8 year old girl admits lying about rape allegations

[FlyMeToDunoon]

I felt really sad about this for more than one reason.
here

Right I see LeninGrad. In the press it does seem to be weighted very heavily in favour of the boys and innocence. I think maybe nobody wants to believe boys of to can do something like this.

I thought though the jury found them guilty of statutory rape (not sure if they used that term) as she was too young to consent. It's very hard to debate such a thing when all the details are not out in the open. I do however believe that some 10 yo's are capable of such an act.

I don't think it's all the fault of porn (although seriously even if you type in por you'll get 1000's of pornographic websites). I remember talking to a boy when I was younger who said he learnt about sex from his older brother who used to sleep with his girlfriend on the bottom bunk . Older siblings often (not in an sexual abuse type way) introduce sexual activities to their younger siblings, whether purposefully or not. (when I say purposefully I again mean not abusively but in an "I don't care who sees" manner).

FFS several posters are saying that they played 'show me yours' type games as younger children with no harm done and there is a huge and clear contrast between that and the posters saying that they were assaulted as children.

OK in the current climate of hysteria and fear around chldren and sexuality, it's possible that an overprotective parent or bystander could have called the police on (a differenent, hypothetical group of0 children playing a harmless sexually exploratory game but for this case to have been prosecuted and LED TO A CONVICTION makes it clear that this was an assault, that the victim was hurt and scared - remember that a key fact is, another child told the victim's mum that the little girl was being 'hurt' by older boys.
COmpassion for the perpetrators doesn't have to include or involve demonizing the victim, or the police, or the verdict.

Well said SGB.

songbird this statutory rape business

I have seen it in the papers too, saying that it was statutory rape, so there had to be no consideration of whether the girl was consenting or not

However what I have read is that the girl was threatened, forced to remove her underwear, she was assaulted.

This is not a case where males have been found guilty on a "technicality", they have been found guilty of attempted rape as you or I would understand it. ie they tried to rape her.

I have no idea why the media are so hell-bent on minimising this.

I was shocked by LynetteScarvo's posts. I thought she was in denial. I don't understand her view. But maybe she has info that we haven't been told ? I still feel like none of know much about what has really gone on. why are we not being told the core details ?

I understand now ISNT if that's the case then it seems as though the right verdict was reached. I just hope as sgm says all four of them get the support that is so clearly needed after this.

How weird.

I've nto looked at the DM for fear of what it might say.

What it says (in 2 pieces) is about the most balanced stuff I have read about this case.

here

Interestinly it says that the older boy would have pled guilty to a lesser charge of sexual assault. Not something he would have done if he's been playing drs and nurses, I assume.

Everything is reversed today, the liberal/impartial press minimising what has happened and saying the boys did nothing wrong, the usually hysterical press giving the more measured response and actually poitning out that the boys have been found guilty.

maybe all the journalists are on a job-swap today.

haven't read the DM pieces yet but maybe it's because it fits with the DM 'we're all going to hell in a handbasket' world view and the liberal press going 'Let's be cool about sex'? I can imagine the DM being more inadvertently feminist about porn, lapdancing clubs etc - not sure if that's the case.

Oblomove...I really can't see what is shocking about my posts, but yes I have considered whether I'm in denial. I have an 11 year old DS, and the thought that these boys are the same age as him is just so for me.

FWW it's worth, DH doesn't share my views, and think 10 year old boys could indeed be capable of this.

I meant Oblomov

How are we supposed to teach our children that they own their bodies and if someone is touching them or making them do things they don't want to do, it is not okay and they must tell a grown up who will help them when this little girl has done just that and been absolutely vilified by media. She got a conviction but she may as well not have done. It's basically saying to girls that their bodies are boys' playthings

Oh and by the way re MW - he's atoning because he was the one that shopped John Leslie to the media by 'accidentally' mentioning his name on one of his programmes.

You're completely right LB.

The argument being put forward that we allow and justify rape is being undermined by the fact that in this case the courts convicted the boys.

Fair enough the commentators are questioning the conviction, but a little faith (for once) that the justice system convicted may be fairer - they did not say it was OK to attempt to rape an 8 year old girl

Yes ladyblahblah the judge particularly seems to have been really good

The reaction of the media has been dire though

Reading this thread you would think they had been set free with a pat on the back. I don't like that because it makes an easy argument for sad commentators to perpetuate that 'feminists' are hysterical and deluded etc etc.

I think the courts sent a very strong message, and I for one, think that is positive. Although I am still unsure about the age of the boys, and their responsibility etc.

We need to completely review the way we deal with children committing serious crimes in this country.

We can't deny that it happens, we as a society need to work out a) what, if anything, we can do to stop it and b) how we investigate and then 'reprimand' the perpetrators in an appropriate manner.

All I can personally say is that this case has confirmed for me all the fears I had at the time about telling anyone and why I said nothing.

But it is not true to say that the boys have got off scott free. They have been demonised too, which imo is as unhelpful

I think the demands for a change in law are concerned with the age of the boys, not the crime.

Age of responsibility is an age old debate, and there is no easy answer.

I generally agree with you about the wider attitudes to rape but I personally think the commentary is more about their age than their crime per se. There was as much outrage about the boys in Doncaster, and there (AFAIK) was no rape involved there - again more of 'outraged of Tunbridge Wells" about the age of responsibility/capability.

I think it is too easy to turn everything into a feminist issue, but sometimes that does not win the argument and infact loses ground. And especially in this case when there was a conviction.

ladyblablah

today I have heard from various media sources

that it was a simple childs game that should never have gone to court
that is was "doctors and nurses" or "you show me yours..." and there's nothing wrong with that and it should never have been prosecuted
that the girl probably enjoyed it
that the girl was certainly a willing participant
that the boys have done nothing wrong
that the CPS is obsessed with trying to convict primary school boys of rape
and on and on and on

I can't read / hear things like that and not comment on it. I just can't.

who has said they got off scott free?