8 year old girl admits lying about rape allegations

[FlyMeToDunoon]

I felt really sad about this for more than one reason.
here

It shouldn't be used in that way no. But it is an isolated case where the girl was believed

I asked a question as to why you were saying you weren't a 'woman like me'. You never answered. I have posed a question to you, that maybe the arguments you use serve no purpose and counterintuitively stop the argument from progressing.

I am in denial about no part of media coverage. Its just I expect nothing less. The media constantly report in a sexist manner about almost every subject.......I can't change that by putting myself in victim mode, I will achieve even less.

The outrage by the media can be trumped by the fact that the girl got justice......other victims may feel they can report the crime and get justice - but you can't second guess how they feel as much as I can't. Each victim is unique.

And if I were that 8 year old girl, I would feel justice had been done - maybe not today but at some point in my future. The alternative would be much much worse.

"You'd have to be a completely insensitive twit to be calling it a victory"

You don't know, but maybe the victim's mother feels some justice has been served. Maybe the girl herself.

You continue to reinforce your own stereotype

I thought that this was a fairly decent article www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/joan-smith/joan-smith-when-is-a-child-not-a-child-1982689 .html

Personally I'd like to see children's criminal cases managed in a completely different way, but the difference between the reporting on this and the "string 'em up" and call them evil reporting of the Edrington cases is extraordinary. Not so much because of the way that the attackers have been treated, but the total difference in how the victims experiences have been reported. No one suggested that the two boys might have been asking to be attacked or that that was a "game that had gone wrong".

I have a just tuned 11 year old ds and a 9 year old dd. I would never assume that my dd was lying if she said that my ds had done something unpleasant to her (or vice versa for that matter), but the assumption here is that of course young girls lie and slightly older boys don't. Why not? If children lie (and they do) then it is just as possible the boys lied as the girl did.

As for the doctors and nurses crap, what century are these people living in? Firstly many doctors are women now, so that's a pretty stupid analogy, secondly where on earth does the idea that doctors and nurses are busy showing each other their genitals? and thirdly this is just not the sort of game that children play. Generally 10 year old boys don't play much with younger girls (or any girls for that matter) and if they do, then a real game (as opposed to a totally made up cover for bullying) would be more likely to be based on something the boys were actually interested in (Pokemon, or Halo or general fighting type games would be much more likely). A 10 year old should be perfectly aware that stealing little girls stuff and backing them into a corner with your mate is not a game, and surely as adults we ought to know this too?

Poor little girl. What a horrible experience followed by no doubt a horrible stressful time in court and then all this crap. I hope no one ever shows it to her until she is able to cope with what the world is saying about her, despite the fact that those who have actually seen and heard the evidence have decided that yes she was indeed assaulted.

Just a couple of quick points.

This is not a "victory" by anyone's standards and to view it as such is just horrible. Something has gone horribly wrong for all of these children and I hope they receive the support they need to recover from all of this.

Re it being a "victory" as opposed to looking at the press reports. Someone who was assaulted at a tender age, on this thread, has said that as a child seeing the media response it would confirm in their mind that they should definitely not report their abuse. I don't think the affect of the media should be underestimated here.

As for shouting at Dittany as if she is a lone voice - there are quite a few people on this thread who are disgusted by the media response - it is not an extreme or baffling reaction at all. or an "anti-feminist" one.

The thing about the girl probably enjoyed the assault - matthew wright said it on his show this morning, amongst other things.

What I have read in the press has been some debate about should it have gone to court, can children understand etc. But mainly it has been assertion after assertion that this was an innocent childish game, and nothing more, and for that reason it should never have been prosecuted - in the sense that no action should have been taken at all.

One of my friends was sexually abused over a period of 3 years from the time she was 9 years old by her brother who is two years older. And that was 35 years ago.

So to say that children of this age are not capable of sexual assault is absolutely offensive.

Interesting articles from ISNT and Nooka.
I still need more info though. factual data. The info theat the giel originally gave, is considered to be upheld. And of course I believe her and thus is the facts from that, thta I really want to see. and details of court transcript , so that i can see what was actually said. but i think i am expecting too much.
saddened to see that teh papaers are now playing this down as normal drs and nurses, showing our bits stuff. when it was claearly more than that.
like others have said, they seem to be missing the point that the boys were actually found guilty.

Daily Mail back on its usual form today - Bel Mooney here

(apologies if anyone has already linked to this, now I'll go and read the rest of the posts since I switched off last night.)

From the independent article and I have seen it elsewhere

"What is truly amazing about this case, however, is that there seems to have been little dispute in court about whether the girl was sexually assaulted. During legal argument which took place in the absence of the jury, one of the defence barristers admitted to the judge that "there is evidence of sexual assault and we do not dispute that"."

The older boy would also have pled guilty to a lesser charge of sexual assault if the prosecutors had agreed.

I don't think there can be any doubt that what these boys did was more than an innocent game. Much more.

OMFG that mail piece

"But she actually seems to have been a more or less willing participant and, indeed, changed her account of what happened during the trial, exonerating the boys of rape."

What the Fuck? How can anyone be arguing that this is right? I am so so so angry about this.

"I'm no expert, but it seems to me that the Scottish system is a great improvement on our own. Children under 16 are only considered for prosecution in court for serious offences such as murder and assault which puts a life in danger."

Rape is not a serious offence????

"Of course the children's behaviour has to be kept in perspective. Was this normal sexual curiosity - or the kind of sexual violation which ought to be prosecuted? Was it childish, sniggering, naughty impulse - or chilling premeditation?

The answer to both questions is obvious. Criminalising these boys must, by implication, point the finger at untold numbers of little pre-pubertal lads (and lasses) who are filled with curiosity about the 'bits' of the opposite sex and indeed their own"

WHAT? The answer is obvious? Was she in the court? For fucks sake.

"Nobody can deny that what is considered 'normal' shifts according to external influences. Children might have been curious about sex for ever, but the way that they demonstrate that - and the age they start - will be influenced by what they see and hear in the world around them.

The widespread 'pornografication' of this society means that young children today are more sexually knowing than ever before."

So it is NORMAL for boys to rape/attempt to rape girls???

"It occurred to me that the very people most likely to mob the house of a suspected paedophile, or (as has happened) terrorise a child placed on the Sex Offenders' Register are also those most likely to allow their daughter to look like an infant hooker and take them to a gig suitable only for adults."

It is the fault of the GIRLS if boys or adult men sexually assualt them? Due the the way they are DRESSED???

Lady blablah I am very pleased that you think all this is just fine and dandy.

I, on teh other hand, am fluctuating between wanting to cry and wanting to punch something. The media response to this is UTTERLY SICKENING and I will happily fight anyone who says it isn't.

Gosh just reading the comments in response to that article and she is getting slated.

Maybe there is some hope after all.

What I don't understand is, don't we have libel laws? I mean, the boys have been found guilty. So how is it all right for these bizarre claims about the girl to be all over the newspapers? If you were raped and secured the conviction and yet the papers were writing about you like this wouldn't you have some legal redress? Does anyone know?

Sorry Len. I couldn't help myself

Sample comment:

"Is the Daily Mail now condoning rape ?"