)

After you mentioned my diet, I entered my food into the website today. Amazed that despite my daily intake being:

• Breakfast - Protein shake
• Morning tea - Walnuts
• Lunch - Tin of tuna
• Dinner - Fish, chilli and quinoa

and feeling like I've done every meal high protein low carb, I am still at 43% carbs and not under the 40% limit as per the study to give me an 80% success rate.

Geepers, I probably haven't been as good as I think I have these last few weeks then. Glad you mentioned it! I'll keep monitoring my food. Want to give this last IVF I can afford my very best.

Actually, delete that line 'I want to give it my best'. Change it to 'I want it to work'!

doesn't hurt to check shell but don't get too bogged down with it. email would be great, I'll pm you.

about to have sausage pasta with a store bought sauce - So not great diet wise! going to try step it up next week!

Shell, I'm doing the whole careful(ish - I cheat a bit occasionally) diet thing at the moment, and I'm finding that the key to keeping my carbs low enough and protein high enough is partly not to worry about how much fat that leaves me eating. (And interestingly, by doing that I'm losing weight - I'm trying to shed a few pounds as well - faster than I normally would on the same number of calories).