Anyone starting IVF soon? Join me (2)

[purplemeggie]

I see we've filled up the thread and thought I'd better start another one. How's everyone doing?

Using the dairy as a guilt free way to eat ice cream - that sounds good second. Whatever helps you keep sane through an IVF cycle - I say do it! You must be so relieved that both embryos made it to be transferred back. Do they give any specifics on the number of cells of each embryo and the grading or do they just say one poor and one okay quality?

Is this your first IVF luci? Do you have any idea how well you will respond to stims? I have to wait this cycle out, then start estrogen on day 21 of following cycle before IVF the cycle after that. It feels such a way away. Wish I was where you are and getting started. The waiting is a killer.

In my efforts to use this waiting time wisely, I did a yoga class yesterday. Actually quite tough! Not just a few gentle stretches like I used to think yoga was. blue, you are my new inspiration. You jog, do yoga, avoid dairy and had a whopping amount of your embryos make it to blast. So I'm following suit.

Yes this is my first ivf so I have no idea how I respond to anything. We shall find out in a couple of weeks I guess. I know what you mean about the waiting, we decided a few months ago to go ahead but as we are going abroad we had to wait until we had more holidays from work and it has gone so slowly. Glad we are nearly there now though. Hope time goes quickly for you.

Yes, time goes glacial slow when you are counting down to the IVF start date doesn't it! I've done this before but this is the last IVF I can afford so really trying to use the time wisely by eating perfect and exercising. Still going slow though! Is it rude to ask your age? That seems to generally give an idea as to response but I am nearly 38 and a poor responder while others are older than me and get much more eggs so who knows. So you'll go there to obtain the medicine for stimming and stay there until after the transfer luci?

I am 35, I have a low AMH of 7.3 but fsh is fine around 7. My gp doesn't think much of the AMH test and tells me that she thinks I am fine and it's the fact that DH has low motility that could be slowing things down but I think it's probably in part my age as well as its bound to take longer.

I have had all the medication shipped over already so I'm good to go with that. I won't go over to Czech until cd12. Egg collection should then be cd13 or 14. Stay there another 5 days until hopefully some reach blast, have them transferred back and home the next day. Should be 7 or 8 days altogether.

Good luck with the diet and exercising. I really hope it works out for you this time.

Hi ladies, happy easter! Been away for a few days and there has been lots of activity on here. Sunrise great news that both eggs fertilised. I hope the transfer went ok, now the waiting begins.

Shellster I'm pleased you're enjoying the yoga. I love it and I really think it helps blood flow to the ovaries. I agree with you about the milk thing... I haven't seen any evidence one way or the other. Milk doesn't really agree with me so I keep it to a minimum. Lucie you should do whatever feels right for you. Welcome to the wacky IVF world of being given conflicting advice and pseudoscience!

Everything is good with me so far, just sniffing the Synarel at the moment. Purple glad you're enjoying your holiday, definitely the best place to be when you've had some bad news x

Hi there blue, I'm not sure what evidence there would be about milk. I think it's just a quick and easy way to ensure that you get all the different proteins you need in one go which is why it's recommended. That's all it is really.

There are other ways to get the proteins by combining different things like shell just not as easy as the milk as I imagine you would have to determine how much of the different amino acids they contain to ensure you get enough.

Good luck SecondSunrise.

That's very interesting about the milk Lucie. It can't hurt to try it.

How much should you drink per day?

I think 1 litre a day of full fat milk is recommended but it is quite a lot! It would give you about 35g of protein though which is about half of your recommended daily amount for ivf. I will probably try to have a pint in the morning and one in the evening and not worry too much about other protein then as I think I would cover 35g fairly easily through my other meals, nuts, seeds etc.

Iam hoping AF arrives early this month, I'm not expecting it till Sunday or later but I've occasionally had the odd 30-35 day cycle and I'd love that this month so I can get started.
I've been drinking chocolate milk as don't really like the taste of normal milk so have been alternating the two

Evening all, hope you had a relaxing weekend in the sunshine. It was so lovely today.

I totally recommend Mindfulness as a way of staying calm. I read the Danny Williams book and have the CD loaded onto my iPod - for months I listened before going to sleep each night. Now I'm a bit better at just taking moments in my day to notice what's going on inside and out, and just chilling.

I'm looking forward to all this milk and ice cream. Sounds good to me.

I have my down reg scan tomorrow. Eeek! Any advice? Anything to look out for / ask?

Positive thoughts to all x

luci I had a low AMH of 2.5 back when I was 34 and I am now close to 38. So 7.3 doesn't sound that low to me. So do you have any scans to monitor your response to meds before you travel to clinic or do you have your first scan in Czech on CD12?

Yes blue, I too have not seen any evidence for milk and IVF.

1L milk has 33.2g protein but it also comes with 2692kj and 23.2g saturated fat. Instead, I can have 250g basa fish with dinner to get 35.8g protein, with only 710kj and 1.2g saturated fat. Because I am wanting to lose weight, I think I'll stick to the fish for protein and eat nearly 2000 less kj per day. How long do you have to do this sniffing business for and what's the next step after that?

waiting, I so understand wanting your cycle to be of your shorter ones so you can get started. Looking forward to following your journey - and everyone else on here - to keep me sane while I still have to count down 7 weeks until I can get started.

Hope all is well at your scan cat and you can get started. I think it's probably a good thing you don't have lots of questions to ask. Having had 10 attempts at IVF and having read every study, I want to know every detail such as my follicle numbers and sizes and my estrogen levels, then I hit panic mode when one thing isn't as perfect as it should be. So better to stay your calm zen mindfulness self and not panic yourself by asking for answers to questions that you can obsessively google - remind me to follow my own advice when its my turn!

Shellster that's exactly the reason I didn't ask too many specifics about the embryos! I know one of the embryos had a small amount of fragmentation and was three cells and the other was looking uneven. I can't change anything at this stage, it's down to luck. However many I had and whatever grade they were there is always something that can have been better; I have what I have and that's all I can do now.

Blackandwhite how does Mindfullness work? I am interested in it but don't really know how you put it into practise each day.

Any side effects blue?

Welcome lucieloos.

How is everyone else doing?

Hi Shell, I have 2 scans booked next week at my local clinic and I shall then pass the results onto the one in Prague and they can tell me if I need to adjust my medication at all. I could have had the scans done in Prague but I would prefer to take less time off work so have chosen to have them done locally.

That's the only thing with the milk is the calories but I have just adjusted my diet in other areas to make allowance for it so I have a pint of milk for breakfast which I find really fills me up and sometimes I will have something small like half a grapefruit. Something light for lunch to include protein and then meat or fish with veg/salad for dinner. I am using my fitness pal to keep track of calories etc and am finding it quite easy so far to keep within my allowance.

My local clinic told me that my AMH is low for my age and the research I did also confirmed this but I then saw my gp who said she doesn't like that particular test and she has seen women with lower amhs get pregnant naturally and I have too so I'm not sure really.

I've decided that AMH is probably not worth worrying about. According to Professor Blue (ie, me), I've seen women with high AMHs have unsuccessful IVF cycles and women with low AMHs make it work it first time. There seems to be no rhyme or reason to it. All the AMH number does is make women worry. Is it too low? Is it too high? Has it changed in the last 6 months, 6 weeks, 6 days? Therefore I am declaring it useless

Shellster sounds like you've got a good protein plan going. Personally I am with you on the milk thing - cow's milk is hard for the body to digest, produces unnecessary mucus and contains hormones. It just ain't for me. On the other hand I love fish, nuts and beans so I'm probably ok. I don't count dietary grams/Kjs/calories so I'm not sure about that side of things...I use the waistband of my jeans to give me the bad news. It sounds like you're certainly on track to lose a bit of weight, good for you.

I haven't had any side effects from the Synarel spray aside from feeling hot (again...I remember this from the last time I downregged). AF is due tomorrow although it doesn't feel like it's on its way. Once AF arrives I'll go for a scan and start the oestrogen tablets. I think the FET will happen on day 21 of the cycle, so hopefully at the end of the month. Quite weird not to be stimming although I'm definitely enjoying the break from syringes and chemicals.

Sunrise have you started obsessively 'symptom' spotting yet?!

Yes my AMH 4 years ago was around 2.5 too. I think it can be a useful indicator in conjunction with other tests but you will only know how you will respond to drugs and treatments when you start them a lot of the time. And one month may vary a lot from another. Glad you're not feeling too bad ProfBlue. It's nice not doing any injections, although if I do get a positive I will have heparin injections.

No symptom spotting - they haven't even had chance to implant yet! Give me a week and I'm sure I'll be an absolute raving loon.

Is there anything else (as well as the milk!) that is recommended? That is quite a lot of milk but if it helps it's worth it.

Evening folks. My scan went well this morning, nurse said my ovaries were "nice and quiet" so I start injections tomorrow (gonal f). Looking forward to being on single sniffs of synarel, I have been so dehydrated despite drinking pints and pints of water.

Sunrise you sound amazingly calm, I'm not even sure you need mindfulness . I really recommend the book by Mark Williams/Danny Penman, it also comes with a CD of meditation tracks. I would also recommend reading The Happiness Hypothesis by Jonathan Haidt. The key concept I got from both, is that we have two parts to our brain - the older, animal, instinctive part, and the human, reasoning, thinking part. The two parts are often in conflict, and, particularly, when we are stressed, the thinking part takes over and "overthinks" everything, desperate to find a solution. Mindfulness for me is about re-engaging the instinctive "being" part of the brain and making the "thinking" part chill out. Meditation definitely helps, but during the day I try to find moments to concentrate on what I can see/hear/feel e.g. A bird hopping across the path, a plane going past, or even just the sensation of anger when someone has upset me, or the smooth surface of my desk. Sounds weird? I find it helps me to feel more in control, and to trust that things will turn out ok, that I don't need to "fix" things all the time. I also call it "stopping for a moment and actually living".

ProfBlue (sounds like a Cluedo character!) I wish you were my doctor. You are so organised and reasoned. My clinic still appear to be disorganised - I waited an hour for my scan this morning, and then a doctor called me in, didn't seem to know much about my case, like he'd just been handed my notes. I pointed out that I as there for my down reg scan and so he put me back out into the waiting room until a nurse as ready. No clue. How will these people ever use the right procedures or choose the correct embryos? Fortunately the nurse was totally organised... (And then I stepped outside and felt the sun on my face and took a deep, mindful breath!)

Please don't tell me any more about the calorific effects of milk - I had totally decided to pig out for the next two weeks on full-fat yoghurt, milk, ice cream.... Mind you, I lost some weight last week thanks to the flu so I can afford to put a bit back on.

Welcome Osirus and lucie. I think green leafy vegetables and pineapple are also high on the list. Gotta love a bit of pineapple (or sixty) in (hopefully) implantation week. Will full-fat ice cream of course. I have not done any reading on these - just adding in every fad to my diet .

blue my strongest hot flushes seem to come in the early morning -I suppose that's when I'm most dehydrated. How about you?

I started a paper delivery as a method of forcing me to exercise. Did first delivery over yesterday and today and walked 2 1/2 hours all up - carrying newspapers. That outta get the circulation going and hopefully help for my last IVF. Also a good distraction as delivering papers after my regular job means I've been too busy to be on here the last two days. Bed time for me now so I will check in tomorrow when I have time to properly read what's been going on since I last posted and reply to you all tomorrow.

Good for you Shellster - sounds like good exercise and extra money too. I had a paper round when I was about 14... the Sunday papers were so heavy I couldn't carry them so my mum used to give me a lift in the car

Cat I haven't been particularly thirsty, just a bit hot. I drink loads of water anyway - a year's worth of infertility treatment turns you into a water/wee machine. I reckon I drink at least 3 litres a day (and go to the loo about 15 times a day...)

Hey ladies, back from hols, standing on the platform waiting for the rollercoaster to come round so I can jump back on....

I'm another fan of the Mindfulness book...having been utterly miserable about my infertility, I read it last year and pretty much decided that I was going to be happy instead. And amazingly, although I'm a year down the line and have spent more money than I like to think about chasing an elusive baby, a sibling for my ds, I am actually far happier than I was last year - and for the past five years in fact. I'm enjoying my lovely son's childhood instead of wasting it regretting that I can't give him the sibling that he wants. I can't control that, but I can choose to give him a smiley, fun mummy...

So - I've got my protocol for the FET. No down-reg this time (boo!) - start stims after my next natural period, which I'm expecting to be around 1st May, so expecting ET around third week.

How's it going, Sunrise?

Good luck with the stims, Cat.

Osiris - I used to have a chart and tick off my litre of milk and my two litres of water every day.

Good thinking with the paper delivery Shellster - hope it's a nice place to walk and you get some birdsong and trees with your exercise .

How are you doing, Blue? I think I might be adopting ProfBlue - suits you .

I've decided to reintroduce yoga into the mix, too. I'm going to treat myself to some one to one sessions...it's going to end up costing me about the same as my acupuncture. Not much point in that (no pun intended) with the DE cycle, since I'm not cooking the eggs and I can't have the recommended treatments either side of transfer because of travelling to and from Prague. I tried to find a local class that fitted in around work and Mr Purple's current odd working hours and I haven't found anything, so I'm going to do some individual sessions with the lovely lady who teaches yoga at ds' school. Oh, and the open water swimming season has started.

second, you sound like you've got the right attitude. IVF is exactly as you say - there is always something that could be better and we would always like more eggs or more perfect embryos. That being said, 3 cells doesn't sound to shabby to me. They say a standard day 2 embryo is 4 cells but you still have plenty of time after transfer for it to divide one more time inside you and be on schedule as a great day 2 embie.

luci, did you arrange your first two scans with your local clinic, or does the Czech clinic have some affiliation with them? Yeah, your AMH is low for your age - I just meant it doesn't seem low to me compared to my measly 2.5. Because AMH is secreted by the antral follicles on our ovaries, it gives a rough guide as to how many are there and I have noticed over time on these threads, that women seem to have ROUGHLY one follicle per .5 AMH. Then they say ROUGHLY 1/2 will mature with IVF meds. So I am just being impatient and getting a glimpse into how I think you will respond. But you and profblue are right, if one woman starts a cycle with 40 follicles producing an AMH of 20, and another only 4 follicles ad an AMH of 2, each womans body is still only going to choose the strongest one follicle to ovulate, so it has no bearing on the chances of natural conception.

Glad you're not having any Synarel side effect blue. Gave me an awful headache. Any sign of your period yet? I am curious as to why everyone seems to down reg and then thicken lining artificially with estrogen for an FET as opposed to transferring the embryo at 5 days after ovulation of a natural cycle. Did your Dr say why? I don't doubt that this must be best since it seems common practice. Just don't get why and wondering if your Dr gave a reason.

cat, didn't mean to depress you with milk calorie content. Forget the scales and enjoy your dairy - ice cream in particular for some 'feel-good' effect as well as dairy for IVF! The most important thing is to do what you feel is right to up your chances of a baby at the end of this and we would all happily wear an extra few grams as a trade off for being pregnant.

purple, curious that you do stims even during a natural FET cycle. What meds will that be? Is it just to thicken your lining.

Oh and blue, can I ask what yoga you do?
Do you attend a class?
Is it a special fertility yoga class?
Or do you just do yoga poses at home.

I've got one yoga DVD, but it's not for fertility in particular.
Planning to do that when I have time and then just doing a few extra fertility poses at home as well. Is the same DVD over and over okay or should I be varying it up?

Shell, well done on you paper round, that's sounds like a brilliant way to exercise and earn some extra cash!

Wow I think you might be right with your theory of 0.5amh to each follicle. I had my follicles counted last year when I had a scan as part of my investigations to check everything was ok in there. I think they counted around 13 or 14 which would tie in with your theory. I hope they haven't decreased too much since. Do the drugs help produce anymore follicles?

I arranged the scans myself at my local clinic. It only involved ringing them up and booking them in. It's only 10 minutes from where I work so very convenient.